The TV Thread - LCD, LED etc.

kb100 · 29th October 2008, 19:26

Quote:

Originally Posted by sj_koova

At times I too think so. Buy a Pani PV80 for now and invest the saved money in equity.
But then the other half of my brain says TV is something I use everyday, so buy the best. And now Pioneer is haunting me.

I have a variation to this thought

I have to decide between 42" and 50". If its 50" then I might as well stretch the extra 50k (over the 50" PV80) and go for either the Pana PY850 or the Pio 508.

But if its going to be 42" then I intend to stick with the PV80 - and put the lac I'd save into equities and buy the 10 series Pio whenever it comes out!

I am leaning towards the latter!I now need to visit a showroom or two locally to eyeball the two sizes and see which one I'd like to live with for the next two years!

RGP · 29th October 2008, 19:41

Is Devi giving bill and Warranty Card? I mentioned to Panasonic showroom that I am getting better price than their offer and the exec there insisted there was no way anybody could offer a better price without skipping VAT. He said lower value than the 62K he was quoting for PV80 was not possible without invoice.
I plan to visit Devi tomorrow, but can those who got delivery from there confirm if they got invoice/WC? Thanks.

Eddy · 30th October 2008, 12:55

Guys,

Can an LCD be mounted in a corner diagonally, ie at the intersection of two walls ?

Fillmore · 30th October 2008, 13:10

Quote:

Originally Posted by Eddy

Guys,

Can an LCD be mounted in a corner diagonally, ie at the intersection of two walls ?

Search for flexible wall mount stands like this
http://www.ergoindemand.com/images_cte/JWD_1_cte.jpg

csentil · 30th October 2008, 13:36

Quote:

Originally Posted by RGP

Is Devi giving bill and Warranty Card? I mentioned to Panasonic showroom that I am getting better price than their offer and the exec there insisted there was no way anybody could offer a better price without skipping VAT. He said lower value than the 62K he was quoting for PV80 was not possible without invoice.
I plan to visit Devi tomorrow, but can those who got delivery from there confirm if they got invoice/WC? Thanks.

Yes, they gave me a bill. The warranty card is inside the box itself. Have to get seal on that. But if you have the bill its ok.. As I said, the bill is given for 58.5K though the price we paid was 56K.

VAT is also included.

Obviously Panasonic is going to say all those. He has a showroom in Koramangala to maintain and he has to have higher margins. Not like Devi who runs it in Petrol Bunk and is make his margins through volume.

Eddy · 30th October 2008, 13:40

Quote:

Originally Posted by Fillmore

Search for flexible wall mount stands like this
http://www.ergoindemand.com/images_cte/JWD_1_cte.jpg

That is one option if available in Delhi. Can it be directly mounted also ?

ST7677 · 30th October 2008, 15:55

KB (and others), If you can I suggest you hold on for 1 year. Next year you would see revolution in Plasma displays.

While the tech keeps improving year by year and that way you can wait forever, this time it's different, because this time the change is not an incremental improvement but a dramatic one.

So what's up in Plasma line of 2009? It's the introduction of 5Lumen per watt technology for which panels are being built in new Matushi ta plant and will be shared by Panasonic, Pioneer and Hitachi. (Japanese APDC consortium)

Most current Plasmas are on 1.5-2 Lumen per watt tech. The advantages of moving to 5 Lm/W are:
More efficiency = Higher brightness with lower power consumption
Thinner and Light weight displays
Even better black levels

So what does all this mean for you
Pioneer 10th Generation* Kuro will feature only 9mm thick panels with Zero ideal Luminance (infinite contrast), expected launch around Sep/Oct’09

Panasonic 12th Generation* - branded as NeoPDP panels feature 24.5mm thick, with Blacks better than Pio 9G, but not 0 min luminance. A 65" Plasma Panel will consume only 150W Power and will weigh only 29 kgs. This will also feature IPTV, Vierra cast (internet Widgets) and may also have Wireless HD (no need to connect physical HDMI cables), Tru2way, etc. Expected launch around Sep 09

So besides a Picture Quality and panel life (100,000 hrs) which is even today way beyond LCDs, a plasma would going ahead also excel LCD in - Weight, Power consumption, Heat generation & Thickness, etc. (which are it's current negatives)

Now you know why I am waiting

Of course 10lm/W is scheduled for 2011 but then I do not see the impact to be so much. As with 5 lm tech has already reached complete Blacks, 9mm thickness, very light weight and stunning Picture Quality.

