[ArizonaJim]

Originally Posted by vidyasagar

Dear All,
Is there a trick I am missing here? Kindly let me know your views.

The gearbox has many traits of the old British gearboxes so it is a bit more difficult to use than the Japanese motorcycles.
My UCE is also fussy about being shifted out of 1st or 2nd gear into neutral when the bike is stopped.
That said, if the clutch lever is not adjusted correctly, the problem will be much more noticeable.
When the motorcycle is stationary with the engine running and the clutch lever pulled in, there is still some drag between the rotating clutch plates being powered by the engine and the stationary clutch plates that drive the transmission. This results in the gears trying to drive the stationary rear wheel which in turn creates a load on the part of the gears that engage one another to transmit the power. (These projections between the gears are called, "dogs".)

With the dogs loaded, they do not want to slide easily to disengage so, you must apply more force to the shift lever than you would need to do if the engine is not running. The end result of this is, when the dogs finally do release, all of that extra power you needed to use to disengage them ends up slamming the next gears dogs into engagement so, rather than ending up in neutral, you end up in the next gear.

Getting back to the clutch, if it is not fully releasing, this problem with the dogs disengaging will be much worse.

The bottom line is, check your clutch lever adjustment by lightly moving the clutch lever just enough to take up the slack in the cable. There should be a gap of about 2 to 3mm of clearance between the movable lever and the bracket that holds the cable to the handlebar. If the gap is greater than this, the clutch is not fully releasing.

To adjust this gap, look at the lower end of the clutch cable. You will see that it is held in place with a adjustable fitting and a lock nut.
Loosen the lock nut and turn the fitting to correct the cable adjustment. When it is correct, tighten the lock nut.
Do not adjust the cable to remove all of the play or clearance at the clutch lever. It must have some clearance or the clutch will never fully be engaged and the clutch plates will wear out.

If the clutch lever clearance is set to the 2 to 3mm gap, sorry, that's as good as it gets so, remember to shift into neutral while the motorcycle is still moving.

[vidyasagar]

Dear AJ, Navin,

Thank you for the detailed explanation, you also answered my next question, about why is the difference between the scenario of engine running and not running. The clutch play is proper, I guess I need more practice with the gear lever.

I have one additional question, on my silencer, I have a discoloration (picture attached). I understand if the discoloration if it happens on the bent pipe due to heat, any hints on what such discoloration means, and if I should get something checked?

Many thanks in advance

[ArizonaJim]

Originally Posted by vidyasagar

Dear AJ, Navin,

Thank you for the detailed explanation, you also answered my next question, about why is the difference between the scenario of engine running and not running. The clutch play is proper, I guess I need more practice with the gear lever.

I have one additional question, on my silencer, I have a discoloration (picture attached). I understand if the discoloration if it happens on the bent pipe due to heat, any hints on what such discoloration means, and if I should get something checked?

Many thanks in advance

Unless I'm mistaken, the silencer on the Royal Enfield UCE powered motorcycles has a catalytic converter inside of it.
These generate a lot of heat as they burn off any of the hydrocarbons that weren't burned in the engine. That heat will discolor the chrome plating that's on the outside of the silencer.
It's nothing to worry about.

[ashwinprakas]

Originally Posted by navin_v8

Mate it should slot into the neutral that way.

Originally Posted by ArizonaJim

The gearbox has many traits of the old British gearboxes so it is a bit more difficult to use than the Japanese motorcycles.

Originally Posted by vidyasagar

I guess I need more practice with the gear lever.

I guess you guys missed the humor in my previous post.

The difficulty in finding neutral has nothing to do with British or Japanese or Indian gear boxes unless you're referring to the Kawasaki ones with Positive Neutral Finder.

It is an inherent trait of a constant mesh transmission with Neutral in Between 1st and 2nd to;

1. Only Shift Right with the Rear Wheel(Output Shaft) in motion, this applies to transmissions where Neutral is first as well or to put simply, all constant mesh transmissions. As due to being a constant mesh(cassette type) transmission it needs the rotation of the output shaft to facilitate the dogs to properly slot in and out.

2. Slip into 2nd from 1st without remaining in Neutral. The reason for which being that Neutral is the GAP between two shifter forks on the same rod slotting two different dogs(1st OUT, 2nd IN), a little imagination goes a long way! If you find it hard then the below diagram would be of help.



So I guess you guys can see why its quite easy to miss neutral.

But then why is it easy to shift into Neutral with the engine Off?

With the engine off both the shafts are stationary and all that is required for Neutral to happen is for the shifter fork to slot out of 1st but at the same time due to the output shaft being stationary it doesn't slot into 2nd so easily.

Now that we have the basics covered lets discuss why on some motorcycles irrespective of them being Kawasaki's its easier to find neutral compared to the rest.

This has got to do with the difference in design of the gear shift lever assembly which is the part to which the shifter you shift is connected to;



Shift Drum Stopper;



And finally, the Shift Drum Guide;



Couldn't find ideal pictures so had to make do with what I could find. Also do note that there are other minor/major parts that can affect the quality of shifting but if I get into the details it might just bring unnecessary confusion.

