[performance plumbing]

Liked the old one much more than the new Gurkha. Just waiting for some publication to do a proper comparison with the (slightly overhyped) Thar. Found this review on ACI

http://www.autocarindia.com/Review/3...est-drive.aspx

[AyAn!]

Originally Posted by Steeroid

Send us his email ID, we will forward the link anonymously. He deserves to see this thread - if only so that he doesnt create more such ugliness.

Originally Posted by AVR

Unfortunate that he'll be held responsible for inducing ugliness into a vehicle that looked quite alright to begin with. Would love to know how he would have designed it differently if he had his way. Will help people get pointers into what all is possible to reduce the ugliness. Please do ask him if he can share

Cheers,
Adi

Well, here's the thing. He's a talented young chap and I'm sure the new styling would have received a lot less flak if he had gone his own way. But the upper echelon at Force who run the show are not particularly an excitable lot when it comes to aesthetics, styling and design. To top it off, they're staunch engineers who suddenly find themselves in the midst of new, fresh ideas regarding contemporary styling that do make sense in times like these. And they're old too, so nothing new makes sense and they merely scoff it off.

Force has never really understood the Gurkha like say, Land Rover did the Defender or Jeep did the Wrangler. Which is why the charm and appeal of the original isn't really reflected on this one, which struggles to find it's own identity beneath a lot of unnecessary glitz and loud, screaming paint-job. And wheels that don't really suit it. Which is sad, because they're just blindly trying to follow trends that they're not capable of pulling off.

[Parm]

Originally Posted by AyAn!

Man! I happen to know the designer personally and I don't think he'd be too glad to see this particular post!

But I don't blame him. He did what he was told to to do. Designers don't always have their own way.

Hi AyAn, is the FM designer an ex-MM cutomisation dept employee?

OR

a DC design graduate?

He is not a designer if he is doing what others tell him, and not following his own flow of imagination?

[Mpower]

Originally Posted by Parm

The face of Gurkha kept me away last night and it bothered me again and again...

..Then i went to the box containing the toy cars of my daughter, and managed to dig out the inspiration behind the new face of the Gurkha.

Sorry, I thought you were just joking when you make that post. I find zero resemblance between the Mater-tow truck and the gurkha.
The Mater is based on a classic '50s american pickup truck !
2ndly, the Gurkha picture you have posted is squeezed & stretched to make it look disproportionate.

Originally Posted by Parm

The headlights and the chin of the Gurkha is similar to Mater.

The headlights of the Mater is more similar to the Ambassador and the Padmini. It has the bulging fender panel with round lights with a chrome finisher and this design language was prevalent in the 50s.

Originally Posted by Parm

T
The headlights and the chin of the Gurkha is similar to Mater.

The Gurkha headlights have the classic & v.generic old-school-off-roader look

To be more specific, its a round sealed-beam headlight set-back (not-flush) behind a vertical squarish panel. The grille has large bars with large openings and the logo is big and bold...the front and is blunt-nosed and not slopey ....all of these features impart it with a butch & bold look

The list of utes that follow this design philosopy are as follows

• Gypsy,
• all Hummers,
• LR-Defender
• Toyota FJ/LC70,
• G-wagen...... to name a few

The grille itself has a deep chin and breaches into the bumper below following the 'bulgarian beard' look which was pioneered by Audi and is the current rage in automotive design. The faux sump-guard is integrated neatly into the bumper center although I would've made it look more minimalist and not so cluttered. The fog lights in the bumper break up the monotony nicely and gel with the overall design.

The old gurkha had a sedan like grille, thin bars with fine openings.

Having said that... its not perfect. I would have rather chosen a dull black matte finish for the grille and bumpers rather than a sparkly metallic grey. The chrome snorkel is a disaster and sticks out badly. I would have chosen a squarish plastic pipe. Front turn-signals should not be the flush type. Also better looking alloys could've been employed. ORVMs should be bigger and bolder

I understand design is subjective and you have to right to air your dislike towards the Gurkha but please back it up with sound logic and meaningful comparisons

Originally Posted by AyAn!

But I don't blame him. He did what he was told to to do. Designers don't always have their own way.

Well, please send my regards and congratulations also with the constructive feedback.

[tatsago]

I wouldn't even compare the design or rather styling (If you could use the word) of the Gurkha to the Defender, the Wrangler or the G- Wagen. What Force has done is take the original G-Wagen concept and tried to create that with flat panels to reduce manufacturing costs. Now the first rule in styling or design is that every panel has to have some shape regardless of how flat it might look. This not only makes it pleasing to the eye but also gives strength to the panel. This is where the Gurkha really differs. As far as the badly done front grille, excuse the words, however talented the designer might be, I have no words. The first thing I would do is to take it off if I buy the Gurkha and go back to the old look.

On another topic, I did get a chance to take a test drive at the Force Motors plant. Several others have commented on the driving experience so I will not repeat that. I came away amazed that a stock vehicle that will be available to customers in a few weeks can do what it does.

The only issue I had are the tyres and the difficulty of modifying suspension etc. for hard core off-roading.

- Rattan

[Saptarshi B]

Originally Posted by 4x4addict

Guess you are the new kid on the block. There is a search feature in Team-Bhp. Samurai had posted the first ever comprehensive review on Gurkha..

Yup got that and have read in detail that review multiple times.