*Of course features will vary with models, and not all models will get launched in India.

vasudeva · 30th October 2008, 16:10

Of course, what has been said by ST7677 could well come to pass. Technology advancements in digital products (remember mobiles, computers) follow Moore's law and others, with continuous improvements. The question is then: wait till what?

The way prices are declining, I can use my Pio 428G for 3 years, and the buy the latest at the same price in 2010. I think improvements will be continuous for many years to come, and waiting could mean waiting... Just when you finally decide, you hear something better is just on the horizon.

sj_koova · 30th October 2008, 16:31

Also the newer technologies will have price premium attached to it. If you wait for the prices to drop, another technology will be there to keep you waiting.
However the technology ST7677 referring seems to be a revolutionary one. May be worth waiting, but I do not expect that it will be cost justified for at least an year.
I think it be wise to spend 56k for a PV80 now and embrace the new technology may after 2-3 years like vasudeva suggests?.
Hopefully by then we will have fullHD transmission and blue-ray DVDs available for cheaper rates.

Fillmore · 30th October 2008, 18:21

Quote:

Originally Posted by ST7677

KB (and others),
.... Now you know why I am waiting

Right, You can always wait for the best..

While the next gen flat panel might display a delta more brilliant colors, With age your eyesight would have diminished by the same delta multiplied by 2. So the net effect might be reverse also given that by then your enthusiasm in technology also would have diminished.

The new gen TV may weigh a few kgs less and be a few inches thinner, But who cares about this cause after all its wall mounted,Its not like you are carrying and walking about with it daily.

hey I was just pulling your leg, don't take it seriously.

sam003 · 30th October 2008, 18:33

Quote:

Originally Posted by Eddy

That is one option if available in Delhi. Can it be directly mounted also ?

If you get this one let me know too, as even I doo looking for something like this.

Eddy, I got one Manufacturer number his salesman name is Satyavir and number is (9958360020), they have manufactruing in Naraina Ind area and + point is they manufacture locally and do custom stuff too. You can call him for visit and he can show to possible designs they have. I do called him but unfortunately I didn't like the price (7-8K).

ST7677 · 31st October 2008, 00:53

I can understand your view points. However in beginning only I mentioned there are incremental changes and then there are revolutionary changes.

Pio 428 does not meet my performance standard, though it is very good, but I want the best.

While Pio 508 does meet my requirement it consumes close to 380W!!! Now that's a huge load on inverter, considering the power scene in Bangalore. So if the 2009 model takes only 150 W for 65", I am happily willing to wait for that, even if there is a price premium.
Also slimness and aesthetics (and wireless HD) do matter to me.

I know here most people are happy with their Full HD LCDs which only deliver about 300 lines of motion resolution instead of 1080 that they are supposed to produce. Not me! I am both a perfectionist and a value hunter.

Most important is the picture quality. Once there is infinite contrast and zero loss in motion resolution (color gamut is already very accurate on Pios), there is not much to improve or is it?
LCDs do not have much to offer on cards. OLED will take another 5 years at least. SED is dead. Laser tech is almost as bad as LCDs. 3D TV are again few years away. So there is really not much anticipated in near future.

It's a personal choice, I laid out the expected plasma rollouts, so that people can take an informed decision.

