[phamilyman]

Originally Posted by GenuineOptimist

Yes, I wear belts nearly 100% of the time, even while driving inside my residential locality. It has become a habit and now I feel "loose and unsafe" if I don't wear it. However I travel in airport cabs more often and for more distances than in my personal car since my workplace is just near home. And these cabs, half the time, has their back seat belts fallen down in hatch back dicky or their slots buried within seats or fallen down/ unusable condition. And I know these cabs are driven much more dangerously than my car increasing my risk of unrestrained accidents. But what choice do we have. Both my office transport department and cab drivers will ridicule me if I insist I will use only a cab with a working seat belt.

I also saw your accident links.

And regarding the helmet post: I only have a namesake "half head" helmet to escape cops when I drive my Scooty. My 3 yr old daughter or my wife never wears any helmet at the pillion. In fact i've never seen in my whole life of 35 years that an entire family riding a Scooty or bike is wearing a helmet. I think it comes down to practicality.

I am thankful to you for your advice since I know it is for my own safety but such issues get overlooked commonly for the sake of economics, practicality, comfort etc.

Many LPG related accidents happen but how many of us have a portable fire extinguisher at home?

1. My first company had a strict seat belt policy. I'm a consultant. I travel in cabs all the time. In India, I sit in the front seat if the rear seat doesnt have a seat belt. In Malaysia I'd gotten used to not wearing seatbelts for regular dinnertime visits to nearby malls (2km away) because the cheap cabs often have the same problem as you mention. Yet, my cab was rearended on Thursday in crawling bumper to bumper traffic by an idiot who was distracted on his phone and pressed the accelerator by mistake. Narrow escape. I'm going back to my old policy.

2. Please remember on a scooty, your problems don't depend on your speed but the speed at which you get knocked off depends on the other party. You should wear a decent half face / face open helmet which protects you - you owe it to your family.

Yes, entire families don't wear helmets but then entire families get killed in such accidents as well. Your choice.

3. I have had portable fire extinguishers in the car since the start (need to check if its expired!). My apartment blocks have always had fire extinguishers as many new ones do, these days.

You know the worst part? It is easier to sell a gold chain or an iphone to a middle class company than to convince them to always wear helmets or always wear seat belts or keep a fire extinguisher. Such is life. Choices, choices.

[amit1234singla]

Originally Posted by GenuineOptimist

OK, Now since this thread is on top, I'm inclined to share my experience with car seats. I'm one of those odd ones who've always purchased cars that have air bags in them. So when my daughter was about to be born I rushed to mother care and got a car seat. We used it for like 4 trips to doctor in her first 3 months. After this, my wife decided baby is comfortable in her lap at the back seat rather than in a car seat. I didn't find this worthy enough for a quarrel with wife. So my daughter is 3 yrs now and has not used the seat ever since.

I don't regret buying it since we used it as rocker indoors and as a feeding chair, so I got my money's worth.

I don't mean to question to ridicule others who spend money and efforts to restrain kids in a car seat. But I do wonder if Team BHP leads its readers to unnecessary purchases while the rest of India just chugs along. After all, just look at the number of indian kids who wash hands before every meal, or who avoid water in public places, or people that wear seat belts in public transport. The nation seems to move just fine?

Hi GenuineOptimist - I am aware there are responses to this post already but I can't hold myself just asking a question.

If you are aware that a precaution is good, important life saving measure for you or your family, why would not go for it as long as you can afford it. Because large part of India does not do it?

Take the example of child vaccinations. Majority of Indian children are still underprivileged to get it properly, may be they still move just fine. Similarly, majority of them probably don't brush their teeth morning evening and move on just fine. What would be your choices? And why should the choices change when it comes to child seat, helmet etc?

[motomaverick]

Well in the end what I feel is it is up to us to decide our family's safety and not follow the herd. Its like the classic case of the herd forcing you to jump the signal in the night since there are very few vehicles around but do we stay put or get bogged down and jump the signal. Whatever is the result it was our decision. So using child seat or not is entirely up to us and how we make the child understand. At the end of the day should we see convenience or safety, if you ask me I would choose the later option while on Indian roads.

Coming back to topic. Has anyone heard about Ollington car seats

[arjithin]

Originally Posted by GenuineOptimist

I don't mean to question to ridicule others who spend money and efforts to restrain kids in a car seat. But I do wonder if Team BHP leads its readers to unnecessary purchases while the rest of India just chugs along.

Originally Posted by motomaverick

Well in the end what I feel is it is up to us to decide our family's safety and not follow the herd.