My point was more to say 'try it at a 70 deg'

It was a joke. Get over it

[Mpower]

Originally Posted by tatsago

I wouldn't even compare the design or rather styling (If you could use the word) of the Gurkha to the Defender, the Wrangler or the G- Wagen. What Force has done is take the original G-Wagen concept and tried

to create that with flat panels to reduce manufacturing costs.

Hmm.., so the Rs.1.5 Cr Mercedes G-wagen & 1-Cr Hummer H2 have flat panels to reduce manufacturing cost? Too bad its not being passed on to the customer

Like I said, design is subjective and everybody has different likes. I am stating my view but do not expect to convince anybody.

[tatsago]

M Power, no offense meant and I do not want to start a ping pong discussion, I agree design is subjective.

But if you look closely neither the G Wagen or the Hummer H2 have really flat panels, they do have the slightest shape to them. I have done a lot of work on the H3s and these are things that we look out for when we build the surfaces on a vehicle. Of course you do notice a lot more things in CAD with all the surface evaluation tools available than in photographs.

- Rattan

[Mpower]

None taken my friend. I'm just tying to understand whether you are supporting your view with asthetic or engineering logic ??

I have done a lot of work on the H3s and these are things that we look out for when we build the surfaces on a vehicle

I have also done plenty of work on automotive design and I can tell you, in a typical car, the closures (Class A body panel) shape is almost entirely dictated by the design studio. Its the internal panels of the BIW that are FEA/Optistrut driven

Only in the case of SUV/van roof panel, ribs or gutters are added for stiffening in bending and improve the natural frequency and only because its not easily visible to the naked eye. Chrysler crossfire hood was an exception


Its the H1 and the H2 have slab sided flat panels and not so much the H3.

first thing I would do is to take it off if I buy the Gurkha and go back to the old look.

Just FYI, the old grille louver dimensions and logo are almost a lift off from the Matador F307. Nothing original or off-roady about them

[tatsago]

Originally Posted by Mpower

Just FYI, the old grille louver dimensions and logo are almost a lift off from the Matador F307. Nothing original or off-roady about them

The one thing I noticed during the test drive was that the condensor for the AC is right in from of the radiator, maybe the larger louvres could help with the cooling!

The other thing I found out was that the AC is available in the soft top 4x4 as well and it is quite effective. I did my second test drive with the AC going full blast with the windows open and was still getting sufficient cooling to stand the afternoon heat.

Now I have to take a decision between the H/T and the S/T

- Rattan

[AyAn!]

Originally Posted by Parm

Hi AyAn, is the FM designer an ex-MM cutomisation dept employee?

OR

a DC design graduate?

He is not a designer if he is doing what others tell him, and not following his own flow of imagination?

They say that ignorance is bliss. Things are a lot different in the industry, my friend. Your flow of imagination might mean jack to the guys who hired you, so then you have no way out apart from succumbing to their demands, however twisted or contorted they might look to your "design-savvy" eyes.

Unless you're DC, Chris Bangle or Henrik Fisker. Even when you're freelancing as a designer, a client's requirements MUST hold top priority, and if required, you have to adapt and bend your ways a bit. Harnessing your imagination to it's fullest as a designer is best practiced when you're studying design, not when you're in the industry working under some authority.

P.S. He's an ex IIT-ian.

[m_batabyal]

Today morning got a call from Khivraj Motors (Hosur Road, Bangalore), they will have a Black HT Gurkha in their showroom starting Monday. They have already received and it is undergoing PDI at their workshop. The on road price will be known on Monday. The two updates that I got are:

1. They are registering the vehicle in Bangalore. I was told they have made some arrangement for it.
2. They are in the lookout for a test track somewhere near Bangalore and it will be ready in next 1 month. After that they will allow test drive. Going by their reputation on maintaining timeline, we have to take that with a spoon of salt.

Eagerly waiting for Monday.

[Steeroid]

It should be possible to exchange all the gaudy plastic "ornamentation" on this vehicle with the standard stuff on a taxi Toofan/Cruiser - taxi chaps may actually like these hideous add-ons as they are fond of personalising their vehicles to stand out in the crowd.

If that is possible, the first destination for a new Gurkha from its FML dealership should be to the local taxi rank - even before you take it to a place of worship for Puja or other rituals. Shouldnt insult the gods by putting this monstrosity in front of them.

I am contemplating a purchase, hence these persistent thoughts on how to de-ugly-fy the Gurkha. FML really should offer a de-uglification kit as an option.

[AVR]

Originally Posted by Steeroid

Shouldn't insult the gods by putting this monstrosity in front of them.

I am contemplating a purchase, hence these persistent thoughts on how to de-ugly-fy the Gurkha. FML really should offer a de-uglification kit as an option.

Haha I think that could be a whole new industry in India. The market is big with the Gurkha, Xylo, Quanto et al.
Apart from the front grille, I think even the entire dashboard could do with some 21st century feel. Looks pretty ancient.

Good choice of vehicle here. That one single video demonstrating the diff locks on the ruts has made me love the Gurkha.

Cheers,
Adi

[Mpower]

Originally Posted by Steeroid

I am contemplating a purchase, hence these persistent thoughts on how to de-ugly-fy the Gurkha. FML really should offer a de-uglification kit as an option.

Lot of people feel the same about the FJ cruiser. A very popular mod I've seen is to black-out every single panel that is satin or chrome finish..incl alloys. Gives it a bad ass look. You can also smoke out the turn signals