[InternalCombust]

You guys better hope the Fortuner gets rear disc brakes and a limited slip differential

[captain.torque]

What else do you expect from Toyota? They began their India innings in 2000 with an outdated model like Qualis because they knew that they could get away with it due to a dearth of quality cars in the segment that consisted of Tata Sumo and Mahindra Bolero.

15 years later, the story is still the same. As there is no competition for the Fortuner, Toyota will continue to take Indian customers for granted. This is a trait among many car makers and it's very, very frustrating.

I believe, even if Ford's Endeavour is a success upon its launch and does manage to snatch Fortuner's market share, it won't be too long before Toyota launches the new Fortuner and reclaim lost ground. Thereby, maintaining the status quo.

To keep Toyota on its toes and not take the market lightly, a strong brand needs to enter the premium SUV segment. And the only marque that comes to mind is Honda.

The day Honda plonks a proper diesel engine into the CR-V in India, the game will change drastically. The CR-V abroad features a 1.6 i-DTEC diesel engine.

As for as other brands, Maruti cannot do it yet, may be a couple of years down the line it will be possible via Nexa.

Chevrolet (Captiva), Skoda (Yeti), Nissan (X-Trail), Ssangyong (Rexton) have tried and failed miserably while the Mitsubishi (Pajero), Ford (Endeavour) and Hyundai (Santa Fe) have just managed to survive.

Bottom line: Honda has the brand presence to take Toyota head on.

[shibujp]

I am in the minority here but I am personally one who likes the old Fortuner styling much more than the new styling. The old styling looks much more tough to me.

Enough sales for the current models and better margins might be a motivation for Toyota to maintain status quo. Though the new Endeavour from Ford and the Trailblazer from Chevrolet may be perceived as a threat they are not a patch on Toyota when it comes to cost of ownership, reliability and most of all the insane resale prices that Toyota commands.

It is also the three reason why I have it in my list for a 10 year car - i mean one that I will hang on to for 10 years.

Drive on,
Shibu.

[nik_kapur]

Toyota are back at pulling off cheap stunts! They believe they can milk the market here and they will continue to do so because India cannot look beyond Toyota quality !! The Corolla was also launched almost a year after its International debut and the previous Fortuner came some 3-4 years after its world debut.
It could also be that they want to spread the word of a 2017 launch for the fortuner to sell many more of the current model during the festival time (which is now) as many customers are holding on to their cash in anticipation of the new fortuner.

[Doge]

Originally Posted by captain.torque

What else do you expect from Toyota? They began their India innings in 2000 with an outdated model like Qualis because they knew that they could get away with it due to a dearth of quality cars in the segment that consisted of Tata Sumo and Mahindra Bolero.

The day Honda plonks a proper diesel engine into the CR-V in India, the game will change drastically. The CR-V abroad features a 1.6 i-DTEC diesel engine.
.

Honda? CR-V has the road presence of a mouse, who will buy it? Who will buy a 1.6L tractor like sounding CR-V? This isn't Europe, people are only after road presence here. Hyundai has a stronger brand than Honda and they too failed.
Fortuner isn't a very good car either, I found the santa fe to be much better.

[captain.torque]

Originally Posted by Doge

Honda? CR-V has the road presence of a mouse, who will buy it? Who will buy a 1.6L tractor like sounding CR-V? This isn't Europe, people are only after road presence here. Hyundai has a stronger brand than Honda and they too failed.
Fortuner isn't a very good car either, I found the santa fe to be much better.

Read my post again. I said a PROPER diesel engine. I never said the CR-V should get the 1.6.

And your statement that the CR-V has the "road presence of a mouse" went over my head. God knows what logic or reason you implied to arrive at this.

For me, a CR-V with a diesel heart and competitive price tag has the capability to take on the Fortuner with its futuristic looks and far more premium interiors. And I repeat no Hyundai ore Chevy or Mitsubishi will be able to lock horns with Toyota in the >25 lakh SUV segment. Only Honda can do it.

[Doge]

Originally Posted by captain.torque

For me, a CR-V with a diesel heart and competitive price tag has the capability to take on the Fortuner with its futuristic looks and far more premium interiors. And I repeat no Hyundai ore Chevy or Mitsubishi will be able to lock horns with Toyota in the >25 lakh SUV segment. Only Honda can do it.

Why can only Honda do it? Does Honda have some mystical powers? The CRV has none of the SUV charm that buyers look for. Please don't get fanboy-isim in here. It's quite misleading.