Now you guys might be thinking that there'd be a specific pattern/combination of types of the above parts a particular manufacturer would follow that would enable it to shift slicker than the rest, right?

Not exactly, from experience I've seen both Japanese and Indian manufacturers use different setups or at least updated them from model to model or different iterations of the same model.

Example:

Same Manufacturer: Try shifting on a Hero Honda Karizma and then a CBZ Xtreme.

Same Product: Try shifting on following variants of the Pulsar 220, a Pre-2011 model followed by a Post-2012 model and then finally a Post-2017 model.

In either of the above cases you'd find a stark difference in quality of shifting and that simply is how it is.

In short, don't bother much about it(because there's not much you can really do than adapt) and keep riding, make sure to change your oil more frequently as you can now imagine the number of parts that slide around to get things done, so an oil that is already contaminated would give you a hard time, the worst of which being false neutrals.

Plus it goes without saying, be gentle but firm with the shifter and dont hesitate to rock her(the motorcycle, as in to and fro) a little cause going ape-crap crazy on the shifter only ensures that you'd bend your shifter forks out of sync, and trust me, you don't want that.

A little more data and this post could've been a separate thread.

[adrian]

Originally Posted by vidyasagar

Dear AJ, Navin,
what such discoloration means, and if I should get something checked?

That very place where the discoloration has occurred is the place where they weld the silencer together after installing the exhaust baffle. Now a days the quality of company exhaust has gone so low that many new motorcycles are developing rust which leads to perforation in the very area.

So the discoloration means that you should stay alert and claim for a replacement under warranty at the first sight of rust or a crack

@ArizonaJim - Sir, You are right about the catalytic converter...but the same is located in the bend pipe near the bend pipe silencer joint (near the front right foot peg).

[SJM1214]

Royal Enfield may stop selling 500cc bikes from next year.

Royal Enfield is reportedly planning to stop producing 500cc motorcycles since the Bharat Stage VI emission norms will make them unviable. The company will upgrade its line up of 350cc motorcycles instead for Indian markets and promote its 650cc motorcycles as its primary export drivers.

The push rod architecture of the existing 350cc and 500cc Royal Enfield engines do not meet the BS VI emission norms and have to be phased out, Livemint reported. The high cost of upgrading the 500cc engine and low demand make the endeavour unviable for Indian market.

News Source.

[MechPrasad]

Hi I am new here.

In Hyderabad there is an aftermarket sprag clutch available for around 2100, go for it.
Works great.

[MechPrasad]

Originally Posted by Randhawa

@KA18@Stnair

The way I do it is by engaging in first gear with engine off, use your fingers to just slide the chain on first two notches of the front sprocket. Once you feel the link of the chain is hooked on to the sprocket then gently use the kick to rotate the chain over the sprocket, once you see the chain drop just near the kick shaft then disengage the gear and pull the chain through. Thats all. You might find it a bit tricky but it's really easy once you get the hang of it.

Reason I use the first gear is because the chain is quite heavy and when the front sprocket is spinning free, the chain drops off the sprocket. So in gear in keeps it from sliding backward.

Dont even make the mistake of pulling off the Rh side engine cover.

The last part, should we not remove the right side engine cover?

I did that recently to clean the sludge that had been built up near the front sprocket since ages.

Put it back using a gasket maker, no leaks yet.

Just the alternator wire coming ouyof the case was leaking sime, fixed that with some more gasket maker and mseal.



But why would you say that bro, I'm a bit tensed now.

[Randhawa]

Originally Posted by MechPrasad

The last part, should we not remove the right side engine cover?

I did that recently to clean the sludge that had been built up near the front sprocket since ages.

Put it back using a gasket maker, no leaks yet.

Just the alternator wire coming ouyof the case was leaking sime, fixed that with some more gasket maker and mseal.



But why would you say that bro, I'm a bit tensed now.

It's been a decade so I vaguely remember some things in details now, but I think it was due to the gasket and the O-rings. There is a small o-ring on the casing where the oil goes to the crank and bearings, if by mistake you drop it then the crank will hardly get any oil to the main bearings and damage will occur.

[MechPrasad]

Noted, I did keep that in mind while opening the case bro. That's very very crucial afterall.

Thanks

[Malhi]

Hello everyone, this is my first post on this forum. Kindly do correct me if I am on the wrong thread or posting my query incorrectly.

Coming to the post. I have a Ds 500 2013 model with around 22k+ on the odo. A couple of months back I did a detailed service: replaced the cone set, spark plugs, all rubber pipes, kush rubber, faulty reserve fuel sensor, fuel pump (had gone kaput once came back to life later, couldn’t risk it), swing arm bushes, accelerator wire, front and rear wheel bearings (one was squeaky) etc.

The issue is regarding the spark plugs. The older ones were, to my horror, oily and dirty black. My initial deduction was that the piston and the connecting rod setup needs inspection but then I decided to wait in order to be absolutely sure. Now because the bike had been with my father for the past 3 years, who relishes lugging the engine the old school way and does not ride more than a few kilometres every alternate day, I decided to give the benefit of doubt to the ds regarding the oily plugs.