5 lumen tech is a revolutionary change in Plasma (and Flat panel industry). Also it is cheaper to produce compared to current tech so there will not be a significant price premium.

kb100 · 31st October 2008, 03:00

Quote:

Originally Posted by ST7677

So what does all this mean for you
Pioneer 10th Generation* Kuro will feature only 9mm thick panels with Zero ideal Luminance (infinite contrast), expected launch around Sep/Oct’09

Panasonic 12th Generation* - branded as NeoPDP panels feature 24.5mm thick, with Blacks better than Pio 9G, but not 0 min luminance. A 65" Plasma Panel will consume only 150W Power and will weigh only 29 kgs. This will also feature IPTV, Vierra cast (internet Widgets) and may also have Wireless HD (no need to connect physical HDMI cables), Tru2way, etc. Expected launch around Sep 09

Brilliant! I guess my decision is made then! I think I'll go for the 42" PV80 for the moment!

If Sept 09 is the tentative launch date chances are it'll be at least Jan'10 by the time this hits Indian shores AND perhaps May/June '10 (or later) before the prices stabilise.

RGP · 31st October 2008, 13:34

I went to Devi and he seems legit. However, the catalog he showed me said PV80D and not PV80H. He says PV80D is the new model replacing 80H. This morning I checked the Pana india website and saw no mention of PV80D or any other model with D suffix. Even a Google search for PV80D returned nonsense. Should I be concerned? Did the people who took TVs from Devi get H or D?
I have put down Rs 500 as a token advance but have not finalized the deal as I need to wait till salary credit to make cash payment.
Would appreciate quick feedback as I would love to get delivery tomorrow to catch the last F1 race on the new TV.

Selective · 31st October 2008, 13:41

Quote:

Originally Posted by RGP

I went to Devi and he seems legit. However, the catalog he showed me said PV80D and not PV80H. He says PV80D is the new model replacing 80H. This morning I checked the Pana india website and saw no mention of PV80D or any other model with D suffix. Even a Google search for PV80D returned nonsense. Should I be concerned? Did the people who took TVs from Devi get H or D?
I have put down Rs 500 as a token advance but have not finalized the deal as I need to wait till salary credit to make cash payment.
Would appreciate quick feedback as I would love to get delivery tomorrow to catch the last F1 race on the new TV.

We all received 42PV80D.

29th October 2008, 19:41	#1742
RGP BHPian Join Date: Jul 2008 Location: Bangalore Posts: 61 Thanked: 6 Times	Is Devi giving bill and Warranty Card? I mentioned to Panasonic showroom that I am getting better price than their offer and the exec there insisted there was no way anybody could offer a better price without skipping VAT. He said lower value than the 62K he was quoting for PV80 was not possible without invoice. I plan to visit Devi tomorrow, but can those who got delivery from there confirm if they got invoice/WC? Thanks.
	() Thanks

30th October 2008, 12:55	#1743
Eddy Team-BHP Support Join Date: Apr 2007 Location: Singapore Posts: 9,565 Thanked: 14,528 Times	Mounting an LCD Guys, Can an LCD be mounted in a corner diagonally, ie at the intersection of two walls ?
	() Thanks

30th October 2008, 15:55	#1747
ST7677 Senior - BHPian Join Date: Feb 2005 Location: Bangalore Posts: 1,067 Thanked: 99 Times Infractions: 0/1 (7)	KB (and others), If you can I suggest you hold on for 1 year. Next year you would see revolution in Plasma displays. While the tech keeps improving year by year and that way you can wait forever, this time it's different, because this time the change is not an incremental improvement but a dramatic one. So what's up in Plasma line of 2009? It's the introduction of 5Lumen per watt technology for which panels are being built in new Matushi ta plant and will be shared by Panasonic, Pioneer and Hitachi. (Japanese APDC consortium) Most current Plasmas are on 1.5-2 Lumen per watt tech. The advantages of moving to 5 Lm/W are: More efficiency = Higher brightness with lower power consumption Thinner and Light weight displays Even better black levels So what does all this mean for you Pioneer 10th Generation* Kuro will feature only 9mm thick panels with Zero ideal Luminance (infinite contrast), expected launch around Sep/Oct’09 Panasonic 12th Generation* - branded as NeoPDP panels feature 24.5mm thick, with Blacks better than Pio 9G, but not 0 min luminance. A 65" Plasma Panel will consume only 150W Power and will weigh only 29 kgs. This will also feature IPTV, Vierra cast (internet Widgets) and may also have Wireless HD (no need to connect physical HDMI cables), Tru2way, etc. Expected launch around Sep 09 So besides a Picture Quality and panel life (100,000 hrs) which is even today way beyond LCDs, a plasma would going ahead also excel LCD in - Weight, Power consumption, Heat generation & Thickness, etc. (which are it's current negatives) Now you know why I am waiting Of course 10lm/W is scheduled for 2011 but then I do not see the impact to be so much. As with 5 lm tech has already reached complete Blacks, 9mm thickness, very light weight and stunning Picture Quality. Of course features will vary with models, and not all models will get launched in India. Last edited by ST7677 : 30th October 2008 at 15:58.*
	() Thanks

