[vivek95]

Originally Posted by xway

I have seen many perfectly healthy human beings losing life in a matter of hours due to Corona. No virus every has been this sticky and deadly.
.

I am keeping other arguments aside but what sort of baseless claim is this !!

Sir, are you a Doctor who has closely seen and treated umpteen Covid patients first hand ?? I have been working non-stop in Covid ICU since more than an year now and have not encountered a single case where in a patient died "within hours" of getting infected with Covid-19. Let alone perfectly healthy human beings, the elderly ones with co-morbidities too didn't lose life in a matter of hours. So please, let's not exaggerate things. Not a single doctor in my nearest or farthest circle has come across the same that you are claiming. Kindly do not create unnecessary panic ( people are already worried ). Thanks

[Zen2001]

Originally Posted by FrozeninTime

P.S: It is quite disheartening to read some comments by my learned colleagues from medical community about Covid. To them I would say one thing every life is precious and I would not hide behind a statistical data to say there is nothing alarming about Covid or current Covid situation in our country.

Yes every live is precious. But FYI, all medical science is based on evidence. That's "data", in your terms. We live on it, not hide behind it. But now I'll tell you what is being hidden - the true Infection fatality rate. All your media and govt "data" is scaring people over the CFR (case fatality rate) which is as crude an indicator as one can have about mortality of an infectious disease. The true number of infections (detected + undetected) are in multiples of hundreds of the numbers that you know. Now, if the CFR in Pune, which currently has the highest burden of cases is 0.6% (figure released by heath dept of PMC), wouldn't the actual IFR be hundreds of times less?? And then why would I be alarmed about a mortality rate of 0.006%? At least not too that extent to justify the craziness. See the pic attached.

Originally Posted by V.Narayan

+1. Thank you for saying it as it is.

I always do. Not that it has any effect on people who refuse to believe, anyway.

Originally Posted by poloman

Sir, you are doing a mistake again and again by comparing Covid with TB and other diseases. This even after a year. How many in your circle is infected with TB? How many in your circle have died of TB? It is very sad you talk like this even after claiming to be a healthcare worker.

Open any TV channels and check for yourself thousands lying on hospital beds with oxygen masks and ventilators. How many are with TB? COVID mortality may be less over all. But to some people it is extremely lethal and there is no cure unlike TB. The doctors on this forum may have an opinion, but it is totally contradictory to eminent doctors we hear on other forums like TV. So if we don't know about the complexities, the best thing we can do is stop giving advice on matters of life and death.

People should not become complacent after reading such comments trivializing the danger we are in.

It's a valid comparison! Do you know how many deaths occur from TB every month in India even today? Have you been to a TB/chest OPD/ward ever in your life to see what those patients suffer? I've known colleagues during residency who contracted TB through contact with such patients, coupled with 36 hours of continuous duties without sleep, repeated over 3 years of training resulting in lowered immunity. How many people you know have gone through this? We've seen more complications and deaths of TB than perhaps any other disease today, including Covid. In fact it is very sad to see non health care workers pass such judgements. By the way, have you ever in the past checked if your family doctor "claims" to be a doctor or really is one? It's a pity that your opinions are purely based on what TV news and politicians are showing you. Referring even to the experts on TV, I've known a few in the past few months(in govt administration) who dared to speak the truth only to have them shunted out, and transferred - including deans of medical colleges municipal corporation health dept etc. They don't show this on your TV unfortunately. Lastly, I'm not giving anybody advice on life and death - just presenting the facts as they REALLY are. The rest is up to the people.

Originally Posted by xway

I see many in this thread including some medical specialists and experts suggesting otherwise and criticizing lockdowns and showing less seriousness to COVID.

To the extend some are even comparing Covid with TB and common flu and fever.

In fact if your comparisions are so lame, you may suggest how many people die by not wearing helmets or seat belts, definitely they might be less then TB, so maybe safety measures are also not required.

This is exactly why most indians are not wearing masks, crowding an not following the protocols.

Having lost (brother in law) a young and completely fit person to this deadly Covid, I disagree with many here. Also, one close family survived TB and fine now since 20 plus years after treatment, so comparing these 2 is baseless.

It IS deadly, it takes lives, and most importantly it spreads like wild fire, in cases inspite of wearing masks too.

