[supersom]

I have been looking for an SUV in the Rs. 12 lakh range - so the obvious choices are Safari and Scorpio. Won't dwell on this well beaten comparo - liked the lively Scorpio engine but the lack of space was too much to swallow; the Safari had acres of space but the engine seemed to have a tad less grunt.

Up came an offer which seems to be swerving the decision in favor of the Safari. There is a Dec 2010 VX 4x2 with one of the dealers and he is willing to knock Rs. 3 lakhs off the OTR price if I take that. I checked the VIN and it does match the date of manufacture quoted.

Please let me know or views (or experiences) on buying a car like this, with respect to:

- How do I drive a deal on such a vehicle? Negotiate on Depreciation, age of the vehicle and possibility of abuse, just like a second hand car? The car will come with its full share of warranty. Will it be unfair to work up from the price of a second hand car of the same vintage with low miles and excellent condition?

- What checks (mechanical and electrical) do I get done on this vehicle? And how do I get it checked up? There will be no service records as you can understand, and the dealer is hesitant about letting me take it to another dealership for a checkup. He is citing reasons that it will log more kms, which is valid, but I will have to force his hand on this one when I am serious. I might even be able to get a mechanic from the TASC that I get my Indica worked at, but I will have to figure that out.

- What possible reasons could there be for the car to be lying around this long. Needless to say, the dealers must have known that it would get harder and harder for him to sell it with every passing month. If the car were a lemon, I'm sure it could be returned to Tata Motors. Or could it be that the dealer has added incentives for peddling off a lemon? (Sorry... now this is bordering on conspiracy theory!)

Outwardly, the car looks in good shape - paint seems original, body seals intact, no signs of wear on the upholstery and it even has a light but convincing coat of dust on it!

[pjbiju]

I would be very careful about picking up a vehicle like this especially the Safari since they are known to have some niggles or other every once in a while.

You need to understand why it was not sold for a such a long time. Also what they were using it for during this period. Do the tyres look unused? Besides the standard warranty, will you also be able to get extended warranty? Add that to the bargain - ask the dealer to cover the expenses of extended warranty as well. Getting someone very knowledgeable about Safari to check out this vehicle before you make your decision is a good idea.

[himanshugoswami]

look at a new GX instead....after discounts will cost you teh same. I would be very wary of a car that has been lying in the dealer stockyard for 1.5 years.....engines are meant to run and not gather dust- you may have some rubber parts go brittle on account of non use etc.

Also, you never kno wif this car met with an accident and was spruced up by teh dealer. not worth it IMHO.

[condor]

Dec 2010 ? 18 months.
Is this a TD vehicle ?
Why has it not got sold yet ?
Even if you were buying a used 18 month old Safari, you could expect that kind of discount. So why should you take this one ?
Will you get any warranty at all ?
You say it has a fine coat of dust .. then how do you say paint looks fine ?

[arvindmanju]

i was in the same situation couple of months ago - i was showen a 2010 white safari. They quoted its unsold vehicle and wanted to clear off with good discount. The vehicle looked fine but after a wash at the dealers place upon inspection found out the vehicle chassis showed rust. if I have a budget of 12L i would prefer to buy a new model, than a so called unsold vehicle.
even the new Safari's are proven with niggles, so waste money and peace of mind on the old one.

[Irish]

Please avoid buying such vehicle especially Tata - Safari, which is very popular for its niggles. As rightly said by others - what will happen to warranty of vehicle, battery, tyres? When you have the money to buy a fresh vehicle then why to invite tensions?

Look for the current year's safari or if you want to save money then search for Dec 2011, with at least 1.5L - 1.7L discount.

Cheers!
Irish

[v&v]

@supersom - IMO 2010 Safari were pretty much niggle free. Only make sure its not a TD vehicle and you can further negotiate for some more discount and take all these offer in written. Also you should opt for 2 + 2 years warranty.

Also there were some retro fitting done during this period on TB & Doors. Make sure its done or was the model after that.

