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Old 31st March 2020, 18:05   #16
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Default Re: Ford Endeavour 2.0L Diesel AT : Official Review (with dune bashing)

Exceptional review. Thank you for making my lockdown a bit interesting. I am really disappointed with the 2.0L engine being replaced for a mighty 3.2L engine. This makes no sense at all to me. Is this due to diesel vehicle restrictions in Delhi? or they want to match it with the Alturas G2 & G4 (thanks to Mahindra and Ford JV)?

Jeep Compass, Hector and Harrier all have the 2.0L engine and 170 BHP at cheaper price and even more features (cough Hector).
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Old 31st March 2020, 20:07   #17
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Default Re: Ford Endeavour 2.0L Diesel AT : Official Review (with dune bashing)

Quote:
Originally Posted by ramnaresh_2000 View Post
Exceptional review. Thank you for making my lockdown a bit interesting. I am really disappointed with the 2.0L engine being replaced for a mighty 3.2L engine. This makes no sense at all to me. Is this due to diesel vehicle restrictions in Delhi? or they want to match it with the Alturas G2 & G4 (thanks to Mahindra and Ford JV)?
I don't think there are any restrictions in Delhi for diesel vehicles with respect to engine size. Registration of any diesel vehicle is valid for 10 years though.

Last edited by Sheel : 31st March 2020 at 20:30. Reason: Broken quote tag fixed.
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Old 31st March 2020, 20:16   #18
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Default Re: Ford Endeavour 2.0L Diesel AT : Official Review (with dune bashing)

A very good review. As per review the new Endy weighs more than even 3.2 lit engine earlier version ,which is strange considering no new hardware is added.If it has shed roughly 100 to 200 kg according to smaller engine than performance deficiency would have been less. Moreover what is the reason for not bringing bi turbo version which was eagerly awaited. The logic that it is not BS6 complaint doesn't sound convincing as twin turbo will be always more efficient burner of fuel. Moreover the person spending more than 3 million on a car can easily pay about 50 thousand more which would have been additional cost of that engine.

According to me engine and design are the main things to be considered while buying a car. If these two are good rest of the deficiencies can be overlooked if any.

Last edited by Sandeep500 : 31st March 2020 at 20:19.
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Old 31st March 2020, 22:12   #19
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Default Re: Ford Endeavour 2.0L Diesel AT : Official Review (with dune bashing)

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Originally Posted by karan0009 View Post
I don't think there are any restrictions in Delhi for diesel vehicles with respect to engine size. Registration of any diesel vehicle is valid for 10 years though.
I read it somewhere long back when Delhi started odd-even restriction and 10 years registration restrictions, this is the link I am able to find now. Maybe it was limited period ban.

https://economictimes.indiatimes.com...9.cms?from=mdr
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Old 31st March 2020, 23:01   #20
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Default Re: Ford Endeavour 2.0L Diesel AT : Official Review (with dune bashing)

Quote:
Originally Posted by ramnaresh_2000 View Post
Exceptional review. Thank you for making my lockdown a bit interesting. I am really disappointed with the 2.0L engine being replaced for a mighty 3.2L engine. This makes no sense at all to me. Is this due to diesel vehicle restrictions in Delhi? or they want to match it with the Alturas G2 & G4 (thanks to Mahindra and Ford JV)?

Jeep Compass, Hector and Harrier all have the 2.0L engine and 170 BHP at cheaper price and even more features (cough Hector).
I guess its a choice Ford made looking at the overall diesel engine size regulations (being a bit futuristic) + the fact that its now a trend to move to smaller engines. 170 bhp from a 2L engine is pretty good considering that 3.2 gives out 197 bhp and is in every way sufficient for regular use. The real issue is the absence of bi-turbo which would have taken the power numbers to beyond those delivered by the 3.2 levels (as is available in Aus and UK on the Raptor). The gearbox is a huge plus point on this new model !

The Mahindra-Ford JV only impacts future cars which will be designed in tandem - Endeavour is fully designed in Aus/Thailand and so far not impacted. That said - we never know how future developments and service packages may be. But the 2L engine is a global product and this Indian JV cannot influence those decisions.

Comparing the Endeavour to Compass, Hector and Harrier would not really be fair (on the latter). The Endeavour is in a different category and the right comparison would be the Fortuner which in the BS6 variant barely offers 4% more power with a 2.8L engine.
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Old 31st March 2020, 23:34   #21
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Default Re: Ford Endeavour 2.0L Diesel AT : Official Review (with dune bashing)

I had posted a similar query in another thread “The BS6 Ford Endeavour with new 2.0L diesel engine now launched at 29.55 lakhs”. Since that thread has been quiescent for some time, I am posing my question again. This however is not merely a repost though the Moderators may consider removing this post if it is in contravention of Team-BHP rules.

