[DRIV3R]

Originally Posted by vivekgk

From the anti-Tata outcry on this thread, you'd think that a Nano was catching fire every other day. Cars catch fire all the time, as shown in so many threads in team-bhp alone.

The reason it gets so much media attention and flak is because it is such a monumental car. If 4 people had died in an Alto crash, the newspaper wouldn't even bother to name the car. The headline would be, '4 people die in car accident'. You'd have to look at the picture and search for clues to find which car it is. But, if they had been driving in a Nano, the headline would mention that. It would say, '4 die in Nano accident'. The report would mention in detail how the car reacted to the crash. There would be comments from clueless bystanders who immediately become car experts and comment on how easily the car was crushed by the truck. Does anyone care to refute that?

The reason the Nano gets so much brickbats is simple. Because it's a superstar! If I hit someone with my car, it wouldn't make the papers. But what if Shah Rukh Khan had done it? Heck, what if Shah Rukh's escort car had hit someone? The Nano gets so much attention simply because the car itself is newsworthy, not the fire.

Absolutely. Exactly what i wanted to convey. All eyes were set on the Nano and hence this publicity. (Both good & bad)

[amitk26]

Originally Posted by supremeBaleno

I sincerely hope you dont have to undergo other accidents in your quest to prove vehicle-build. I have had an accident (frontal) in one of the cheapest tin-boxes you referred and since I am still typing this here, they must be of super build-quality, going by your reasoning.

Again if you would have read the discussion was about the SIDE IMPACT not for frontal impact, thanks to EU NCAP everyone including tinbox manufacturers take care of front impact.

See Chevrolet cruiz advertisement in today's TOI where they show de-skinned car to differentiate from tin boxes. I hope you will understand what I am talking about.

Originally Posted by supremeBaleno

I guess you are referring to the Swift. If so, since I own one for the last 3 years, do I need a search to know the shortcomings of a car I drive ? And on the threads discussing those issues on tbhp, I am sure that no one comes saying, "Hey, its a Made in India car, so let us not run it down ourselves, to avoid being racist to ourselves" or "Hey, let us restrict the -ve comments to those that own Swifts. Why should non-owners post here?"

Well I have not faced anything in my Safari apart from problems when I filled kerosene and that was cleaned FOC to me so what it shows ?
Why exactly suspension bush going Kaput or turbo hose coming off and clutch issues ( few samples found on T-BHP) not an issue on swift but big issue if happens on TSK1979' s Safari ? So who has double standards here.

Yes they replaced so many components to find one faulty sensor but there are similar stories floating around.

Anyway this thread was about fire in nano and for comparison known incidences of Honda and Cheverolet beat were drawn in you are unnecessarily dragging it to QC and A.S.S issues.

[ACM]

Third party Statistics clearly based on facts don't seem to work to convince people of overreaction. (Clear number of deaths due to x issue vs 0 due to y issue)

One makes a point without taking specific names only hoping for a more balanced reaction to it.

Am signing off from this thread, sorry TATA and Nano, can't back you up any further, those least interested in ever procuring a TATA let alone a Nano, find this thread more interesting than others.

I guess this is going overboard and till there are any further inputs, all that is to be said by both sides on this thread has already been said. I guess there will be a 4th in the future, inspite of all actions and that will like the 3rd get even higher coverage. Lets wait for that one.

Obviously non buyers / non cosumers can't lead a case / protest to TATA and can only lead support to the buyers - who seem content if concerned for now.

[sanagg1]

Originally Posted by ACM

Third party Statistics clearly based on facts don't seem to work to convince people of overreaction. (Clear number of deaths due to x issue vs 0 due to y issue)

One makes a point without taking specific names only hoping for a more balanced reaction to it.

Am signing off from this thread, sorry TATA and Nano, can't back you up any further, those least interested in ever procuring a TATA let alone a Nano, find this thread more interesting than others.

Please don't do so.
Threre are many silent supporters for all your points and the heated discussions you and others have. This discussion is only educating this forum members.

thanks to all of you
Cheers

[shortbread]

I think what one should realise is that there are many out there who couldnt wait to get some sort of bad news on the Nano, wether it is true, false, contrived...is secondary. As long as it is bad news they are happy with it.

Its best not to argue with people who are so convinced about the 'impending doom'.

[supremeBaleno]

Originally Posted by amitk26

Again if you would have read the discussion was about the SIDE IMPACT not for frontal impact, thanks to EU NCAP everyone including tinbox manufacturers take care of front impact.

Well, if you followed the thread, this was about a car catching fire and not about Logans withstanding side-impact. And if at all personal sense of well-being in an accident were a criteria for occupant-safety of a car, there is no need for Euro-NCAP and such stuff. All someone has to do is say, "Hey, I was in a xxxx car, which got hit broadside by a tank/train. I am alive. So that is the safest car around".

[Theyota]

Folks lets not blindly support Tata Motors out of patriotism. In the long run it will hurt Tata Motors and Indian industry in general if we act like cheerleaders. We need to let Tata Motors know when they are wrong. Tata needs to man-up and not come up with excuses like it's only 4 cars that caught fire out of 50,000 cars on road today. 4 safety incidents out of 50,000 cars is a serious issue per industry standards and they have to accept it and fight to solve the problem.

[sanagg1]

Originally Posted by Theyota

We need to let Tata Motors know when they are wrong.
Tata needs to man-up and not come up with excuses

Lot of people (rather authorities in their fields like CEO's, chairmen etc.) educated TATA of the impossibility of producing 1L car. They are in business for more than ~100 years. (IIRC)

Man-up vs Excuse

TATA credit rating in world market frequently EXEEDS sovereign ratings.