Governments world over are not doing lockdowns over nothing.

Canada, France, UK and many other countries are in lockdown, and so may be here in India too. No matter how much debatable at least it prevents people from getting out.

So, please do not take this Corona virus lightly.

I have seen many perfectly healthy human beings losing life in a matter of hours due to Corona. No virus every has been this sticky and deadly.

So, Please mask up and stay indoors as much as you can, life can change in some moments with this virus.

Well, no matter how scared you are, or how much you want to scare others, or how deadly you think Covid is, lockdowns do not help to REDUCE MORTALITY. They just DELAY the peak. But yes, common sense like preventing overcrowding (ever seen election rallies and these same politicians bragging about the turnout?) - that helps to reduce transmission. This is scientifically proven - either u trust science or you don't! Perhaps you could divert your energies to educating these very politicians who have locked you up in the past and will do so again in the future.
About your other concerns, I've seen perfectly healthy people from well to do backgrounds contract TB, dengue, etc and die. On the other hand we have seen lakhs of people recover from Covid within 2 weeks, why wait for even more?
Please get some incidence/prevalence rates, morbidity and mortality statistics on TB, Influenza and Covid before calling any comparisons as baseless. The only point I can agree with is that Covid is more infective, it spreads quickly, BUT IT IS DEFINITELY NOT ANY MORE DEADLY (as is being made of it).

Originally Posted by DigitalOne

Sorry for the rant but this is just incredibly elitist. TB affects the poorer class more, and just because the affected families are not in our "circle", doesn't make it any less dangerous or tragic.

Actually, health care workers and doctors would have better perspective on TB as they may be working with TB patients or in preventing TB on the ground rather than relying on TV news and WhatsApp forwards.

The middle-class is worried more about Covid than TB because despite the best efforts of WhatsApp uncles and RWAs to keep the "unwashed" out, it has entered our gated communities and our sheltered lives.

End of rant.

Sigh! What more to say? Elitist is the right word for such people. They have been looking in their own bubble for so long, and now that it's been breached (by Covid) all hell had broken loose. Such short- sightedness! Where was all this hyperacute attention when the lesser privileged were sick and dying?

Originally Posted by srishiva

We are running out of ICU beds, oxygen etc with this disease. We have increased that infrastructure since last year. So it can't be normal flu. So just because majority are asymptomatic isnt helping anything.

Lol! The reason why we're "running out" has nothing to do with whether or not it's a normal or novel flu. It's simply because of gross mismanagement. Other than govt hospitals, most beds in private hospitals (other than ICU) have been taken up by mild- moderate cases, who could have well stayed at home! Or at the most in Covid isolation facilities. We have waiting lists of people with negligible symptoms (but a positive PCR report) willing to pay money to get a bed - they could very well isolate at home.
And that's why the fact that the majority are asymptomatic HAS HELPED so much - they probably never got tested to develop the Covid mania that follows a positive report!

[thedragonreborn]

Originally Posted by GTO

Despite taking the utmost precautions, I caught the bloody Covid-19! Am isolated on 3rd floor house with everyone else on the 1st floor house. My result came in yesterday. Strange virus - waves of weakness & chills come and go.

02 is holding steady at the 97 - 98 level. Have started the standard 5 - 6 medicines.

The virus came knocking last year in June Left behind a couple of cardiac related emergencies, and some funny dances with blood pressure and the runs. This little fellow is as devious as a crafty little goblin.

Having survived it, we were told by the kindly white-coats at Hinduja that we had been vaccinated for free, and early on; including my then 3 month old baby.

Those 14 days were a nightmare though. Gallons of chicken soup (some from Prabhat) helped, as did administered dosage of Zinc, Magnesium, Vits C & D.

Hope you hop back into the driver's seat soonly!

[srishiva]

Originally Posted by Zen2001

Lol! The reason why we're "running out" has nothing to do with whether or not it's a normal or novel flu. It's simply because of gross mismanagement. Other than govt hospitals, most beds in private hospitals (other than ICU) have been taken up by mild- moderate cases, who could have well stayed at home! Or at the most in Covid isolation facilities. We have waiting lists of people with negligible symptoms (but a positive PCR report) willing to pay money to get a bed - they could very well isolate at home.
And that's why the fact that the majority are asymptomatic HAS HELPED so much - they probably never got tested to develop the Covid mania that follows a positive report!