GenuineOptimist, adding on top of all the comments above; In India, accidents can happen for no fault of a person, how ever good driver she/he is. Be it seat belt or car seat or helmet; they 'can' reduce the impact of an accident.

Earlier in this thread, I mentioned my first hand experience of 4 lives saved by car seats/seat belts. I have unfortunate experience of my cousin leaving this world in a jeep accident where the vehicle has ZERO safety features. Like Motomaverick mentioned its our call at the end of the day. Better be prepared than getting an eyeopener or comparing with the millions who dont have affordability.

FYI, these numbers may help: Kerala Motor Vehicle Department is enforcing Helmets for the last 1 month+. The number of severe head injuries from 2 wheeler accidents reported to Trivandrum medical college reduced 90% after the enforcement of helmets for driver. All of us can decide whether we should be in the 90% that got saved or the other 10%.

Originally Posted by motomaverick

Coming back to topic. Has anyone heard about Ollington car seat?

I havent. But from the picture of it, it looks very similar (features and construction) to the one I bought (photos posted few posts earlier). Though mine is a "Mee Mee" brand, its manufactured by some one else and just branded as "Mee Mee". This could be another brand utilizing the same supplier. The instruction manual I received is very generic and contain no reference to "Mee Mee" and it talks about some UK standards adherence.

[Sn1p3r]

We got a mothercare car seat for our 10 months old. I was hell bent to get one as soon our son could sustain his neck upright and take the rigours of our travel on rough roads. We took him to his first long ride 900 km journey and hill climb. It would just not be possible without the seat.

He sleeps comfortably in the seat and we got him the neck pillow so that while he sleeps his neck is not bobbing around.

I was too finicky to pick seats, wanted the Recaro Young sport (not available in India), wife wanted Chicco brand (son did not sit in it for more than 2 sec), then we made our son to sit in about a dozen different types of seats available at every major store and finally he was happy to sit in the one we got him. We might think of the best and costiliest seat with most advance features but the one who has to travel has to decide else it is an utter waste.

My recommendation is let the kid decide and use it everytime, the kids make a hue and cry initially but then if you persist they will come around and enjoy the ride. Also, never invest in boosters (it is not recommended post various studies about their counter effect on safety). Get something that will have neck protection and shoulder strap height adjustment too. You can PM me if you require some specifics to be answered. Glad to assist. Cheers!

[sawnilrules]

We live in a country where wearing Seat Belts and Helmet is taken as pain on the backside, if at all I ask people with babies/kids whether they have car seats, the funniest answer I get is; yes my car has a seat. So, this is the level of understanding and importance given to car seats in India.

My sister delivered recently and she is based out of Sweden. I was having a discussion with her on awareness, and I was decently surprised to know that in much part of Europe, the nurse at the hospital will not sign on the hospital discharge card unless you have a car seat installed in your car on the day of your discharge from the hospital. I could only think of such levels of awareness in India in my dreams.

Having worked extensively in mother and child space, I thought about penning down on the importance of car seats, their types and correct way of installing them in our cars.

Importance of Car Seats

• Newborn babies, infants and children require special protection while in a car
• It is recommended that kids below the age of 12 should compulsorily be restrained in the rear seat.
• The safest way for children to travel in cars is in a child car seat that is suitable for their weight & size
• Research estimates that putting a child in the back seat instead of the front reduces the chance of death and injury by more than 30%
• In a crash at just 45 kmph, an unrestrained child would be thrown forward, and also likely to be ejected out of the car through windows, in case of open windows
• It’s also not safe to hold a child on your lap. In a crash, the child could be crushed between your body and part of the of the car’s interior. Even if you are using a seat belt, the child would be torn from your arms and you would not be able to hold them, no matter how hard you try
• And finally, It’s also dangerous to put a seat belt around yourself and your child

Type of car Seats

• Infant Car Seat
• Convertible Car Seat
• Booster Chairs

How do you choose the right car seats?

• Infant Car Seats (Baby sits rear facing) – from birth to 10 kgs. (approx 1 yr)
• Convertible Car Seats – from birth to 13.6 kgs, Rear facing & forward facing from 9 to 18 kgs. (Approx 1 to 4 yrs.)
• High Back Boosters and Booster Cushions from 18 to 45 kgs. (approx 3 to 12 yrs)




Why is rear facing important for Infants?

Babies have heavy heads and fragile necks. The neck bones are soft, and the ligaments stretchy. If the baby is facing forward in a frontal crash the body is held back by the straps, but the head is not.
The head is thrust forward, stretching the neck and the spinal cord can tear.

In contrast, when a baby rides facing backward, the whole body, head and neck is cradled by the back of the safety seat in a frontal crash. Facing rear wards also protects the baby better in other types of crashes, particularly side impacts.

