[kn09]

Originally Posted by arnabchak

Thanks KN.

I believe the upsize is 155/60R 13 and not 155/70R13. Pls. correct me if I am wrong.

Any indications for Ceat Milage or Dunlop?

Also, WR VXI is shod with JK tyres and not BS as you have mentioned.

The upgrade is 155/70r13,155/60r13 will lower your car and WR VXI came with bridgestone s322 and jk xps ultima as well

[s_pphilip]

Friends any inputs will be valuable here:
3 cars, 3 tire size suggestions required.

1)
Hyundai Sonata crdi Manufacture Specification - 215/60 R16
Current tyre - Potenza G3 206/60R16. (under tired as G3 wasn't in 215 size).
Comment: had grip, but tire at end of its life with uneven wear pattern (not uniform), harsh ride, don't know whether it is due to tire or suspension.
Upgrade planned - up size for more sidewall height for ride improvement and GC (marginal)
225/60R16

Checked link: http://www.tyrestore.in/upsizing.htm

checked chart: Recommended Tyre Upsize Chart.xls

Original – 215/60R16
Upgrade – 225/60R16
Percentage change – 1.81%

Now the local and online options are
Bridgestone Turanza GR90 and Apollo Acelere Max (I prefer comfort as Sonata is lethargic to drive spiritedly).

There is a huge difference of about 17k for a set of 4 tires between BS and Apollo, my question is are Apollo's capable of providing a comfy ride.

2)
Honda City ZX Gxi
Current Michelin Energy 175/65R14 (recently purchased)
Planned upgrade 195/60R14 on existing OE Alloys.
Oriented towards Yoko A-drives (not so pricey yet good).

Current – 175/65R14
Upgrade – 195/60R14
Percentage change – 1.11%

Don't want to change OE alloys but want to improve braking, this thought has cemented after my recent accident where better braking could have saved major accident repair expenses.
I hope it is a straightforward fit, please advice if I need to pay attention to anything.

3)
i10 Kappa 1.2 Asta MT
Current - 155/80R13. (end of tread, dad has to buy new tires)
Planned upgrade - 175/65R14 (swapping those new City ZX shoes here using OE i20 Alloys)

Current – 155/80R13
Upgrade – 175/65R14 (i20 alloys)
Percentage change – 0.85%

The reason for this swap is the Michelin's on the Honda are new and I won't get any exchange value when purchasing 195's and I cant hold myself back from upgrading the City ZX shoes as they feel unsafe after my accident, nothing to do with the existing Michelin's its just that everyone says broader footprint will help braking, fortunately even i10 will gain from increased surface print.

Now question, I went to Hyundai to inquire on OE i20 alloys and the SE said that suspension will have premature wear and tear due to the upgrade as i10 is not designed for 14 inch wheels. I had read that it was sold in the UK with 14inch and most i10's were exported from India which should make them compatible with Hyundai OE alloys, isn't it, so does the SE's caution hold ground.

There are many who have upgraded with after market 14 inch alloys.
I need to close on these options by the coming week, I am planning to borrow money from dad for the purchase as I am cash strapped and dad would be paying (literally) me a visit next week.

Beg, borrow, steal but the rides need them.
Also can tires be purchased online due to cost advantage, though need to work out the overalls, as charges for alignment and fitting is thrown in free by dealers.

Fabia Elegance Tdi (185/60R14) too needs a tire swap but the the current size has grip and is comfortable so no need to tinker with the sizes. Phew, that's a whole lot of moolah into footwear.

[kn09]

Originally Posted by s_pphilip

Friends any inputs will be valuable here:
3 cars, 3 tire size suggestions required.

1)
Hyundai Sonata crdi Manufacture Specification - 215/60 R16
Current tyre - Potenza G3 206/60R16. (under tired as G3 wasn't in 215 size).
Comment: had grip, but tire at end of its life with uneven wear pattern (not uniform), harsh ride, don't know whether it is due to tire or suspension.
Upgrade planned - up size for more sidewall height for ride improvement and GC (marginal)
225/60R16

Checked link: http://www.tyrestore.in/upsizing.htm

checked chart: Attachment 1271062

Original – 215/60R16
Upgrade – 225/60R16
Percentage change – 1.81%

Now the local and online options are
Bridgestone Turanza GR90 and Apollo Acelere Max (I prefer comfort as Sonata is lethargic to drive spiritedly).