Check the tire DOT dates to double check its not TD vehicle.

[rrsteer]

So probably after the 3 lac cut, you will end up paying 8.5 -9 lacs for a 1.5 year old non used Safari. 9 lacs is a lot of currency, and I think it would be better to spend it elsewhere. You can probably look at Duster which will be launched on 4th July. As per the Auto Car India report, it has better performance than XUV and a more space than Scorpio. Reports suggest it would be priced in the range of 8-10 lacs.

[supersom]

Thanks for your views

Originally Posted by himanshugoswami

look at a new GX instead....

GX was the initial plan. ABS is a must. But here is how the thinking went - 12 lakhs already seemed on the high side for a vehicle which is on its way out (Safari) or a cramped SUV (Scorpio). 13 Lakhs for a GX seems to be an overkill when 14.4 gets one the fresh XUV 500 W6.

Originally Posted by condor

Dec 2010 ? 18 months.
Is this a TD vehicle ?
Why has it not got sold yet ?
Even if you were buying a used 18 month old Safari, you could expect that kind of discount. So why should you take this one ?
Will you get any warranty at all ?
You say it has a fine coat of dust .. then how do you say paint looks fine ?

Don't know if this is a TD vehicle. I have been taking a few TDs lately and the TD vehicle of choice for Safari seems to be the VX 4x2 But then TD vehicles in Bangalore are usually Pearl White - most favorite/popular color. This is Cycus Grey.

Why it hasn't sold is anybody's guess. While it might seem logical that VX has less demand, and once a car starts staying back in the stockyard for a while, the demand falls further, one cannot be sure. But then, that is the whole deal right, and that is why there are those discounts. I am trying to think how this car could be checked to ensure that it is that and not anything else.

The car will be sold as a new car with 2010 manufacturing date - 2+2 yrs warranty. Would you still say that a pre-owned car is better than a <1K driven car with full warranty?

The paint seemed original. Not that I could check for dings or touch-ups on it. I will have to inform them a day in advance of getting the car checked by a mechanic and they will keep it washed.

Originally Posted by arvindmanju

i was in the same situation couple of months ago - i was showen a 2010 white safari. They quoted its unsold vehicle and wanted to clear off with good discount. The vehicle looked fine but after a wash at the dealers place upon inspection found out the vehicle chassis showed rust. if I have a budget of 12L i would prefer to buy a new model, than a so called unsold vehicle.
even the new Safari's are proven with niggles, so waste money and peace of mind on the old one.

Will pay special attention to rusting of the chassis. May I ask how much discount was offered and which month of 2010 the car was manufactured?

Originally Posted by Irish

Please avoid buying such vehicle especially Tata - Safari, which is very popular for its niggles. As rightly said by others - what will happen to warranty of vehicle, battery, tyres? When you have the money to buy a fresh vehicle then why to invite tensions?

Look for the current year's safari or if you want to save money then search for Dec 2011, with at least 1.5L - 1.7L discount.

Cheers!
Irish

The warranty will be 2+2 years from the date of purchase. There is also a 2011 EX with a 2 lakh discount on it - but my hands are tied. I have to buy an ABS variant (at least)!

Originally Posted by v&v

... Also there were some retro fitting done during this period on TB & Doors. Make sure its done or was the model after that.

Check the tire DOT dates to double check its not TD vehicle.

What is this tire DOT date? Please enlighten

Also, I am not sure of the retrofits you have mentioned. Is it something like new decals or cladding on the doors? Please clarify.

Originally Posted by rrsteer

So probably after the 3 lac cut, you will end up paying 8.5 -9 lacs for a 1.5 year old non used Safari. 9 lacs is a lot of currency, and I think it would be better to spend it elsewhere. You can probably look at Duster which will be launched on 4th July. As per the Auto Car India report, it has better performance than XUV and a more space than Scorpio. Reports suggest it would be priced in the range of 8-10 lacs.

This is a VX - so its more like 11-12 lakhs. Haven't really thought about the Duster. Let me read up.