In case of kids, as they can manage the weight of their heads, it is advisable for the convertible car seats to face forward after the child is more than 1 year of age.

How do you correctly install the car seat?

Cars seats should always be installed on the rear seat and never on the front seat, as a child on the front seat can heavily distract the driver. I wanted to upload the video’s on installation, but somehow I am not aware of the video installation process, please pardon my ignorance. However to best of my abilities, I have jotted down the steps of car seat installation.

Installation Steps for Car Seat (Infant Car Seat)

• Place the infant car seat facing back on the rear seat on co-passenger side
• Push the handle back
• Pull out the rear seat car seat belt completely
• Insert the seat belt between the front two loops
• Then insert seat belt in the back loop after covering the front
• Fasten the seat belt in the buckle
• Press the seat down to firm up the seat belt
• Push the front seat back to ensure that the seat back touches the car seat
• Rest the seat back firmly with infant seat handle
• Ready for the baby, place the baby facing backwards
• Get the straps over the baby’s shoulders & Secure the straps

Installation Steps for Car Seat (Convertible Car Seat- Rear Facing)

• Place the convertible car seat facing backwards and recline position turn bottom support down
• Pull out the seat belt fully
• Pass the belt in the slot under the seat
• Get the seat belt to the other side & pull the belt from other side
• Lock the belt & Press the seat and pull the belt tight
• Check by side-ways shake for tightness
• Push the front seat back for back support
• Seat is ready for the child

Installation Steps for Car Seat (Convertible Car Seat- Forward Facing)

• Place the convertible car seat facing forward in the rear sit of the car and turn the bottom support down
• Pull the seat belt out fully and pass it through back slot
• Pull the belt from opposite slot and buckle the seat belt
• After buckling, pull the seat belt tight from the other end
• Apply pressure on the seat and tighten the belt
• Seat is ready for the child


I hope I was able to value add on the forum through my knowledge on car seats, its use and importance.

MODS- I am putting it up the thread on “under the hood” section, requesting you to move my thread to much relevant section.

[sawnilrules]

Further to my above post, I am attaching images which can help us understand how a typical restrain system of Infant Car Seat looks like (front & rear); the anatomy of Seat Belts in the car (front and rear) and visual differentiation of different type of car seats.




Front View Restrain System of Infant Car Seat



Rear View Restrain System of Infant Car Seat



Anatomy of Seat Belts of Front Seats



Anatomy of Seat Belts of Rear Seats



Infant Car Seat



Convertible Car Seat



Booster Car Seat

I hope this pictures add some value to my earlier post.

Disclaimer: Pictures are for representation purpose only and to give visual guidelines to the reader. No where am I trying to promote the brands visible if any in the pictures. Thanks.

[Arunshek]

Hi Swanilrules,

Very good thread and indeed informative. The vaccum of knowledge about the car seat for kids is, according to me the lack of guidance from concerned departments (RTOs) and Traffic Police.

I've a 14 month old daughter and she has been using car seat since she was 6 months. I've been scouting for a baby car seat for 1-2 months and finally shortlisting Greco and MotherCare. Shoppers Stop's online portal has very good stock of mothercare products and you get a good deal on them as well. I checked out a model online and then went to store to buy it. My kid also sat on it to see if its comfortable. The model I chose was MotherCare Convertible Front facing upto 18Kgs.

Coming back to awareness, I've seen a lot of them in movies. But When I was in US, that's where I came to know it is compulsory for even 1 day old baby That was an eye opener for me. I thought it's the exposure which leads to awareness. But it isn't, couple of my friends who had been to west says "I drive cat max 50kph in city and hardly go to highways, so why should I buy a car seat"..." It's not compulsory, so why waste money"

My kid just loves her seat and we already did a tour to Daman and Mahabhaleshwar Plus numerous trips to Marine drive and weekend errands. She's comfortable in it.
I feel if we make kid sit in one from early days, they get acccustomed to it.

I'll post couple of snaps of her seat soon. Hoping this thread will least open eyes of fellow BHPians. After all Little drops of water, make a might ocean!!!

[B747]

Originally Posted by sawnilrules

My sister delivered recently and she is based out of Sweden. I was having a discussion with her on awareness, and I was decently surprised to know that in much part of Europe, the nurse at the hospital will not sign on the hospital discharge card unless you have a car seat installed in your car on the day of your discharge from the hospital. I could only think of such levels of awareness in India in my dreams.

Same is the case in US, without child seats they won't discharge.
Very informative post, thanks for sharing.
In India one common site is the person who is driving will keep the kid on his/her lap and drives. Many fail to understand the risk involved esp with cars occupied with airbags.