There is a huge difference of about 17k for a set of 4 tires between BS and Apollo, my question is are Apollo's capable of providing a comfy ride.

2)
Honda City ZX Gxi
Current Michelin Energy 175/65R14 (recently purchased)
Planned upgrade 195/60R14 on existing OE Alloys.
Oriented towards Yoko A-drives (not so pricey yet good).

Current – 175/65R14
Upgrade – 195/60R14
Percentage change – 1.11%

Don't want to change OE alloys but want to improve braking, this thought has cemented after my recent accident where better braking could have saved major accident repair expenses.
I hope it is a straightforward fit, please advice if I need to pay attention to anything.

3)
i10 Kappa 1.2 Asta MT
Current - 155/80R13. (end of tread, dad has to buy new tires)
Planned upgrade - 175/65R14 (swapping those new City ZX shoes here using OE i20 Alloys)

Current – 155/80R13
Upgrade – 175/65R14 (i20 alloys)
Percentage change – 0.85%

Tyres for sonata-Apollo tyres have evolved with having Vredestein and their european technology these tyres are OE fitment for Audi and Mercedes in europe.The BS turanza are also good but the 17K premium over apollo is not justified according to me.

Tyres for the city-you have made a good choice,they offer the best of both worlds.But if you want a sporty thread pattern and AA traction look at the Yoko s drive and es100. Changing tyres wont make a big difference in braking,Check for EBC carbon ceramic brakes for your city they will surely increase your braking,they retail for around 6k

http://www.n1-racing.com/product_det...ml?product=n6c

Tyres for the i10-Upsizing to 14 inch wont make much of a difference,You will feel the drive is a bit more harsher as the sidewall size will be reduced and in the long run the amount of damage caused to the suspension will be bare minimum.I suggest you go ahead with the upgrade

[s_pphilip]

Originally Posted by kn09

Tyres for sonata-Apollo tyres have evolved with having Vredestein and their european technology these tyres are OE fitment for Audi and Mercedes in europe.The BS turanza are also good but the 17K premium over apollo is not justified according to me.

Tyres for the city-you have made a good choice,they offer the best of both worlds.But if you want a sporty thread pattern and AA traction look at the Yoko s drive and es100. Changing tyres wont make a big difference in braking,Check for EBC carbon ceramic brakes for your city they will surely increase your braking,they retail for around 6k

http://www.n1-racing.com/product_det...ml?product=n6c

Tyres for the i10-Upsizing to 14 inch wont make much of a difference,You will feel the drive is a bit more harsher as the sidewall size will be reduced and in the long run the amount of damage caused to the suspension will be bare minimum.I suggest you go ahead with the upgrade

Thanks kn09.
I may sound naive here but by braking improvement I meant I need those wheels to fight for traction, with the current 165 width, they give up and lock skidding to a halt which is scary, I am under the assumption broader tires due to a wider footprint will resist better.
I wont be zipping around and doing 100 to 0 and vice versa, its that I need to feel in control, to which the current set up contributes little, I love maintaining constant speeds though.
After the accident each time in the City, feels vulnerable, does not make me hate the car, only I am driving increasingly slower, keeping gaps, conversely Fab relaxes me, may be unwarranted paranoia with the accident repairs haunting me.

Yes I agree 17k makes Apollo so attractive and I hope there is no huge trade off in ride quality, I need to know this as I am not happy with the G3's comfort, maybe the suspension too is a culprit, so I am looking to improve it some way or the other. Vredestein tech or no, hope Acelere's ride comfy.

I favor Yoko's, the Fab has A-drives, they are worth and liked every moment with them, have good grip and are comfortable, maybe its Skoda quality but I'd feel I can associate that feel good to Yoko's as well, I think they have more grip than Michelin Energy.
Noise level does not matter much to me as both Sonata and Fabia are noisy diesels.