[captain.torque]

Originally Posted by Doge

Why can only Honda do it? Does Honda have some mystical powers? The CRV has none of the SUV charm that buyers look for. Please don't get fanboy-isim in here. It's quite misleading.

Okay! Tell me then, which company according to you can do it? Or Do u want to say that Toyota will remain unbeaten?

And whom am I misleading? Did I ask anyone to buy a CR-V over a Fortuner? And the last time I checked, Team BHP was a place for all car enthusiast's and all of us have adequate knowledge to not get "misled" by others. I think that is the key factor that separates us from the mango people that we are not a bunch of novices here.

[Doge]

Originally Posted by captain.torque

Okay! Tell me then, which company according to you can do it? Or Do u want to say that Toyota will remain unbeaten?

And whom am I misleading? Did I ask anyone to buy a CR-V over a Fortuner? And the last time I checked, Team BHP was a place for all car enthusiast's and all of us have adequate knowledge to not get "misled" by others. I think that is the key factor that separates us from the mango people that we are not a bunch of novices here.

Ford can, like I said before. Honda can first improve the overpriced and badly made City and then focus on fortuner segment.
You're repeated statement that "only Honda can do it" doesn't make any sense, I asked you also why do you think only Honda can do it.
Fanboy-isim is misleading and AFAIK team bhp has many users who are not members or car fanatics.

[captain.torque]

Originally Posted by Doge

Ford can, like I said before. Honda can first improve the overpriced and badly made City and then focus on fortuner segment.
You're repeated statement that "only Honda can do it" doesn't make any sense, I asked you also why do you think only Honda can do it.
Fanboy-isim is misleading and AFAIK team bhp has many users who are not members or car fanatics.

Stop jumping the gun and read my post PROPERLY. I have explained why Honda can take on Toyota. It's because of brand value.

When Ford launched the Endeavour it was a huge success, but ever since Fortuner entered the market, it not only trounced the Endy but has remained the undisputed king for years together now.

And the same will happen again. I am sure the 2015 Endeavour will sell in good numbers upon its launch BUT only till the new Fortuner is away.

Honda has the might to take on Toyota because it has done it in the past with the Civic. The Honda sedan was a tough competitor to the Corolla until the diesel/petrol pricing fiasco happened.

And for god's sake change your perspective, just because I think Honda is a worthy contender, that makes me a "fanboy" ?

By that logic, you seem to be a Toyota fanboy, who is not ready to accept that the Fortuner can be challenged by the CR-V.

[Doge]

Originally Posted by captain.torque

Stop jumping the gun and read my post PROPERLY. I have explained why Honda can take on Toyota. It's because of brand value.

Brand value? Like I said before, hyundai has more value as a brand than Honda.
I would like to know in which sense Honda has has brand value?
And btw, I own a City Ivtec.

[captain.torque]

Originally Posted by Doge

Brand value? Like I said before, hyundai has more value as a brand than Honda.
I would like to know in which sense Honda has has brand value?
And btw, I own a City Ivtec.

A Hyundai SUV for 25 lakhs or a Honda SUV for the same price? Which will command more snob value?

The mindset in our country is that if people are paying that much money, they would like to own a brand that they can show off.

Honda, in the premium segment has more value as a brand than Hyundai.

[DicKy]

Am just praying that the Innova is launched in the Auto expo given that Innova needs more localisation and local vendors than the Fortuner, but the fact it's already on test here is the same only solace.

And unlike Fortuner, Innova doesn't have any big rivals like the upcoming Endeavour, so they can afford to delay the Innova unlike the Fortuner.

[nilanjanray]

Originally Posted by captain.torque

Stop jumping the gun and read my post PROPERLY. I have explained why Honda can take on Toyota. It's because of brand value.

Sedans yes. SUV? No way.

I have a Honda sedan and a Toyota SUV in my house.

A CRV is for metrosexuals and for mall roading and smooth road drives. It is an AWD softroader. Don't compare it to a tough 4x4.

[geotracks]

Perhaps Honda Pilot or Honda Passport could be more comparable to the Toyota Fortuner.

The Honda CR-V is comparable to the Toyota Rav-4 (both compact SUVs).

While Toyota may 'delay' the new Fortuner launch in India to reap maximum profits from the current Fortuner, wonder if they will start giving any offers or discounts on current Fortuners' to clear stocks for the new Fortuner - whenever Toyota decides to get it to the Indian market.