Engine swap/Performance mods in Lancer

nitrous · 18th March 2010, 13:18

OT:

Quote:

Originally Posted by PramodKumar

Have you noticed a lot of swift GTI DOHC heads are available for sale these days?

Thats because people keep the bottom end and don't need the twin-cam head since we already have a 16v head in the esteem engine.

pramodkumar · 18th March 2010, 13:43

Quote:

Originally Posted by nitrous

OT:

Thats because people keep the bottom end and don't need the twin-cam head since we already have a 16v head in the esteem engine.

So you are saying there is no relative power difference between a 16 V head and a DOHC?

Pramod

nitrous · 18th March 2010, 14:24

Quote:

Originally Posted by pramodkumar

So you are saying there is no relative power difference between a 16 V head and a DOHC?

Pramod

Yes and No.
You tell me why there would be a difference with a DOHC and SOHC even if both run 16 valves?

moralfibre · 18th March 2010, 14:35

Let us take the DOHC v/s SOHC comparison to - > .

Delta Wing · 21st March 2010, 22:45

Hey Amey, where have you reached with the transplant? Where did you source the engine from and where are you getting the work done from in Pune? Hope to see you next time in pune meet with the new ride?

Amey · 22nd March 2010, 09:08

Quote:

Originally Posted by Delta Wing

Hey Amey, where have you reached with the transplant? Where did you source the engine from and where are you getting the work done from in Pune? Hope to see you next time in pune meet with the new ride?

Hey,
Work is going on slowly and steadily.Have removed the old engine and gearbox.Faced some problems with the bell housing, sorting that out (Almost done)
I am getting the work done at Tune Up Plus,Baner.
It will be some time before I get it working.Another month or so assuming all parts arrive in time.

Delta Wing · 22nd March 2010, 10:33

Quote:

Originally Posted by Amey

Hey,
Another month or so assuming all parts arrive in time.

Cheers.

Could you post some photos of the ongoing works?

Amey · 24th March 2010, 19:05

Update :

Few days back or rather last week, we pulled out the existing diesel engine and gearbox to confirm that the gearbox fits the new engine. To our horror, it did not!
Thing is Lancer Diesel and Petrol both had F5M41 gearbox BUT different bell housing. The cedia has F5M42 gearbox which is same as F5M41 with some differences in internal mechanism, basically the body of both the gearboxes is same.
Anyway, so with a non matching bell housing we had reached a road block. So either we needed a petrol lancer bell housing or the entire gearbox. This did dampen our spirits a bit.
After searching a bit, we luckily found a used petrol lancer gearbox for cheap in decent condition, immediately picked it up.

It arrived today afternoon and we immediately tried fitting it and Voila ! it works!
The shaft matches, the 4G94 flywheel,clutch,pressure plate matches!
Now comes the cleaning and overhauling part for the gearbox.
Before that, we will try plonking everything in just to make sure everything fits well.
Once we are sure, we will start chassis strengthening, engine bay painting and so on.
Thats all for now, will keep updating the thread from time to time.

Ford Rocam · 25th March 2010, 02:05

Hi Amey one quick query, Are Gear ratios & final drive (O.E.M) for Petrol lancer & Cedia gearbox are identical? there must be some difference i.m.o.

Amey · 25th March 2010, 08:37

Yes Jeetu, I am aware they are different and both have different models of different Gearboxes too.
The 4G15 comes with F5M41 and Cedia comes with F5M42 box. But you can use the F5M41 box on the 4G94 engine.

Anyway here are the ratios,
Lancer Petrol -
1st - 3.583
2nd - 1.947
3rd - 1.343
4th - 0.976
5th - 0.804
Reverse - 3.416
Final - 4.052

Lancer Cedia -
1st - 3.583
2nd - 1.947
3rd - 1.379
4th - 1.030
5th - 0.767
Reverse - 3.363
Final - 3.722

Interestingly, the diesel and petrol lancer have same ratios except for the final drive. The cedia and diesel lancer final drive ratios are same.

No issues to get the car running, can figure out the drive ratios later on. I have something in mind for that too.

regnex · 25th March 2010, 21:06

Quote:

Originally Posted by Amey

It can be done, I know someone who has done it and can arrange one for you if you want. If you are really keen, let me know, will let you know all the details.