For i10, this is what I wanted to hear, feels good to know the suspension does not take a beating, I think I'll just go ahead with the up size, will have the swapped City's tires simply lying around else.

[kn09]

Originally Posted by s_pphilip

Thanks kn09.
I may sound naive here but by braking improvement I meant I need those wheels to fight for traction, with the current 165 width, they give up and lock skidding to a halt which is scary, I am under the assumption broader tires due to a wider footprint will resist better.

Yes I agree 17k makes Apollo so attractive and I hope there is no huge trade off in ride quality,

I favor Yoko's, the Fab has A-drives, they are worth and liked every moment with them, have good grip and are comfortable, maybe its Skoda quality but I'd feel I can associate that feel good to Yoko's as well, I think they have more grip than Michelin Energy.
Noise level does not matter much to me as both Sonata and Fabia are noisy diesels.

For your city i would suggest you to opt for Yoko ES100 or S drive,for size 195/60R14 the traction rating is AA which means you have lot of traction, grip and high speed stability.

As you mentioned that your car had met with an accident please make sure that your car is straight,as in go to the service station get in touch with a senior mechanic and ask him to check the front aprons.Make sure they are aligned and have no differences.If you change tyres on a car which is not straight then you will see a bald new tyre very soon.

You get very good ride quality in your fabia because of the car and its built quality,very less margin for the tyres.

Please do check the suspension of your sonata as BS potenza G3s are not that bad when it comes to ride quality also check if the ones you have are made in India or Japan there is a lot of difference in both the tyres,I Have used Japan made Potenza G3 and ride quality was good. Apollos acelere is good when it comes to ride quality VW Polo comes with these tyres and the ride quality is good.

[s_pphilip]

Originally Posted by kn09

For your city i would suggest you to opt for Yoko ES100 or S drive,for size 195/60R14 the traction rating is AA which means you have lot of traction, grip and high speed stability.

As you mentioned that your car had met with an accident please make sure that your car is straight,as in go to the service station get in touch with a senior mechanic and ask him to check the front aprons.Make sure they are aligned and have no differences.If you change tyres on a car which is not straight then you will see a bald new tyre very soon.

You get very good ride quality in your fabia because of the car and its built quality,very less margin for the tyres.

Please do check the suspension of your sonata as BS Potenza G3s are not that bad when it comes to ride quality also check if the ones you have are made in India or Japan there is a lot of difference in both the tyres,I Have used Japan made Potenza G3 and ride quality was good. Apollos Acelere is good when it comes to ride quality VW Polo comes with these tires and the ride quality is good.

Thanks kn09, I'll check with the Yoko dealers here on these two tires, parallely can I trust a Tyre purchased online, I ask this because I enquired there is a clean difference of Rs 350 per Tyre on A-drives, off course it does not include fitting charges which shouldn't be much anyways, whereas alignment, balancing and nitrogen will be charged extra by the dealer too. I think there is scope to bargain further with the dealer, I'll try telling him I can purchase them cheaper online.
Does Yoko have any schemes running currently like the vacuum cleaner or Jabra Bluetooth etc.

And yes I am struggling to figure a way out here, last service I requested the ASC to check the suspension and they said everything is okay, I told them the car is not too comfortable and asked them whether they drove it on rough roads and they replied affirmative, maybe their judgement is based on whether anything is broken or worn out and not on ride quality of Sonata.

Anyways I took it to the Bosch service center and he said the front bushes are worn, I replaced them but still am not satisfied, went again and he said though the rear bushes aren't worn out he could replace them and ride could improve, so in two minds.
Which is why I suspect the tires, I'll check them again but I believe I saw "Made in India" printed, I checked previously as I was surprised when I noted the Yoko's carry a Philippines tag and hence went around the others to check their origins.

On the i10, won't 14inch alloys marginally reduce the vertical movement/bounciness which should be a added benefit, but I don't know whether it will be that noticeable. 65 side profile should be good enough I believe, they currently carry 80 side profiles.

The writing is on the wall, I'll settle for Apollo's in 225 size, the price makes it hard to resist and Apollo seems to be going from strength to strength.

