[Lowflyer23]

So this Maruti Suzuki crap full of cost cutting and poor safety will be sold as a Toyota overseas? God help Toyota . It's a bit relieving knowing that we Indians are not alone to have these in our market .

[ZenMaster]

So they didn't even change the grille this time?

So, it was literal Badge engineering.

I have a feeling this is probably an export only model and won't be sold in India.

[DieselAddikt]

Originally Posted by Lowflyer23

So this Maruti Suzuki crap full of cost cutting and poor safety will be sold as a Toyota overseas? God help Toyota . It's a bit relieving knowing that we Indians are not alone to have these in our market .

I don't think so. This Toyota would be stronger, heavier, well built and would adhere to strict crash testing norms. It is only the Indians that are taken for a ride, always !

[KingKong]

What's the point of a Belta when there is a Yaris. I thought Toyota was doing this for segments where they don't sell vehicles, but to replace the comfortable and safe Yaris with a rebadged Ciaz is atrocious. Toyota must sell REAL TOYOTA'S in India or stick to the cars that work (Innova and Fortuner).
Hope they have improved safety as no other countries allow such unsafe vehicles.

[vinair]

Originally Posted by DieselAddikt

I don't think so. This Toyota would be stronger, heavier, well built and would adhere to strict crash testing norms. It is only the Indians that are taken for a ride, always !

The Ciaz scored a decent 4-star rating in the ASEAN new car assessment program. Ciaz sold in the South East Asian countries weighs the same as the Indian model (kerb weight of 965 kilograms).

https://youtu.be/6gwkYH-p77w

Though the car certainly feels light for a sedan, it's still decently safe with just two airbags, this after having witnessed a Ciaz being involved in a frontal-side impact (accident unfolded right in front of our eyes) and the way the car survived along with its passengers. The passenger shell was intact and all the occupants (some three passengers) walked out without any bruises.

Don't think Toyota would have spent a dime to make it any safer!

[Herschey]

Just a thought that crept in and I felt like sharing it here. Is there a possibility of Toyota buying out of it's JV with Kirloskars and enter into a fresh JV with MSIL?

Post the discontinuation of the Etios, the Liva, and now the Yaris, their production capacity would lay grossly under-utilised. In such a scenario, it may turn out to be beneficial that both Toyota and MSIL co-badged ICE vehicles' production is carried out exclusively at MSIL plants while space is freed up for exclusive production of hybrid and electric vehicles at Toyota's plants in Karnataka; vehicles that would drive into the future and would require much higher quality standards at all levels, be it manufacturing, sales, or after-sales.

What's your take BHPians?

[Jhinchak]

Apart from Fortuner and Innova, no other car has been doing well for toyota. If they launch the rebadged ciaz, Nearly 50 percent of their product range will be from Maruthi Suzuki.

[govindasrani]

Would it be worthwhile for the Fortuner and Innova to be rebranded as Maruti-Suzuki and be sold at 5-10L lower price with engines in lower state of tune. The market may just lap up these products! That would make the MS and Toyota arrangement go the full circle!

[dragracer567]

Originally Posted by Leoshashi

Maruti Suzuki India made LHD Toyota Beltas:

I wonder which other country will accept a sedan in 2021 with a 4 speed automatic

[for_cars1]

Originally Posted by vinair

...

Don't think Toyota would have spent a dime to make it any safer!

All rebadged cars essentially roll out from the same MSIL assembly line with just Toyota stickering. Same wine, same bottle just a different label

[DieselAddikt]

Originally Posted by vinair

The Ciaz scored a decent 4-star rating in the ASEAN new car assessment program. Ciaz sold in the South East Asian countries weighs the same as the Indian model (kerb weight of 965 kilograms).

https://Youtu.be/6gwkYH-p77w

Well, from the below link, it looks like the Ciaz tested in ASEAN rating was made in Thailand.
https://autoportal.com/news/maruti-s...ncap-6279.html

Suzuki has already proved with the Swift that cars made in India are of 2 types. 1. Made in India for export and 2. Made in India for India. So, while the Ciaz made in Thailand scored good safety ratings, how can we compare it to the one sold in India ? Just with the weight ? Naaa.... I wouldn't take that. Especially, since the "double standards" was exposed once. Same goes for Renault.

All that aside, I believe this Toyota is the Ciaz that scored 4 stars (made in Thailand). I don't think Toyota would want to sell a 2 star (or 0) rated car anywhere in the world. Even the humble Etios was 4 star rated. The rebadged Brezza is another. So yes !! At least I have reasons to believe so.

[Turbohead]

Am I growing old or is Toyota stuck in the 90s?

The Ciaz was launched in 2014. It's freaking 7 years old - as old as when the first lot of 4th Gen Honda City started hitting the streets!

And what the hell is the world's largest car manufacturer doing? Selling a 7 year old as a replacement for the much newer Yaris launched in 2018?

Depressing!

[Lowflyer23]

Originally Posted by vinair

The Ciaz scored a decent 4-star rating in the ASEAN new car assessment program. Ciaz sold in the South East Asian countries weighs the same as the Indian model (kerb weight of 965 kilograms).

Though the car certainly feels light for a sedan, it's still decently safe with just two airbags, this after having witnessed a Ciaz being involved in a frontal-side impact (accident unfolded right in front of our eyes) and the way the car survived along with its passengers. The passenger shell was intact and all the occupants (some three passengers) walked out without any bruises.

Please get your facts right mate, Suzuki cars tested for crash tests at ASEAN NCAP have a lot of differences as compared to Indian spec Maruti Suzukis. They usually have additional chassis supports and bracing (revealed in a thread here itself by comparing the structures of Indian and overseas Swift, can't recall it now).

You can confirm what I said by watching the crash tests rating of the current generation Maruti Suzuki Swift (tested by GNCAP under safer cars for India program) and Suzuki Swift tested by Euro NCAP. The Euro version received a still not good 3 star rating and the Indian version got 2 stars. Both of them also weigh within the same range (or similiar I'd say). So weight is definitely not the sole factor which can determine the safety of the vehicle at all.

All this further confirms the cheap standards and techniques of Maruti Suzuki of taking Indian customers for granted. The contrary of what I said above though is true too, Latin NCAP recently tested the Suzuki Swift and it got a 0 star rating . So that's that.

[torquecurve]

Oh how the mighty have fallen! One is India’s Leading car seller, the other a global leader.
Rebadging if done right is good - classic example is the Renault-Nissan alliance. There is enough to differentiate the cars that a layman will not mistake one for the other (the low sales also contribute maybe).
While the Ciaz is a good car in its own right - I certainly wouldn’t call it a Toyota!
While these seem to be headed for LHD markets where they would be low cost sedans (taxis?) in India I don’t think it will find many takers.

I do hope both these companies come up with some better cars, drivetrains and technologies.

[vinair]

Originally Posted by Lowflyer23

Please get your facts right mate, Suzuki cars tested for crash tests at ASEAN NCAP have a lot of differences as compared to Indian spec Maruti Suzukis. They usually have additional chassis supports and bracing (revealed in a thread here itself by comparing the structures of Indian and overseas Swift, can't recall it now).

Fact, here it is - a mere 45 kilo in difference underscores the Indian variant?

Originally Posted by Lowflyer23

Suzuki cars tested for crash tests at ASEAN NCAP have a lot of differences as compared to Indian spec Maruti Suzukis.

Says who?