[jumanji]

Originally Posted by jumanji

Hi all, mine is 2014 V MT and last month I changed 2 tyres (after 27.5K kms) at a 3rd party tyre vendor and during that time he did wheel alignment but the steering alignment went for a toss. If i keep the steering wheeel centered the car would drift right......
.....
Any idea what could be done? Or what could be wrong?
Note: The car has warranty until may 2018

Just adding that new tyres were initially tried in the front wheels and later in the rear but it didn't make any difference. The new ones are now in the front.

[OSH]

Originally Posted by jumanji

Any idea what could be done? Or what could be wrong?

The answer to your question of what could be wrong is, the guys who did the alignment adjusted the toe without holding the steering dead centre. It is a very common mistake, thats the reason you see so many taxis/commercial vehicles with an off centre steering wheel. The correct way to do this is, make a person sit in the drivers seat and hold the steering tight and firmly in it's dead centre while another person goes under the car to do the adjustments. The issue you face is because the person went down did the adjustment on one side first(which tilted the steering) and then without realising went ahead with the other side, now the computer can only guide the adjustments of the wheels and not the steering so the guy had no clue that he had aligned the wheels but with an off centre steering wheel. I am sure he must have not even kept track of what the total toe was i.e. L toe + R toe.

Here's the answer to what could be done, there are two options basically; open up the steering wheel and centre it or keep trying to adjust the L toe and R toe till the steering centres(this will be very painstaking because you dont have the total L + R toe). I'll give you a brief idea of both the options. Experts please correct me if I'm wrong.

Option 1. Take the car only and only to the authorised service center as your warranty is valid and ask them to dismantle the steering airbag/hornpad etc to reach the bolt connecting the steering column. This will have to be loosened to get back the steering to the centre and then retorqued to specifications. This has to be done when the wheels are also dead straight, basically car will be switched off with the steering off centre but wheels straight, then steering wheel opened and adjusted so that the next time the car starts both the wheels and steering is dead centre.

Option 2. Keep on adjusting the L toe and R toe till the steering gets to the centre, meaning if you are taking away 0.10 from the left then add 0.10 to the right and visa versa. Keep in mind that the total toe should not change at any given time, if this happens the car will not drive straight but will rather pull to one side. I don't remember which thread but someone had mentioned that this method should be used only for slight adjustments and not 10 - 11 o'clock kind of adjustment.

I would advise you to talk to a technician of your service center first and only then go ahead. Afterall they know these things better than us.

[saket77]

Originally Posted by OSH

Option 1. Take the car only and only to the authorised service center as your warranty is valid and ask them to dismantle the steering airbag/hornpad etc to reach the bolt connecting the steering column. This will have to be loosened to get back the steering to the centre and then retorqued to specifications. This has to be done when the wheels are also dead straight, basically car will be switched off with the steering off centre but wheels straight, then steering wheel opened and adjusted so that the next time the car starts both the wheels and steering is dead centre.

This is the best and the fastest option to cure this problem. Often fresh alignment results in this issue and then the steering must be re-centered which can be done by the procedure outlined above. I don't know why the OP's issue was not resolved even after the car was sent for resolution, that too twice!
For these reasons, one must try to accompany the car on the service floor.

Regards,
Saket.

Edit: Just noticed that they attempted 4 times to correct the issue and still this issue is unresolved!

[Leoshashi]

Originally Posted by saket77

Often fresh alignment results in this issue and then the steering must be re-centered which can be done by the procedure outlined above.

This issue happens because the technician cuts corners somewhere. If every single procedure is followed, then the steering wheel should be absolutely straight. Some of the common errors I have seen mechanics doing are:

1. Not using alignment heads on the rear axle(thinking it's a dead axle anyway).

2. Not paying attention to the thrust angle. Or the car isn't completely straight during the alignment. Some current gen alignment machines(like from Hunter) can compensate even if the car isn't completely parallel to the lift or alignment pit.

3. Not locking the steering wheel during alignment.

4. Iffy calibration of the alignment machine.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NuXuRNOWSEI

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4cJ18D-r1BY

Regards,
Shashi

[OSH]

Originally Posted by saket77

Just noticed that they attempted 4 times to correct the issue and still this issue is unresolved.

My guess is that they are following the second option, OP did mention a slight improvement of the steering angle after 4 attempts but I feel this option can do more harm than good. I say this because their way of doing option 2 is also wrong, what they are doing is keeping the steering centre(so wheels will be slightly tilted) and changing the toe to match the steering which is wrong. It should be the other way round, keep wheels straight(so steering is off centre) and then keep on adjusting till the steering gets back to the centre. I only fear one thing, the guys may tighten/loosen the bolts over the specified limits to overcome this issue and this is what will cause more harm then good.

BTW as you said, nowadays you have to be present when anyone works on our cars, even I'm a firm believer of this.

Originally Posted by Leoshashi

Some of the common errors I have seen mechanics doing are:
.
.
3. Not locking the steering wheel.

