[anjan_c2007]

Originally Posted by rajeev k

Saw these Landmaster pictures from sale advertisements over the net. All are from outside India.
Link and country of each car is mentioned against each of the pictures

These are not Landmasters but Morris Oxfords Series II. These had the 1489 cc, BMC, overhead valve engine and a heater in the higher versions.

[rajeev k]

Originally Posted by anjan_c2007

These are not Landmasters but Morris Oxfords Series II. These had the 1489 cc, BMC, overhead valve engine and a heater in the higher versions.

Thanks Anjanji.
Were this, the same 1489 cc BMC engines, that powered the OHV Ambys in India from 1960?
Some of these cars were powered by 1620 cc engines.
Still some more Morris Oxfords from the same Australian site.

[anjan_c2007]

Originally Posted by rajeev k

Thanks Anjanji.
Were this, the same 1489 cc BMC engines, that powered the OHV Ambys in India from 1960?
Some more from the Australian site.

Yes Rajeev, the 1476 cc side valve was consigned to history for the Oxford plant of Morris Motors, after the departure of the Morris Oxford MO Series (our Hindustan 14), whereas the same side valve was exported to India and fitted in all Landmasters (11,605 were manufactured between 1954 - 57/58). The same engine was also fitted in the early Ambassadors (we call them Mark I) from 1958 - 60. Only in 1960, we could get the overhead valve engines here for Ambassadors.

The bonnet scoop on these Morris Oxfords indicate that the OE Heater is fitted to the car.

Whereas, across the Atlantic, the Chevrolet six cylinder in line engine from the early 1930's vintage, fitted in the 1930's Chevrolets ( the 1937 Chevrolet Master and Master Deluxehad an improved OHV engine) also had the overhead valve configuration. The same Chevrolet engine continued with the Fleetmasters and even the 1950's models with some improvements.

[karlosdeville]

Originally Posted by Gearphile

This is a family heirloom - my father's 1962 Ambassador Mark II which, during the 1980s got modified into a Mark II with some Mark III and Mark IV accessories. I am in the process of restoring the accessories back to the original Mark II equipment. It still has the original OHV engine, original body, gearbox and a number of the accessories. I hope to create a separate restoration thread, share the work so far and also solicit advice in the process.

Originally Posted by Gearphile

It is a 1962 registered Mark II. Growing up in the 80s, I remember the original Mark II front grill and many of the accessories like the combination ignition switch, the Smith MPH speedometers etc all of which got replaced during that time.

Good luck on the restoration, I am glad to see a family heirloom being restored. For identity best is to check the RC book and chassis numbers. If she is a 1962, she will be the first OHV, also called a Mark I. The Mark 2 was first shown in 1963.

[ajay99]

Originally Posted by Gearphile

Looking at your car # and engine #, it seems slightly older than my father's late 1962 Mark II. It is probably an early 1962 car.



It is a 1962 registered Mark II. Growing up in the 80s, I remember the original Mark II front grill and many of the accessories like the combination ignition switch, the Smith MPH speedometers etc all of which got replaced during that time.

I am doing a full restoration to Mark II. Front grill, parking lights, decals, original Smith meters, ivory gear knob, original tail lights, number place light, original steering with the indicator switch, original headlight rims, dome light and everything else I could find missing. I am also getting it repainted to one of the original colors - dove grey.

1962 model is MARK1, not markII
also mark II usually came with autometer meters and Mark1 came with Smith meters.

[Gearphile]

Originally Posted by ajay99

1962 model is MARK1, not markII
also mark II usually came with autometer meters and Mark1 came with Smith meters.

Our RC book says it is a 1962 car. I clearly remember the original Mark 2 front grill before it was replaced in the 1980s. The wikipedia entry for Hindustan Ambassador also says Mark 2s came to the market in 1962. For the first couple of years, Mark 2 apparently still came with Smith meters before getting replaced by Autometer meters and later by Yenkay.

[rajeev k]

Originally Posted by Gearphile

Our RC book says it is a 1962 car. I clearly remember the original Mark 2 front grill before it was replaced in the 1980s.

The Mark II was introduced in end 1963.

[Gearphile]

Originally Posted by rajeev k

The Mark II was introduced in end 1963.

I am not sure that is correct. See http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hindust...ssador#Mark-II. Also looking back at old threads in team-bhp, I find several posters mentioning Mark II line starting in 1962. In fact, one of them was you, Rajeev

In any case, I think we need some good historical sources to verify and possibly catalogue various models over the years.