The fact that its highly infective which results in more number of cases and brings down a certain percentage is ok ? Isnt it being highly infective responsible for more number of deaths (forget percentage, the last refuge of ... Authorities are using this to cover up their incompetency)

You dont contest ICU beds getting filled up. What are the chances of people not getting ICU bed dying ? What are the chances of people in ICU which number is high for this disease dying ? Even something exposing shortcomings in the system is fine to result in deaths ?

I dont think media or whatsapp is creating this data. Also, I dont think everyone is getting panicked. If one was, people wouldn't have thrown caution to wind and numbers wouldn't be increasing the way they are. Then you can add myriad new complications even after getting cured.

[kits]

We see treating covid outcome as binary - either you recover completely or, you die.

Above is not true. There are still many who are experiencing long term impact of covid. In my own circle I know people who haven't got back their stamina, sense of smell or taste. Multiple studies and publications show the same. More research is being carried out on long term impact as we speak.

Lockdown was never supposed to eradicate covid. The purpose was to delay the peak so that we get time to prepare ourselves and design a vaccine. It would not have been required of people would have by themselves kept the distance and followed the protocol.

[fhdowntheline]

Originally Posted by aghate

We have just landed at Chhatrapati Shivaji Maharaj Mumbai International Airport and the process has been very smooth right from take off in London to Landing. Although my post is not about what the process is, as it is well documented on the CSMIA website.

All this makes one believe that international flights from places like UK should have never been allowed. And if they were, then all airports should have had Military-scale quarantine facility at the airport itself. No comforts/lavish luxury, no chance of escaping. Their passports should have been taken by the authorities mandatorily (it is anyway not a personal document).

[varman742]

Originally Posted by GTO

Despite taking the utmost precautions, I caught the bloody Covid-19!.

Wishing you a speedy recovery GTO. If your symptoms are not increasing then the standard medications and home isolation will suffice for you.

For all others too who have been infected, hope you recocer well and you along with your family will be able to deal with these tricky situations.

[Thad E Ginathom]

I do wish people would stop shrieking about fatality as if it was the only measure of covid dangers and nastiness. Even some of our doctors seem to think so.

[Zen2001]

Originally Posted by srishiva

The fact that its highly infective which results in more number of cases and brings down a certain percentage is ok ? Isnt it being highly infective responsible for more number of deaths (forget percentage, the last refuge of ... Authorities are using this to cover up their incompetency)

You dont contest ICU beds getting filled up. What are the chances of people not getting ICU bed dying ? What are the chances of people in ICU which number is high for this disease dying ? Even something exposing shortcomings in the system is fine to result in deaths ?

I dont think media or whatsapp is creating this data. Also, I dont think everyone is getting panicked. If one was, people wouldn't have thrown caution to wind and numbers wouldn't be increasing the way they are. Then you can add myriad new complications even after getting cured.

Your premise is entirely wrong! Higher infectivity is not translating into higher mortality! I gave you the scientific evidence and factual data. As of this week! The same also corroborated by private hospitals I work with. What you want to believe (or otherwise) is your choice. Moreover, the ICU, by its very name is a highly volatile mileu, and ICU deaths (from any primary cause even other than Covid) by far will always be much more, than the same case being a non critical one! Again this is a very small fraction. Judging everything by this yardstick is what is leading you to your judgements.
I would recommend reading your daily Google news feeds (I'm not even bothering to mention TV news channels/ WhatsApp/ politicians) with a bucketful of salt unless you can verify the source as purely scientific. But face it, how many have the willingness to do that?

[aghate]

Originally Posted by fhdowntheline

All this makes one believe that international flights from places like UK should have never been allowed. And if they were, then all airports should have had Military-scale quarantine facility at the airport itself. No comforts/lavish luxury, no chance of escaping. Their passports should have been taken by the authorities mandatorily (it is anyway not a personal document).

Banning international travel is not a measure for preventing infection of COVID19, be it from UK or from any other nation. No offense but your response sounds too extreme, it is not a prison sentence for any military scale operation, let alone confiscation of personal documents.

Stating "(it is anyway not a personal document)" sounds absurd and way out of reach. A passport is as much of a personal document as a PAN Card or Aadhar Card as it identifies a person.