This is most probably the cause of the OP's off centre steering.

[jumanji]

@OSH, Saket and Sashi - Thanks a bunch for the detailed responses. I am following up with Capital Honda and will keep the forum posted again. Vehicle is due for its next service and will be picked up next week or so. This issue will again be looked into. The service center was candid in admitting that their alignment machine is having issues amd were getting the alignment done at a 3rd party. I have asked them to see if they can get alignment issue be taken care by their Mount road branch near airport. Worst case i myself will get it done there. I should mention that about 1.5 yrs ago similar issue had cropped up when i got the alignment done at my hometown but it was fixed in one shot at capital honda.

[hardilip]

Hello Everyone,

This is post on behalf of my friend, I have posted this in another thread as it was more relevant but sharing link here (below) as it is more specific to City [2014].

It will be of great help if you can have a look at the story in the below link and give some advice.

http://www.team-bhp.com/forum/techni...ml#post4287713

Thanks in advance. help!

[knight.rider]

Hello Everyone!
My car, a 2014 CVT has just completed 38000 kms. I am driving roughly 1000 kms per month since I got it on 1st Oct 2014. Not many niggles yet. The car is with me through thick and thin...
Some things we went through:-
My SF sonic OEM battery just went flat on me 6 months ago. So, it lasted my car for only 2.5 years.
Someone broke the rear windshield of my car by dropping a slab on it so had to replace it for around 10k.
The tyre alignment goes very soon.

The only issue i get now is that it feels that the car wobbles at low speeds upto 40kph and then it settles down. In hindi, we can say its a dug- dug feeling. Now starting to feel that its not safe to drive it anymore for long distances. Or I may get stuck anywhere.
Done alignment, balancing and rotations at a very good shop. The tyres have been visually inspected from time to time. I follow all Alignment and balancing schedules, tyre pressure too is maintained with the digital nitrogen air at 33 psi all tyres. Any suggestions are welcome!

[for_cars1]

During the next service, I'm planning to get a small dent on the panel corrected.
I could actually get this done at a competent independent garage, but I always felt that the paint quality would be as per honda standards in the authorized Honda center.

Among Dakshin, Magnum, Whitefield and Trident Honda service centers, please let me know from your experience which has better dent removal and paint workmanship.

[hserus]

Originally Posted by for_cars1

During the next service, I'm planning to get a small dent on the panel corrected.
I could actually get this done at a competent independent garage, but I always felt that the paint quality would be as per honda standards in the authorized Honda center.

Among Dakshin, Magnum, Whitefield and Trident Honda service centers, please let me know from your experience which has better dent removal and paint workmanship.

If you want a independent garage with good paint quality there is this.

http://www.team-bhp.com/forum/bangal...bangalore.html

[OSH]

Originally Posted by hardilip

It will be of great help if you can have a look at the story in the below link and give some advice.

Looking at the pics, it looks like a lost cause trying to get such a car back running.

1. The entire front end was submerged in water which would have shot all the electricals for sure.
2. Even though your friend says he didn't crank the engine, there are chances that there will be some sort of engine work because it was completely under water and i expect a lot of other mechanical work as well when they open up everything.
3. The interiors are also gone, carpets, seats etc all will need changing.

Is the insurance company even ready to do the repairs ? The bill will very much cross his IDV. Some days back another BHPian from Mumbai was given a total estimate of some 3 lakhs IIRC and his case was not even this severe.

Your friend's car looks like a wreck and getting it back to shape will be a task in itself, even if they do everything I don't think it will be as reliable as before because electrical problems are very difficult to diagnose/solve.

It will be better to take the IDV, add some money and go for a new City or else buy a second hand City of the same vintage/kms.

If your friend does want his car repaired, because he has zero dep, ask him to instruct the service center to change nearly everything. Ask him not to try and savage any parts, looking at the pictures nearly all the front components(mechanical/interiors) will need changing.

Originally Posted by knight.rider

The tyre alignment goes very soon.

The only issue i get now is that it feels that the car wobbles at low speeds upto 40 kph and then it settles down. In hindi, we can say its a dug- dug feeling.

I follow all Alignment and balancing schedules, tyre pressure too is maintained with the digital nitrogen air at 33 psi all tyres.

Have you got the suspension checked ? Failed suspension components can lead to the car not absorbing bumps and leading to an unstable ride. By dugdug if you mean noise then there is a 90% chance that it's a suspension problem.

Another reason is tyres, but you say that tyres were inspected for bulges/deformities. Can you try using air instead of nitrogen for some days and see if it makes a difference. Also maintain the recommended tyre pressure of 32-30 and see if anything changes. 33 front-back seems high for a comfortable ride, AFAIK same front-back air pressures is recommended only for hatchbacks.

[Altocumulus]

Originally Posted by hardilip

Hello Everyone,

This is post on behalf of my friend, I have posted this in another thread as it was more relevant but sharing link here (below) as it is more specific to City [2014].