Amey,

great stuff you got going there, love your in-dept research. as always, pramod and the rest are contributing to a great deal too, love this thread.

i myself am keen to get a DOHC for my 1.5, but have no clue where to start, could you share some of your info or PM me the same?

cheers buddy

Amey · 26th March 2010, 09:18

Quote:

Originally Posted by regnex

Amey,

great stuff you got going there, love your in-dept research. as always, pramod and the rest are contributing to a great deal too, love this thread.

i myself am keen to get a DOHC for my 1.5, but have no clue where to start, could you share some of your info or PM me the same?

cheers buddy

Hey,
Thanks man.Its still a long way to go but atleast I have got going.
Anyway I will PM you the details regarding the DOHC conversion thing,its a bolt on thing

pramodkumar · 26th March 2010, 09:27

Quote:

Originally Posted by Amey

Hey,
Thanks man.Its still a long way to go but atleast I have got going.
Anyway I will PM you the details regarding the DOHC conversion thing,its a bolt on thing

Already PMd him

. BTW, can you please post some pics of the WIP?

Pramod

Amey · 26th March 2010, 23:41

@ Pramod,
I work on the car whenever I find time from work buddy,so progress is going to be slow.

Anyways a few updates :

Engine swap/Performance mods in Lancer-img_3511.jpg

Engine swap/Performance mods in Lancer-img_3513.jpg

The engine with the 4G15 Gearbox, perfect fit, Bolt on. 4G94 clutch,flywheel,pressure plate fit well.This means I can use OEM/Performance clutch meant for Cedia.

Then it was time the see if the mounts fit in stock brackets.

We had guessed that the Driver side mount would not work from the diesel engine but still we tried, this is what happened,

Engine swap/Performance mods in Lancer-img_3524.jpg

It didnt align well and the bushing was twisted under pressure. This also caused the cross member holes to mismatch.

So it was pretty evident that new mount was needed. Called the local Mitsu dealer, know the service advisor there well and he said he had one piece in stock.
Since the 4G92,4G93,4G94 belong to the same family, getting 4G93 mount would be possible since it was sold in India in Invex version. As mentioned above, we got one piece from the dealer on approval basis,

After trying,

Engine swap/Performance mods in Lancer-img_3539.jpg

It fits perfectly!
This is the only mount that had us worried.With this mount used, the cross member also aligned perfectly.So basically all four mounts fit well,bolt on!

Then it was time to check the axles,whether they fit (since this is 4G15 gearbox,we sort of knew it would but its best to practically try to install)

Engine swap/Performance mods in Lancer-img_3517.jpg

Engine swap/Performance mods in Lancer-img_3521.jpg

The axles too fit well,correct length, no need to get different ones or alter the existing ones.

Here is the final outcome at the end of the day,

Engine swap/Performance mods in Lancer-img_3542.jpg

Engine swap/Performance mods in Lancer-img_3547.jpg

Engine swap/Performance mods in Lancer-img_3548.jpg

Good progress according to us. Major worry of fabricating new mounts or brackets was taken care of, everything fit perfectly.

Now we can take the next step.

Thats all for now

More as things proceed.

pramodkumar · 28th March 2010, 01:24

Quote:

Originally Posted by Amey

@ Pramod,
I work on the car whenever I find time from work buddy,so progress is going to be slow.

Anyways a few updates :

Thanks for posting the pics, Nice and detailed posts, Looks like my car, its of the same color and moreover the grill is body colored like mine

. BTW one question did you not rebuild the engine?