Given that, at present, only the single turbo 2.0l diesel engine is available, is it a viable option to remap the ECU so as to boost the engine’s power and torque to values somewhat at par with those of the Bi Turbo 10 AT Ford Everest? Will this be stressful on the engine and the other mechanical parts in the long run, even if driven with a light foot?

Such a solution seems to be feasible because both these engines are essentially the same, the only difference being their state of tune and single/ bi turbo. As a result, post remap the power figures would be like the stock bi turbo which translates into mush less probability of damaging the engine/ other mechanical parts as long as one drives sensibly.

What do you feel about this?
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Old 31st March 2020, 23:49   #22
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Default Re: Ford Endeavour 2.0L Diesel AT : Official Review (with dune bashing)

People might have loved the old 3.2 a lot, however, I found it to be quite a confused gearbox for city driving. It used to struggle to pick the right gear based on your accelerator inputs.

This new 2.0 is a much different creature altogether. It is a lot more intuitive. You get instant power delivery as and when you need it for a quick overtaking maneuver. It somehow appears much faster during 20-80 sprints as compared to the 3.2.
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Old 1st April 2020, 00:49   #23
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Default Re: Ford Endeavour 2.0L Diesel AT : Official Review (with dune bashing)

Was a big fan of the Endeavour. But now with the 2L engine with 168 bhp this has gone out of my radar. Biggest disappointment.

Ford, please bring the BI Turbo.
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Old 1st April 2020, 02:38   #24
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Default Re: Ford Endeavour 2.0L Diesel AT : Official Review (with dune bashing)

Quote:
Originally Posted by docinog View Post
Is it a viable option to remap the ECU so as to boost the engine’s power and torque to values somewhat at par with those of the Bi Turbo 10 AT Ford Everest?
Sure, you can remap it but you won't get near the biturbo's output. You can't replace a turbo with a software remap!
Quote:
Originally Posted by docinog View Post
Will this be stressful on the engine and the other mechanical parts in the long run, even if driven with a light foot? Post remap the power figures would be like the stock bi turbo which translates into much less probability of damaging the engine/ other mechanical parts as long as one drives sensibly.
I have a cheaper and simpler solution for you. Just drive with a heavy foot! Why would you remap the car, then worry about damage under full power and as a result, end up using the same power that you had in the first place?
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Old 1st April 2020, 02:40   #25
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Default Re: Ford Endeavour 2.0L Diesel AT : Official Review (with dune bashing)

Fantastic review Anshuman! I've lived w my 2016 Endeavor 3.2 for a while now(42k kms to be precise) and can't imagine a smaller less powerful engine in this size of car, on the contrary i've been contemplating getting a remap for the longest time to get more oomph out of this beast!

Only thing i wish my car had is Apple Carplay and Navigation. (the facelift addressed these in 2019)
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Old 1st April 2020, 02:43   #26
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Default Re: Ford Endeavour 2.0L Diesel AT : Official Review (with dune bashing)

I really don't understand why do people buy these big diesel SUVs. Now I love big body on frame truck like SUVs but they just don't make any sense in a place like Delhi where it is a pain to find parking for them and to navigate them around.
Plus the 10 year ban? The ban would also tank the resale value and makes it more pointless as I would love to keep by durable truck for a while, that is what they are so good at!
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Old 1st April 2020, 08:55   #27
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Default Re: Ford Endeavour 2.0L Diesel AT : Official Review (with dune bashing)

Thanks for sharing this fantastic drive report .a. This 2.0 single turbo is a bummer, I thought that sales will dip because of this, but as Ace points out, it may increase or stay constant because of better FE.

I still hope, Ford comes with twin turbo 2.0 Endeavour, else, it won't be that complete a package anymore.

Quote:
Originally Posted by rahul_jo View Post
People might have loved the old 3.2 a lot, however, I found it to be quite a confused gearbox for city driving. It used to struggle to pick the right gear based on your accelerator inputs.
That was solely for speeds unto ~60 kmph, post that, the GB appeared intuitive and while it lagged for a second, max two [if you were at 100 kmph and wanted to accelerate] it was not as bad as it was when you wanted to accelerate from 20 kmph.

Last edited by Sheel : 1st April 2020 at 16:35.
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Old 1st April 2020, 09:00   #28
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Default Re: Ford Endeavour 2.0L Diesel AT : Official Review (with dune bashing)

For those interested, here is Anshuman's video review:


Quote:
Originally Posted by Ace F355 View Post
Wonderful report Anshuman from what I assume was a very short drive.
Just to clarify, the office team also drove an Endeavour 2.0 at a Mumbai dealer and added some points. We did this because we knew the coronavirus is going to delay the press car.

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Originally Posted by Axe77 View Post
Wouldn't a twin turbo perhaps be more prone to issues, specially in our conditions?
True. Will bring complexity, but the Endeavour's reliability + long extended warranty (upto 6 years) will be enough for me. Because without the twin-turbo variant, I'll never consider the Endeavour 2.0.