Cheers

[Theyota]

Originally Posted by sanagg1

Lot of people (rather authorities in their fields like CEO's, chairmen etc.) educated TATA of the impossibility of producing 1L car. They are in business for more than ~100 years. (IIRC)

Man-up vs Excuse

TATA credit rating in world market frequently EXEEDS sovereign ratings.

Cheers

They are not in business of making cars for 100 years...they are literally still novices when it comes to building and selling cars......they have a lot to learn and we all want them to learn and be successful..Credit ratings have more to do with better cash flow management....

[Eddy]

Moderators Note: Please keep personal attacks and off topic content off the forum. Such posts will attract infraction from now on.

[amitk26]

Originally Posted by supremeBaleno

Well, if you followed the thread, this was about a car catching fire and not about Logans withstanding side-impact. And if at all personal sense of well-being in an accident were a criteria for occupant-safety of a car, there is no need for Euro-NCAP and such stuff. All someone has to do is say, "Hey, I was in a xxxx car, which got hit broadside by a tank/train. I am alive. So that is the safest car around".

Yes it was about nano catching fire then steered towards niggles/QC issues and A.S.S and then someone in context of robustness said no car even 10-11 Lakh one can survive side impact.

This is not about personal sense of well being. Indeed a few car manufacturers in their bread and butter model have features such as side impact bars and robust sheet metal which helps occupants survive side impact.

Originally Posted by Theyota

Folks lets not blindly support Tata Motors out of patriotism. In the long run it will hurt Tata Motors and Indian industry in general if we act like cheerleaders. We need to let Tata Motors know when they are wrong. Tata needs to man-up and not come up with excuses like it's only 4 cars that caught fire out of 50,000 cars on road today. 4 safety incidents out of 50,000 cars is a serious issue per industry standards and they have to accept it and fight to solve the problem.

IMHO this is just a number which TML did not provide to justify.
They just returned money of the person whose car burnt and rectified for others. Even one single fire is serious but then what was pointed out was this number is still smaller then others.

But why exactly we should not raise concern over some other manufacturers selling mainstream models in India which burnt and caused death when topic is fire ?
How much coverage Honda fire incidence and deaths in India received ?
Did Honda pay up anything even after accepting the fault and issuing recall on 30 Jan 2010 for a 10X costlier car ?

[Sutripta]

Hi everybody,
Just what is it that we are debating on this thread. As in 'The house believes that .......'
Or is it just a collection of raves and rants?

Regards
Sutripta

[KMohanan]

Thank you very much for the moderator intervention. The discussions in this thread has become very difficult to understand and connect with the topic itself !! I humbly request to make the postings as simple as possible so that the new comers to the team-bhp also can enjoy and participate. Also, request to kindly make the contents in technical written english, a lot of colloquial (spoken) and local words are also found in many places, which makes understanding difficult.

[supremeBaleno]

Originally Posted by amitk26

Indeed a few car manufacturers in their bread and butter model have features such as side impact bars and robust sheet metal which helps occupants survive side impact.

I am not sure why everything other than fire gets dragged into this thread. Now it is moving to sheet-metal and side-impact bars, which have no connection with cars on fire.

Originally Posted by amitk26

Even one single fire is serious but then what was pointed out was this number is still smaller then others.

If it is serious, should we not be discussing about it - why it happened, was the cause identified, what has been done to prevent it in future etc ? What is the point in saying that 6 fires is OK because Toyota recalled a million cars due to A-pedal issues or SLKs were recalled for some other reason ? IIRC there exists a thread for the Toyota-recall and would it not make sense for this to be discussed there ?

Originally Posted by amitk26

But why exactly we should not raise concern over some other manufacturers selling mainstream models in India which burnt and caused death when topic is fire ?

The topic is "Tata Nano fire incidents" and not "fire in cars". If it was the latter, any car on fire could be discussed. And there do exist separate threads for other car fires - what is the point in bringing them to discussion in this thread, which is only about Nano fires ?

Originally Posted by amitk26

How much coverage Honda fire incidence and deaths in India received ? Did Honda pay up anything even after accepting the fault and issuing recall on 30 Jan 2010 for a 10X costlier car ?

As mentioned earlier, why the media covers some incidents and not others can be answered by them only. As far as I know, the newspapers in Chennai cover any car-fire - have read numerous instances of various brands catching fire. Only difference I see in this case, is the Nanos being brand new cars, while the others have been old cars. Honda recall in 2010 is I believe for the NHCs which should be many years old now and which sold in large numbers. And BTW, 10X is assuming the Nano costs 1lakh. Given the current prices of Nano and average price of NHC, it is more like 4X.

Looks like tsk1979 had a premonition of how this thread will turn out to be - quoting below from his opening post.

Originally Posted by tsk1979

I think that in reply to this thread, there will be lots of news references to other cars catching fire too, but I would like to see news articles of other manufactures where a brand new car caught fire shortly after purchase.

Also, of the 2 causes pointed out by Tata for the fires, I can understand the fuel-line rupture, which I guess can be fixed by changing the defective part. But not sure about the "foreign object in exhaust" reason. Can the presence of a foreign object, say a rag in the exhaust pipe (of any car, not just the Nano) cause a fire ?

[amitk26]

Originally Posted by supremeBaleno

I am not sure why everything other than fire gets dragged into this thread. Now it is about which sheet-metal and side-impact bars. Don't see how collision-related stuff is relevant in this thread about cars catching fire.

Sort of selective amnasia ?? Scroll few posts back and see who brought in QA / Niggles / Safari and everything other then nano in this thread.