Pramod

18th March 2010, 14:35	#34
moralfibre Team-BHP Support Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: MH-12 Posts: 8,451 Thanked: 13,971 Times	Let us take the DOHC v/s SOHC comparison to - > .
	() Thanks

21st March 2010, 22:45	#35
Delta Wing BHPian Join Date: Jan 2010 Location: Hyderabad Posts: 228 Thanked: 115 Times	Hey Amey, where have you reached with the transplant? Where did you source the engine from and where are you getting the work done from in Pune? Hope to see you next time in pune meet with the new ride? Last edited by Delta Wing : 21st March 2010 at 22:53.
	() Thanks

24th March 2010, 19:05	#38
Amey BHPian Join Date: Sep 2006 Location: Pune Posts: 679 Thanked: 248 Times View My Garage	Update : Few days back or rather last week, we pulled out the existing diesel engine and gearbox to confirm that the gearbox fits the new engine. To our horror, it did not! Thing is Lancer Diesel and Petrol both had F5M41 gearbox BUT different bell housing. The cedia has F5M42 gearbox which is same as F5M41 with some differences in internal mechanism, basically the body of both the gearboxes is same. Anyway, so with a non matching bell housing we had reached a road block. So either we needed a petrol lancer bell housing or the entire gearbox. This did dampen our spirits a bit. After searching a bit, we luckily found a used petrol lancer gearbox for cheap in decent condition, immediately picked it up. It arrived today afternoon and we immediately tried fitting it and Voila ! it works! The shaft matches, the 4G94 flywheel,clutch,pressure plate matches! Now comes the cleaning and overhauling part for the gearbox. Before that, we will try plonking everything in just to make sure everything fits well. Once we are sure, we will start chassis strengthening, engine bay painting and so on. Thats all for now, will keep updating the thread from time to time.
	() Thanks

25th March 2010, 02:05	#39
Ford Rocam BHPian Join Date: Feb 2005 Location: Mumbai-India Posts: 878 Thanked: 23 Times	Hi Amey one quick query, Are Gear ratios & final drive (O.E.M) for Petrol lancer & Cedia gearbox are identical? there must be some difference i.m.o.
	() Thanks

25th March 2010, 08:37	#40
Amey BHPian Join Date: Sep 2006 Location: Pune Posts: 679 Thanked: 248 Times View My Garage	Yes Jeetu, I am aware they are different and both have different models of different Gearboxes too. The 4G15 comes with F5M41 and Cedia comes with F5M42 box. But you can use the F5M41 box on the 4G94 engine. Anyway here are the ratios, Lancer Petrol - 1st - 3.583 2nd - 1.947 3rd - 1.343 4th - 0.976 5th - 0.804 Reverse - 3.416 Final - 4.052 Lancer Cedia - 1st - 3.583 2nd - 1.947 3rd - 1.379 4th - 1.030 5th - 0.767 Reverse - 3.363 Final - 3.722 Interestingly, the diesel and petrol lancer have same ratios except for the final drive. The cedia and diesel lancer final drive ratios are same. No issues to get the car running, can figure out the drive ratios later on. I have something in mind for that too.
	() Thanks

26th March 2010, 23:41	#44
Amey BHPian Join Date: Sep 2006 Location: Pune Posts: 679 Thanked: 248 Times View My Garage	@ Pramod, I work on the car whenever I find time from work buddy,so progress is going to be slow. Anyways a few updates : The engine with the 4G15 Gearbox, perfect fit, Bolt on. 4G94 clutch,flywheel,pressure plate fit well.This means I can use OEM/Performance clutch meant for Cedia. Then it was time the see if the mounts fit in stock brackets. We had guessed that the Driver side mount would not work from the diesel engine but still we tried, this is what happened, It didnt align well and the bushing was twisted under pressure. This also caused the cross member holes to mismatch. So it was pretty evident that new mount was needed. Called the local Mitsu dealer, know the service advisor there well and he said he had one piece in stock. Since the 4G92,4G93,4G94 belong to the same family, getting 4G93 mount would be possible since it was sold in India in Invex version. As mentioned above, we got one piece from the dealer on approval basis, After trying, It fits perfectly! This is the only mount that had us worried.With this mount used, the cross member also aligned perfectly.So basically all four mounts fit well,bolt on! Then it was time to check the axles,whether they fit (since this is 4G15 gearbox,we sort of knew it would but its best to practically try to install) The axles too fit well,correct length, no need to get different ones or alter the existing ones. Here is the final outcome at the end of the day, Good progress according to us. Major worry of fabricating new mounts or brackets was taken care of, everything fit perfectly. Now we can take the next step. Thats all for now More as things proceed.
	() Thanks