I have stated an experience regarding how 'some' manage to escape the process, to bring into light how irresponsible few individuals are. That is in no way meant for slating the entire NRI community.

[.HEM]

Originally Posted by GTO

The single place I have visited with a lot of people was the vaccination center for Mom's first shot.

Wishing you a speedy recovery! Hope your Mom is fine and doing good. We have seen cases that people even after 2 shots of vaccine have contracted the virus.

[ashish2135]

Originally Posted by ranjitnair77

A lot of us stay with parents so I felt the need to share my story as an example of how things can possibly play out. Having gone through this experience, here is what I feel at the end of it all. Some of this is just opinion which I do not wish to debate.

Thank you for sharing your story as it has helped me greatly. I have just admitted my mother to a hospital this evening after she tested positive last Tuesday.

After seeing a gradual dip in her oxygen level over a period of 5 days we took the call of admitting her to avoid further complications. The self prescribed CT scan report indicated moderate lung damage and we didn’t want to leave her professionally unattended.

We are a family of 7 - grandmother, parents, elder brother, his wife, my wife and I. Some of us were already showing symptoms like cough and it wouldn’t have been ideal to have others test positive.

[fhdowntheline]

Originally Posted by aghate

Banning international travel is not a measure for preventing infection of COVID19, be it from UK or from any other nation. No offense but your response sounds too extreme, it is not a prison sentence for any military scale operation, let alone confiscation of personal documents.

This is not about the NRI community but about the country at large. I think it is pretty clear that all agencies at various levels from the highest to lowest have basically failed to anticipate a second wave, indeed back in Jan/Feb some higher ups were gloating about the fact that India managed to curb the virus whereas other "advanced" Western countries were caught in a second wave while the pundits were left scratching their heads around India's so-called resilience at the same time.
Well, here we are, and the sequel is actually worse than the original. Yet we continue to have Elections, religious events and what-have-you.
The very least they could have done is to severely curtail the international air passenger operations and introduce an extremely strict government monitored/controlled quarantine process. All this was fully possible between Dec-Jan phase to further minimise any external influence.

[Nissan1180]

A leading professor in Ahmedabad died due to the lack of oxygen support at hospitals in the city.

It is sad that even after a year, such preventable loss of lives goes on without bothering the bureaucratic lobby. Even in February and early March these people were giving talks and writing editorials in newspapers about how they "strategically" reduced covid and saved Indians while getting promotions for themselves.

http://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/a...campaign=cppst

Thankfully, the judiciary, which has repeatedly raised concerns about the situation on the ground, has called it an impending health emergency.

https://www.livelaw.in/news-updates/...d-surge-172454

I hope the officials learn from other countries about what works, instead of implementing solutions like the night curfew which leads to crowding at shops between 7 and 8 PM.

[sentra26]

Originally Posted by GTO

Despite taking the utmost precautions, I caught the bloody Covid-19!

Stay safe GTO and the others who have contracted this virus. Hope all of you are doing better/come back stronger.

Covid is no slouch - a shortage of hospital beds and people being given supplemental Oxygen is proof enough of this. I have had friends - perfectly healthy individuals, marathon runners, brought down to their knees - literally and metaphorically due to covid. This is no common flu and seems to affect people in different ways.

Many are comparing Covid and TB. Just thought of sharing my insights. TB causes around 2 lakh deaths a year. We have had multiple family members with TB and a 6 month course of antibiotic fixes it unless it manifests as the TDR-TB which is resistant to most antibiotics. Contrary to what we think, TB is way more prevalent. I think around 1 in 3 or (1 in 5) Indians will test positive for latent TB if you take the quantiferon gold test. (In fact, the tuberculin skin test given in the US results in positives for many Indians). Doctors her will not prescribe anything unless you are symptomatic - that is the protocol as far as I know. And if you are diagnosed with symptomatic, the fix is just antibiotics since it is bacterial and not viral.

Just to lighten the mood, the last thing we need is a contest between deadly diseases devolving into a he-man batman contest . Sure we can even compare Covid to Dengue, Blackwater malaria, Typhoid, Chickengunya, and cholera (2020 there was an outbreak in Bangalore) all of which are abundantly available here. And things get even more interesting when we get into combination offers especially with Covid in the mix. Stay safe. Stay healthy.