[Gearphile]

Originally Posted by karlosdeville

Good luck on the restoration, I am glad to see a family heirloom being restored. For identity best is to check the RC book and chassis numbers. If she is a 1962, she will be the first OHV, also called a Mark I. The Mark 2 was first shown in 1963.

Thanks, @karlosdeville.

The chassis number is in the vicinity of 111-29000. It is also quite possible that we are reading the year in the RC book wrong - it is a really old worn out book. My father passed away long ago, I will ask my uncle if he knows the year for sure.

[karlosdeville]

Originally Posted by Gearphile

I am not sure that is correct. See http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hindust...ssador#Mark-II. Also looking back at old threads in team-bhp, I find several posters mentioning Mark II line starting in 1962. In fact, one of them was you, Rajeev

In any case, I think we need some good historical sources to verify and possibly catalogue various models over the years.

I remember seeing ads of the introduction of the Mark II with the numbers '1963' displayed on the plate. I don't remember seeing any ads dated 1962 for the Mark II, but I could just as well be wrong. I do own a 1962 Mark 1 and a 1965 Mark II.

Wikipedia don't forget is written by people like you and me, so not to be taken as always authentic.

[rajeev k]

See this excerpt from Business standard. Link: http://www.business-standard.com/art...2501236_1.html

Not that the Amby's ample curves were immune to changing market tastes. In 1975, it was given a facelift with the addition of new tail-lights, a number-plate light, rounded parking lights and a new dashboard and called Ambassador Mark III (Mark II had been launched 12 years before in 1963). HM pushed the new Amby as "a big size family car" through advertisements. The company also came out with an innovative scheme for its existing customers, offering to replace an old car-body with the Mark III shell.

And from Hindustan Times. Link: http://www.hindustantimes.com/brunch...1-1228984.aspx

1963
It underwent a frontal facelift with a closely-checkered grille and was named the Ambassador Mark II. It would be 12 years before another redesign.

And this is much more important as the First Mark II was presented to the then Prime Minister, Pandit Nehruji. Link:http://self.gutenberg.org/articles/H...k_I_to_Mark_IV

In 1963 it underwent a minor frontal facelift with a closely chequered grill and was named as the Ambassador Mark II. As with other British designed Mark cars, while there was never really any Ambassador Mark I, the arrival of the Mark II got people calling the older model, Mark I. Incidentally, the first ever produced Mark II in black was gifted by HM to the then Prime Minister Jawaharlal Nehru. In this period the Sales Manager, Helmuth Lindeman, unsuccessfully tried to persuade Birla Senior to use an Ambassador, as that would in his view, have improved the quality. The fact that Mr Birla had doubts on the reliability of the car and was not willing to use the car made in his factory was a clear indication of its quality.

[Gearphile]

Originally Posted by karlosdeville

I remember seeing ads of the introduction of the Mark II with the numbers '1963' displayed on the plate. I don't remember seeing any ads dated 1962 for the Mark II, but I could just as well be wrong. I do own a 1962 Mark 1 and a 1965 Mark II.

Wikipedia don't forget is written by people like you and me, so not to be taken as always authentic.

Agreed about wikipedia. Hence, I said that we need more historical inputs. If you don't mind, could you please share the approximate chassis number of your 1962 Mark I ? That should help date my father's car (in the 29000+ range). I will also recheck the worn out RC book and if time permits, ask a friend at the RTO to check the original records. I will ask my father's body shop guy as well - he is still not retired and may remember what was there in the original car (which he changed).

[karlosdeville]

Originally Posted by Gearphile

If you don't mind, could you please share the approximate chassis number of your 1962 Mark I ? That should help date my father's car (in the 29000+ range).

Here you go, first registered in October 1962

[Gearphile]

Originally Posted by karlosdeville

Here you go, first registered in October 1962

Thanks @karlosdeville. Our car is about 5000 cars older, so it is probably a 1962 Mark I. Maybe the grill was changed or I don't remember correctly. I looked at the photos in your team-bhp garage - your 1962 Mark I car looks identical to ours except the front grill. So, restoring to Mark I should be relatively easier.

[rajeev k]

More on the Mark II; this time from the newsroom of HM itself.
Link: http://www.hindmotor.com/article1.asp

It started production of the Landmaster in 1954, and in 1957 began the production of the Ambassador. Later tie-ups with General Motors Corporation of USA, Vauxhall Motors, UK, Marion Power Shovel Co, USA led to new products being launched. In 1963 commenced the production of the Ambassador Mark 2.