Since the service i have ridden around 300 kms in the city but kept the revs above comfortable levels but no where near the upper limits. The whole idea was to not to lug. So yesterday I went to the service centre to get the fuel sensor replaced which had gone kaput again and also got the spark plugs inspected. The good part is that the plugs weren’t oily but sadly for me they were full of black carbon and yes the engine was emitting black smoke on hard revs. According to the mech the throttle assembly sensors were the culprit and hence the whole assembly needed replacement. During my earlier visit he had repositioned one of the censors which, according to him was one his “tricks”, did not work.

I have a couple of questions in my mind:

-Can the wet plugs be ignored altogether or does it take more kms to get them really wet?

-Is the mech right? Do I have to replace the throttle body and shell out around 9k?

- Is it the piston?

- Is it the intake valve?

Ps- the air filter and the air pipe(?) is new. Pick up of the bike increased considerably after I got the plugs cleaned, it felt like a 5hp all over again.

[ashwinprakas]

Originally Posted by Malhi

-Can the wet plugs be ignored altogether or does it take more kms to get them really wet?

If your valve stem seals are leaking or if your piston rings are weak then the spark plug would be wet in no time after startup.

Personal suggestion would be to not let luggers ride the motorcycle, not only do they wear down the cylinder but they're also detrimental for the life of your crank bearings.

-Is the mech right? Do I have to replace the throttle body and shell out around 9k?

If you have money to spend, I'd advice you to scrap that abomination of an FI system and go for a carb setup.

Hitchcock sells it for a kidney but at the same time Indimotard sells it for about 9k, it's a one time fix.

RE really should be ashamed for selling that crap to Indian consumers when international variants were provided with closed loop FI systems.

- Is it the piston?

Unlikely since there is no wetness after replacing the plugs, but running extremely rich to the extent that the motorcycle is smoking would wear down your cylinder kit in a really short period of time courtesy a phenomenon called Bore Wash, Google it.

- Is it the intake valve?

I think you mean valve stem oil seals, this is also unlikely as the plug remains dry.

Cheers,
A.P.

[Malhi]

If you have money to spend, I'd advice you to scrap that abomination of an FI system and go for a carb setup.

Hitchcock sells it for a kidney but at the same time Indimotard sells it for about 9k, it's a one time fix.

RE really should be ashamed for selling that crap to Indian consumers when international variants were provided with closed loop FI systems.

I haven’t really given it a serious thought yet but I’ll keep it in mind. Having replaced the fuel pump very recently I don’t think I’ll go for a carb conversion anytime soon.

Any advice on resetting of the ECU? Could it help if the issue is really with one of the sensors?

I must also add that the engine check light lights up again momentarily during the self start and stays on for a couple of seconds after the engine has come to life.

Thanks for the suggestions.

[Roy.S]

Originally Posted by ashwinprakas

RE really should be ashamed for selling that crap to Indian consumers when international variants were provided with closed loop FI systems.
...

Is there any way to upgrade the system on a 2011 Classic 500 to the closed loop system? I'm not actually going to do this because it seems to be too much trouble and I don't ride that often. My query is more academic rather than something I'd go ahead with.
I also have similar feelings about changing over to a rear disc brake but again its not worth the effort and money.

[ashwinprakas]

Originally Posted by Roy.S

Is there any way to upgrade the system on a 2011 Classic 500 to the closed loop system?

The new BS6 variants sport a Closed Loop system but would anyone want to really go that route is the question.

Cause going for a Carburetor Retrofit actually makes sense both financially and practically, if you're not fine with spending the 9k then you could get a BS29/32 from Bajaj for 3k or less(RE Sells the same for 5~6k), users on this forum has done it if I'm not wrong.

And as time goes when your wiring harness or ECU gives up, you could swap them for the ones that come on the Bullet 500 as the earlier versions came with Carburetors even though they sport the same engine as the C500.

The advantage of the Hitchcock or Indimotard kit is that its practically a plug and play system that piggybacks the TPS on the ECU.

I also have similar feelings about changing over to a rear disc brake but again its not worth the effort and money.

Now this is an interesting discussion myself and a fellow enthusiast have been pondering over the idea for another motorcycle of his, which is a custom build.

But let's get one thing clear, if improved braking performance is what you're looking for then this in not the way to go, cause from personal experience the drum locks up the rear just as easily as the disk does considering unlike the front the rear is equipped with a single pot caliper.

The potential advantage gained from a disc conversion at the rear is practicality when it comes to maintenance and extended life of the hub, as anyone can tell you replacing the rear brake pads on a disc setup is literally the easiest maintenance you can do on a motorcycle and the whole process takes less than a few minutes compared to removing the rear wheel to replace the shoes of a drum brake.

As for the life of the hub, the drum brake shoes eats away at the hub and over time you're left with the option to either replace the hub or recondition it at the lathe by inserting a sleeve, which is tedious and expensive compared to swapping the rear rotor.

Go figure.

Regards,
A.P.