It will be of great help if you can have a look at the story in the below link and give some advice.

http://www.team-bhp.com/forum/techni...ml#post4287713

Thanks in advance. help!

Its better to push for Total Loss. The car will never be back to its original form. Also the history will show as flood affected so resale will be a nightmare and will push the value even lower.

This is the reason I will go for the 'Return to Invoice' rider when I renew next year. It's a small price to pay for a peace of mind.

[hardilip]

Originally Posted by hardilip

Hello Everyone,

This is post on behalf of my friend, I have posted this in another thread as it was more relevant but sharing link here (below) as it is more specific to City [2014].

It will be of great help if you can have a look at the story in the below link and give some advice.

http://www.team-bhp.com/forum/techni...ml#post4287713

Thanks in advance. help!

Update: Honda ASC has given a quote of 11L (incl Transmission and Engine). If they are not be replaced approx quote of 4L might come down, thereby making it difficult to revive the car considering his IDV (5.81L).

a) If he opts for total loss, what would be the procedure? How long does insurance takes to close the deal? ASC guys have told him that it will take more than 1 - 1.5 months where the customer has to push insurance to find a buyer (scrap agent) and close the deal.

Can someone throw some light on how Total loss procedure works?

Can speeding up of total loss be done by buying a new car from the same showroom?

b) Also, will it be a option to get the car ready by a reliable local garage person? Assuming the quote will be around 2.5L (just a gus-timate)

We are really confused and willing to hear all different options so that we shall have a peace of mind in this regards (if at all we get peace of mind) :(

[OSH]

Originally Posted by hardilip

Update: Honda ASC has given a quote of 11L (incl Transmission and Engine). If they are not be replaced approx quote of 4L might come down, thereby making it difficult to revive the car considering his IDV (5.81L).

The second sentence meant that the insurance company will not agree for repairs right ? Couldn't understand the sentence.

If he opts for total loss, what would be the procedure?
.
Can someone throw some light on how Total loss procedure works?

BHPian The Great would be your best bet to solve any insurance related doubts/queries but because you are a newbie and can't send PMs, I will ask him to reply here.

Also, will it be a option to get the car ready by a reliable local garage person? Assuming the quote will be around 2.5L (just a gus-timate)

How will they procure all the OEM parts ? Mechanicals we can think about but what about electrical components which are Honda specific such as various control units/PCBs and the sorts aren't available with 3rd party vendors. There are many questions which he should ask himself first. Does he know any such garages ? Will they be able to literally pull apart an entire car and assemble it again like the authorised service center ? Will he trust an unknown/unauthorised person to carry out things like changing airbag modules/changing the electrical systems etc ?

And BTW the outside quote will never get to just 2.5 lakhs if Honda has estimated 11 lakhs. You can expect only some 1-2 lakhs less tops because even the outside garage will have to buy parts from Honda only, you will only save on labour but then you should remember that Honda will have trained labour compared to that outside garage.

We are really confused and willing to hear all different options so that we shall have a peace of mind in this regards.

I would say go ahead and let them declare it a total loss and buy another car(new/used), but if your friend is hell bent on repairing then trust only your dealer and no one else.

[The Great]

Originally Posted by hardilip

a) If he opts for total loss, what would be the procedure? How long does insurance takes to close the deal? ASC guys have told him that it will take more than 1 - 1.5 months where the customer has to push insurance to find a buyer (scrap agent) and close the deal.

Can someone throw some light on how Total loss procedure works?

Procedure:
The insurance company appoints a surveyor who will assess the total damages, if these damages are in excess of 70% of your IDV - Total loss can be assessed. The insurance company (generally the surveyor too) will help in finding the salvage buyers (scrap buyers) and whatever amount the salvage buyer offers the difference will be paid by the insurance company. Mostly this should be a smooth procedure. I do not know why your service station is scaring your friend. Don't worry the insurance companies have their set of salvage buyers handy.

Documents involved:
Claim form, Service station / repairing garage estimate, RTO Transfer forms, Indemnity and Subrogation (giving away the rights of vehicle ownership to the insurance company / salvage buyer on stamp paper) handing over of original RC book/card, both keys, NOC from the bank (if the loan is pending) or form 35 from bank (if the loan is paid and hypothecation is still pending).

All the above procedure should not take more than a week's time or maybe 15 days max, if everything goes smoothly and assuming all the above documents are in place / all the loans etc are cleared / hypothecation is cleared in the RC as well as insurance policy. The payments are being processed by the insurance companies pretty fast these days.

Originally Posted by hardilip

Can speeding up of total loss be done by buying a new car from the same showroom?

Don't be forced to make such decisions hastily. The service station has no hand / role in speeding up the insurance procedure.

Might be possible that they can suggest the salvage buyers, but whether you buy the new vehicle or not the service station will keep forcing you to take your damaged vehicle away from their premises if its a total loss case. These guys don't remain polite for a long time or in case some cases they also levy a per day parking charge as well as loss estimating charges too as suddenly you are not their privileged customer anymore.

Still if you have any doubts pm me anytime.