30th October 2008, 16:10	#1748
vasudeva Senior - BHPian Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: Delhi Posts: 2,221 Thanked: 212 Times	Of course, what has been said by ST7677 could well come to pass. Technology advancements in digital products (remember mobiles, computers) follow Moore's law and others, with continuous improvements. The question is then: wait till what? The way prices are declining, I can use my Pio 428G for 3 years, and the buy the latest at the same price in 2010. I think improvements will be continuous for many years to come, and waiting could mean waiting... Just when you finally decide, you hear something better is just on the horizon.
	() Thanks

30th October 2008, 16:31	#1749
sj_koova BHPian Join Date: Jan 2008 Location: Bangalore Posts: 677 Thanked: 625 Times View My Garage	Also the newer technologies will have price premium attached to it. If you wait for the prices to drop, another technology will be there to keep you waiting. However the technology ST7677 referring seems to be a revolutionary one. May be worth waiting, but I do not expect that it will be cost justified for at least an year. I think it be wise to spend 56k for a PV80 now and embrace the new technology may after 2-3 years like vasudeva suggests?. Hopefully by then we will have fullHD transmission and blue-ray DVDs available for cheaper rates.
	() Thanks

31st October 2008, 00:53	#1752
ST7677 Senior - BHPian Join Date: Feb 2005 Location: Bangalore Posts: 1,067 Thanked: 99 Times Infractions: 0/1 (7)	I can understand your view points. However in beginning only I mentioned there are incremental changes and then there are revolutionary changes. Pio 428 does not meet my performance standard, though it is very good, but I want the best. While Pio 508 does meet my requirement it consumes close to 380W!!! Now that's a huge load on inverter, considering the power scene in Bangalore. So if the 2009 model takes only 150 W for 65", I am happily willing to wait for that, even if there is a price premium. Also slimness and aesthetics (and wireless HD) do matter to me. I know here most people are happy with their Full HD LCDs which only deliver about 300 lines of motion resolution instead of 1080 that they are supposed to produce. Not me! I am both a perfectionist and a value hunter. Most important is the picture quality. Once there is infinite contrast and zero loss in motion resolution (color gamut is already very accurate on Pios), there is not much to improve or is it? LCDs do not have much to offer on cards. OLED will take another 5 years at least. SED is dead. Laser tech is almost as bad as LCDs. 3D TV are again few years away. So there is really not much anticipated in near future. It's a personal choice, I laid out the expected plasma rollouts, so that people can take an informed decision. 5 lumen tech is a revolutionary change in Plasma (and Flat panel industry). Also it is cheaper to produce compared to current tech so there will not be a significant price premium.
	() Thanks

31st October 2008, 13:34	#1754
RGP BHPian Join Date: Jul 2008 Location: Bangalore Posts: 61 Thanked: 6 Times	I went to Devi and he seems legit. However, the catalog he showed me said PV80D and not PV80H. He says PV80D is the new model replacing 80H. This morning I checked the Pana india website and saw no mention of PV80D or any other model with D suffix. Even a Google search for PV80D returned nonsense. Should I be concerned? Did the people who took TVs from Devi get H or D? I have put down Rs 500 as a token advance but have not finalized the deal as I need to wait till salary credit to make cash payment. Would appreciate quick feedback as I would love to get delivery tomorrow to catch the last F1 race on the new TV.
	() Thanks