Quote:
Originally Posted by ramnaresh_2000 View Post
Jeep Compass, Hector and Harrier all have the 2.0L engine and 170 BHP at cheaper price and even more features (cough Hector).
Good point indeed. SUVs costing half the price have the same engine size & power output (although not the torque).

Quote:
Originally Posted by docinog View Post
Given that, at present, only the single turbo 2.0l diesel engine is available, is it a viable option to remap the ECU so as to boost the engine’s power and torque to values somewhat at par with those of the Bi Turbo 10 AT Ford Everest?
A remap will give you more power, but it has limitations. There is no replacement for displacement (3.2L) or hardware (twin-turbo).

Quote:
Originally Posted by rahul_jo View Post
People might have loved the old 3.2 a lot, however, I found it to be quite a confused gearbox for city driving. It used to struggle to pick the right gear based on your accelerator inputs.
Which is why Anshuman's review clearly states that the 2.0 + 10-speed AT is actually better in the city.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Doge View Post
I really don't understand why do people buy these big diesel SUVs. Now I love big body on frame truck like SUVs but they just don't make any sense in a place like Delhi where it is a pain to find parking for them and to navigate them around.
Some of us just prefer big cars . For me, the bigger the better. I wouldn't have any problem driving a Landcruiser 200 or S-Class around Bombay.
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Old 1st April 2020, 10:31   #29
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Default Re: Ford Endeavour 2.0L Diesel AT : Official Review (with dune bashing)

The new 2.0 might be a big disappointment to some as compared to the old 3.2, however, maybe 3% of the people buying this SUV are deep level researchers.

Ford has just addressed the big limiting factors that bothers 97% of their buyers. Think in terms of marketing and business. Factors such as...

1- Fuel economy - Oddly enough, this shouldn't matter too much for someone buying an almost 40 lac car. However, it somehow still is a big factor for most Indians and the new 2.0 is definitely more fuel efficient.

2- Power delivery for city driving - The old 3.2 had a lot more power but that gearbox couldn't put that power down in a confidence inspiring fashion (for city driving at least). This new 2.0 one feels a lot more spirited.

With the 3.2 you had to get rolling at a certain pace to finally hit that sweet spot. I mean, what's the point of having all that power when you have to work the engine to finally discover - "Oh, it can actually go fast as well".

The 2.0 just has more revs and gear ratios that power down much earlier and you get that sweet refined experience almost instantly.

The average end user doesn't know too much about the numbers or the ratios. All they care about is how the car performs when they put their foot down.

3- Price - They made it cheaper by a lac or so. Again, in the bigger scheme of things, this will nudge the buyer in favor of the Endeavor or at least get enough people in the showroom who are price only buyers.

To us enthusiasts, this new 2.0 might seem like a big disappointment. However, marketing wise, this decision makes a lot more sense.

And I wouldn't be surprised if this new one sells in comparatively bigger numbers.

Last edited by rahul_jo : 1st April 2020 at 10:33.
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Old 1st April 2020, 10:55   #30
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Default Re: Ford Endeavour 2.0L Diesel AT : Official Review (with dune bashing)

Quote:
Originally Posted by rahul_jo View Post
The new 2.0 might be a big disappointment to some as compared to the old 3.2, however, maybe 3% of the people buying this SUV are deep level researchers.
This, I agree with.

Quote:
1- Fuel economy - Oddly enough, this shouldn't matter too much for someone buying an almost 40 lac car. However, it somehow still is a big factor for most Indians and the new 2.0 is definitely more fuel efficient.
I spoke to a car dealer. Actually, there is not a world of difference in the city. One really cannot expect a 2400 kilo SUV with a 168 BHP engine and 4x4 hardware to be "fuel efficient". The biggest difference in fuel economy is on the highway (due to the super tall 9th & 10th ratios).

Quote:
I mean, what's the point of having all that power when you have to work the engine to finally discover - "Oh, it can actually go fast as well".
Enthusiasts will tell you that "working the engine" is the fun part.

Quote:
The 2.0 just has more revs and gear ratios that power down much earlier and you get that sweet refined experience almost instantly.
Agreed.

Quote:
The average end user doesn't know too much about the numbers or the ratios.
You'll be surprised. If there is one thing someone with even casual interest has in mind, it's "engine size" and that's something the Fortuner 2.8 wins instantly.

Also remember that those who bought the "3.2" over the "2.2" did so only because of engine size. That segment is effectively lost.

Quote:
3- Price - They made it cheaper by a lac or so. Again, in the bigger scheme of things, this will nudge the buyer in favor of the Endeavor or at least get enough people in the showroom who are price only buyers.
Actually, NOT. They increased the price in December 2019 by 1.5 lakhs and now, cut it by 1.5 lakhs. Check this post by RemingtonSteele.

Quote:
And I wouldn't be surprised if this new one sells in comparatively bigger numbers.
The price is the same and the market is damp (currently dead). Bigger numbers is out of the question on an annualized basis.
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