[VMC]

I would also suggest you to stay away from the 2010 Safari offered to you.

Tata's are offering huge discounts on the existing diesel cars they have. My friend booked a Tata Manza and he got a 50K bonus,10K cash discount + 5K corporate discount.
Aria Pure is also available at around 12.7lacs with all the discounts. Safari Lx and GX also have some great discounts running.
I know the GM sales of a dealer here in BLR. PM me if you need his reference. Maybe you could talk to him to strike a deal for Safari.
All the best
VMC

[condor]

Originally Posted by supersom

GX was the initial plan. ABS is a must.

+1.

Originally Posted by supersom

What is this tire DOT date?

The date of manufacture is printed on the tyre. There is an impression that will mention the date. Some brands have a code with which you can find out the date of manufacture.

[supersom]

Originally Posted by pjbiju

I would be very careful about picking up a vehicle like this especially the Safari since they are known to have some niggles or other every once in a while.

... Getting someone very knowledgeable about Safari to check out this vehicle before you make your decision is a good idea.

I understand pjbiju, but from what I have read here, there is nothing that a warranty cover won't take care. So rather than niggles and failures, checking for manufacturing defects, accidents and rust would be uppermost in my mind.

I know this is quite a wish, but I would be ever grateful if any of the Safari experts could join me to take a look and feel of this vehicle. Any day, any time is fine.

Originally Posted by VMC

I would also suggest you to stay away from the 2010 Safari offered to you.

Tata's are offering huge discounts on the existing diesel cars they have. My friend booked a Tata Manza and he got a 50K bonus,10K cash discount + 5K corporate discount.
Aria Pure is also available at around 12.7lacs with all the discounts. Safari Lx and GX also have some great discounts running.
I know the GM sales of a dealer here in BLR. PM me if you need his reference. Maybe you could talk to him to strike a deal for Safari.
All the best
VMC

VMC, your first line summarizes my initial reaction too! But there is always the promise of further discounts to lure one in. At this point, it would be more helpful for me if someone tells me how this is definitely a trap. Or, if one could guide me on what needs to be checked on one of these Safaris, that could also be great.

Safaris are running an offer of free insurance - 35-50K (quoted by the dealer, depending on variant), 40K of exchange bonus and 5K corporate discount.

Thanks for offering to put me in touch with the dealer's GM. Will PM you my number shortly.

Originally Posted by condor

+1.

The date of manufacture is printed on the tyre. There is an impression that will mention the date. Some brands have a code with which you can find out the date of manufacture.

Thanks.

[arvindmanju]

It was a white safari EX discount offered was to buy at Lx price tag plus regular company discounts at that time. ( this offer was pre budget price hike). It was tempting deal to have Ex for around 8L. But then the rust made me take a step back. Waiting for storm to take further decision.

Dealer also mentioned warranty and extended warranty do not cover rust. It's just on mfg defects and parts.

[supersom]

Originally Posted by arvindmanju

It was a white safari EX discount offered was to buy at Lx price tag plus regular company discounts at that time. ( this offer was pre budget price hike). It was tempting deal to have Ex for around 8L. But then the rust made me take a step back. Waiting for storm to take further decision.

Dealer also mentioned warranty and extended warranty do not cover rust. It's just on mfg defects and parts.

Very true. Rust would not be covered as that would be wear and tear.

Anything else that you checked on that vehicle - engine condition, whether it was a TD vehicle? How many KMs were on it? Did you take the car to a service center for inspection?

[arvindmanju]

First thing i was keen on was to check the rust. Vehicle had done 25km on the odo. Could not make out if it was used by looking at the interiors/ they had all the plastic covers intact. As you had mentioned earlier the vehicle had accumulated good amount of dust, hence got it washed and first thing i did was to put the vehicle on the ramp and check the under body. Straight away rejected it when I noticed the rust building up. Dint do any TD though.
Once there is rust build up its difficult to stop it. IMO its not worth the discount offered.