[Hayek]

Great thread. Am among the few people I know who followed this practice for the last 6 years. My son came home from the hospital in a rear facing infant seat cum carry cot, upgraded to a front facing toddler seat when he was 13 months old, and a larger child seat at 2. We still have a booster in each of our cars, but after seeing all his school friends standing with their heads popping out of the sun roof, we are not able to get him to use them except on highway runs. He still uses seat belts though.

[sandeepmohan]

Originally Posted by Arunshek

I feel if we make kid sit in one from early days, they get acccustomed to it.

The lack of education on the subject meant we ended buying a child seat only now (Mothercare Malmo), when my son is two. In the two weeks we've had the child seat, my son has spent only 5 minutes in it. Refuses to stay in the child seat. In most western countries, it is mandatory that the baby/child is in some sort of safety seat if they are to travel in a car. I don't know how to get him to be in his seat for the duration we are in the car.

[vb-saan]

Originally Posted by sawnilrules

• High Back Boosters and Booster Cushions from 18 to 45 kgs. (approx 3 to 12 yrs)

Can you try to list down the pros and cons of No Back Boosters/Booster Cushions v/s High Back Boosters?

Originally Posted by sandeepmohan

In the two weeks we've had the child seat, my son has spent only 5 minutes in it. Refuses to stay in the child seat. In most western countries, it is mandatory that the baby/child is in some sort of safety seat if they are to travel in a car. I don't know how to get him to be in his seat for the duration we are in the car.

Ignore the tantrums. It’s the parents who cannot stand the crying/screaming and immediately give-in
He will get used to it in few days, and after that will refuse to travel without it.

[Arunshek]

Originally Posted by sandeepmohan

I don't know how to get him to be in his seat for the duration we are in the car.

You did the right thing, it's never too late.
How about encouraging and praising him when he sits on it. Ensure that along with him, other occupants also are belted, so that he don't feel odd. Also never let him sit in front alone or on any body's lap.
Another trick is to bring the car seat to home. Make him sit in it while watching TV, or small snacks, just for playful purpose. Praise him when he sit in the car seat. Once he get the feeling that it's his, he'll be comfortable with the seat when in car.

[Juggy]

Originally Posted by vb-san

Can you try to list down the pros and cons of No Back Boosters/Booster Cushions v/s High Back Boosters? Ignore the tantrums. It's the parents who cannot stand the crying/screaming and immediately give-in He will get used to it in few days, and after that will refuse to travel without it.

With due respect, vb-san, ignoring a tantrum is easier said than done. Infant seats are wonderful, but in my experience with family in the US & France, the kids there are kept actively / passively engaged, (screen time, books, music) and they are talked to constantly. My kids too fall in quietly and are strapped up with their cousins. At those speeds, it would be insane to risk holding them on your lap.

In Bangalore atleast, the only time we hit 80k is when we're leaving town at 6:30 or on a midnight airport run. There is very little negotiation then. And a couple of boosters to help them see out are adequate.

I don't insist on the belts when we are on football runs or grocery shopping, when I am at the wheel. My older boy 8+ always belts up, but the younger one 4+ has his days.

My top choices for getting toddlers to try the seat are ....
1. find their choice of music, or audio books (like karadi tales), soothes them quickly.
2. Be flexible for short regular runs. U will need to explain where you are going to them.
3. Around 4, get them to help you belt them up. The habit kicks in sooner than u think.
4. Be judicious about your speeds when the belts are not on. We have a rule, not to cross 80, if they are not fully belted up.

I've seen a few parents insist on belting up the toddlers and then send the older kid by school bus without a care.

[vb-saan]

Originally Posted by Juggy

With due respect, vb-san, ignoring a tantrum is easier said than done. Infant seats are wonderful, but in my experience with family in the US & France, the kids there are kept actively / passively engaged, (screen time, books, music) and they are talked to constantly. My kids too fall in quietly and are strapped up with their cousins. At those speeds, it would be insane to risk holding them on your lap.
In Bangalore atleast, the only time we hit 80k is when we're leaving town at 6:30 or on a midnight airport run. There is very little negotiation then. And a couple of boosters to help them see out are adequate.
I don't insist on the belts when we are on football runs or grocery shopping, when I am at the wheel. My older boy 8+ always belts up, but the younger one 4+ has his days.

Well, my comments were from my personal experience. We had our moments of refusal to sit in child seat and all, but once she got off the crying phase she started enjoying the positives – the high seating positions help them to see outside better, and also get a feeling that they’ve a special reserved seat