[kn09]

Originally Posted by s_pphilip

I told them the car is not too comfortable and asked them whether they drove it on rough roads and they replied affirmative, maybe their judgement is based on whether anything is broken or worn out and not on ride quality of Sonata.

Anyways I took it to the Bosch service center and he said the front bushes are worn, I replaced them but still am not satisfied, went again and he said though the rear bushes aren't worn out he could replace them and ride could improve, so in two minds.


On the i10, won't 14inch alloys marginally reduce the vertical movement/bounciness which should be a added benefit, but I don't know whether it will be that noticeable. 65 side profile should be good enough I believe, they currently carry 80 side profiles.

You can bargain with the dealers for a discount,Here at my dealer with new tyres alignment,balancing and nitrogen is offered for free.

I am not sure of the offers going on right now

what is the odo reading in your sonata if its 50k+ kms then is it almost time to change the shocks and other suspension parts. Most service stations lack experienced mechanics who can identify the problem.
Out of what i have experienced just changing lower arm bushes will not give you a solution, as these bushes are rarely original.Why dont you check at another Hyundai service station? Probably they might have better mechanics and might have a better solution.

Your i10's new sidewall length will be just 1.025 cm less than your present setup which will hardly make much difference on your ride quality,hence you wont be noticing much changes

[s_pphilip]

Originally Posted by kn09

As you mentioned that your car had met with an accident please make sure that your car is straight,as in go to the service station get in touch with a senior mechanic and ask him to check the front aprons.Make sure they are aligned and have no differences.If you change tyres on a car which is not straight then you will see a bald new tyre very soon.

Forgot to add and could not use the edit feature due to time window.

Regarding Apron, so is there a way to check this or can ASC the confirm using specialized equipments, I got the City repaired at the Bosch Service center, multiple reasons, one- accident occurred on sunday, didn't want to leave it someplace, two- I have good relations here as I take all my cars for regular check ups there, his workmanship and accountability is good and his facility is well tooled, three- Honda ASC in Goa is known to dilly dally and have high handed approach.

My friend who has the same 10 anniversary ZX Gxi (reason for my City, twin city concept) dashed into a Rick while crawling and only the bumper dislodged to the left, we all thought the car was fine, took it to ASC and they took 2 months to repair, importantly they said the apron was bent and my friend acknowledges it was visibly misaligned.

Which is why I have this question, are there only visual methods to check it or is there some measurable way, I had far greater impact/damage (twice my friends repair bill) and the Bosch Service guy maintains that the Apron hasn't been damaged, I had checked alignment 3 days before the accident and after I got the car repaired I did the alignment again and it needed corrections, how else would it get misaligned in a few hundred kms. The alignment guys handed the car back saying job done without any other negative comments.

Now I know we can check this by driving in a straight line but what if the damage is so minimal that everybody associates the misalignment to the road surface, wind etc, so is there any other way to confirm damage to the Apron, Honda City/Amaze really are delicate babies.

[kn09]

Originally Posted by s_pphilip

Which is why I have this question, is there only a visual methods to check it or is there some measurable way
Now I know we can check this by driving in a straight line but what if the damage is so minimal that everybody associates the misalignment to the road surface, wind etc, so is there any other way to confirm damage to the Apron, Honda City/Amaze really are delicate babies.

Driving in a straight line at speeds above 80 and if you feel the car is wobbling then your apron is seriously misaligned.

These issues are very hard to identify visually,Some services stations have car-o-liner equipment which optically checks the body alignment,but mostly people use the conventional method of manually measuring the distance between the right and left aprons with reference to the rear setup,they use predefined values for measurement.

Are there any car tuners who prepare race cars in Goa? They are the best people who can help you with the apron alignment as they have to ensure their cars are properly aligned.

[s_pphilip]

Originally Posted by kn09

what is the odo reading in your sonata if its 50k+ kms then is it almost time to change the shocks and other suspension parts. Most service stations lack experienced mechanics who can identify the problem.
Out of what i have experienced just changing lower arm bushes will not give you a solution, as these bushes are rarely original.Why dont you check at another Hyundai service station? Probably they might have better mechanics and might have a better solution.

Yes that's something I can do, the thing is taking the car to ASC's is a half day job even for check ups.
So what parts of the suspension needs to be changed/beefed up, for a change I can do the talking there.
The cars done 95k kms.

Sorry Mods, don't really how to merge with the subsequent post. I'll research about this but the time window may expire.

[s_pphilip]

Originally Posted by kn09

Are there any car tuners who prepare race cars in Goa? They are the best people who can help you with the apron alignment as they have to ensure their cars are properly aligned.

I don't know of any, can research on this, but I could drive it to Mumbai/Pune/Bangalore whenever possible and check it there, I won't feel comfortable unless somebody signs it as perfect.
The car does not wobble at speeds but I feel it drifts to one side very slightly, this again can be my worry talking.

Sorry I don't know how to merge this post with the earlier, I quoted separate posts.

[kn09]

Originally Posted by s_pphilip

Yes that's something I can do, the thing is taking the car to ASC's is a half day job.
So what parts of the suspension needs to be changed/beefed up.
The cars done 95k kms.

Originally Posted by s_pphilip

I don't know of any, can research on this, but I could drive it to Mumbai/Pune/Bangalore whenever possible and check it there, I won't feel comfortable unless somebody signs it as perfect.
The car does not wobble at speeds but I feel it drifts to one side very slightly, this again can be my worry talking.

Suspension parts that needs to be changed if required:
1.Shocks
2.Lower arms
3.Tie rods (if they have play)
4. Alignment bushes

If you wish to upgrade contact petes for Bilstein B6 shocks and powerflex polyurethane bushes.This upgrade will surely put a smile on your face every time you drive your car

If you go to Bangalore then red rooster performance is the best bet,they prepare rally and race cars so I guess their certificate will put you back in the comfort zone

[s_pphilip]

Originally Posted by kn09

Some services stations have car-o-liner equipment which optically checks the body alignment,

Originally Posted by kn09

Suspension parts that needs to be changed if required:
1.Shocks
2.Lower arms
3.Tie rods (if they have play)
4. Alignment bushes

If you wish to upgrade contact petes for Bilstein B6 shocks and powerflex polyurethane bushes.This upgrade will surely put a smile on your face every time you drive your car

If you go to Bangalore then red rooster performance is the best bet,they prepare rally and race cars so I guess their certificate will put you back in the comfort zone

I'll ask around about the Car-O-Liner, if Maruti ASC has it I try to use my relations to get it hoisted on that.

I'd love too try Pete's but I am not someone with deep pockets, currently just the regular middle class guy fighting my way up, of course I love cars so spend on them defying logic.
I am the sort of guy who'd research on the expenses part and then take the plunge as I can't dump the project mid way due to wrong assumptions, I am from Kerala so have the Mallu habit of over analyzing (no offence meant to anyone, just referring to myself).
But I've always wanted to visit Red Rooster, I'll do that when I am in B'lore, maybe get these checks done while trying to get to know this place better.

[kn09]

Originally Posted by s_pphilip

I'll ask around about the Car-O-Liner, if Maruti ASC has it I try to use my relations to get it hoisted on that.

I'd love too try Pete's but I am not someone with deep pockets, currently just the regular middle class guy fighting my way up, of course I love cars so spend on them defying logic.
I am the sort of guy who'd research on the expenses part and then take the plunge as I can't dump the project mid way due to wrong assumptions, I am from Kerala so have the Mallu habit of over analyzing (no offence meant to anyone, just referring to myself).
But I've always wanted to visit Red Rooster, I'll do that when I am in B'lore, maybe get these checks done while trying to get to know this place better.

I am a mallu too and you are so true about the habit of over analyzing

[s_pphilip]

Originally Posted by kn09

I am a mallu too and you are so true about the habit of over analyzing

Wow, you too, we are all over T-BHP, aren't we, talk about a community with common traits intersecting with a community with common interests, like in a venn diagram, so we have common traits and interests, makes a stand out breed.

I can't recollect a better term for a similar diaspora.