[alpha1]

Originally Posted by fine69

Isolation for Lats? Hmm...I guess some sort of pull-down? I mean pulldown while keeping the hand straight (maybe a bit of shoulder/forearm workout too but probably 90% effort from Lats?)

What stops me from continuing is my back. Back and my arm somewhere, towards triceps I think. But the back area isn't really the lats, feels like somewhere in between the lower back and lats, not sure. I think my whole arm gives up before my back does, will monitor it better next time.

You are right. Isolation for lats = doing pull down with arms locked straight. If you do this movement with varying grips and varying angles of cable (of course with super light weights), you may realize that:
1. The lats bear the brunt maximum from -45 degrees (this means arms nearly overhead, but not complete) to +90 degrees (elbow close to waist)
2. The lats gets the workout when elbows are somewhat in front of the torso instead of elbows being astride the torso.

So this means a few things for pullups/pulldowns:
a) it is actually better to keep your body at a slight angle leaning back instead of being totally vertical
b) it is actually better to not extend your hands/arms/shoulder blades all the way up
c) it is actually better to not take a grip wider than shoulder width

{One way to do this is to keep looking up at the bar/ceiling all the time instead of looking straight ahead at the wall or the mirror}

For rows, this means a few other things:
a) ensure that the elbow angle does not become acute (remember acute angle, obtuse angle etc?)
b) ensure that your upper back is at lowest possible altitude
c) ensure that the bar/bell touches your pelvic rather than your ribs (this would appear as if you are aiming to push the weight somewhat behind you rather than simply moving it up)

Ofcourse there has to be a mind muscle connection, and that usually happens quickest with the lighter weights.

Google for this: Vince Gironda Sternum chinups <OR> pullups
<AND> Vince Gironda lat pull

Let me give sumo deadlift a try. I'm a little skeptic with deadlift simply because of the probability of developing a back sprain or something even severe. I think I'll start with very light weights and add weight at a very very slow pace. I've hurt almost every major joint, muscle, ligament and cartilage and don't want to hurt my back so extra scared.

Yes, in that case you may simply omit deadlifts.
But do keep in mind that I know people who have sprained their backs while picking up a pen dropped on floor. So the possibility and probability always exists, but should that stop you ... ?

Start with empty bar, and slap on weights only when you are 100% confident and have demonstrated mastery with lesser weights. We are not competing at a power lifting meet here, right?

On the other hand, since you are already doing squats, you may give deadlifts a miss since both are, in rough sense, similar movements. Most bodybuilder never deadlift.

[Jaguar]

Originally Posted by fine69

3) Lastly, what is the best form for deadlift. I've seen a lot of videos but somewhere I feel that I might be putting too much pressure on my lower back. Again, the tips vary so I'm not really sure which one to follow. Some say my quads and back should be forming a V when pulling up some are pulling up with the back almost parallel to the floow.

This is one video what I found useful

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4AObAU-EcYE

Originally Posted by alpha1

On the other hand, since you are already doing squats, you may give deadlifts a miss since both are, in rough sense, similar movements. Most bodybuilder never deadlift.

Hmmm good observation. I hardly see anyone deadlift in the gym. I personally prefer it to squats.

[DieselFan]

The big three - Squats, bench press and deadlifts are the most useful compound exercises you can carry out in the gym and a must for all. All three are essential as they handle different muscle groups.

[Piyadassi]

Originally Posted by DieselFan

The big three - Squats, bench press and deadlifts are the most useful compound exercises you can carry out in the gym and a must for all. All three are essential as they handle different muscle groups.

True. Deadlift is the big daddy. The amount of high it gives you, perhaps owing to the fact that one can lift one's heaviest weight, is beyond compare.

[alpha1]

Originally Posted by DieselFan

The big three - Squats, bench press and deadlifts are the most useful compound exercises you can carry out in the gym and a must for all. All three are essential as they handle different muscle groups.

Originally Posted by Piyadassi

True. Deadlift is the big daddy. The amount of high it gives you, perhaps owing to the fact that one can lift one's heaviest weight, is beyond compare.

A flipside: http://www.westside-barbell.com/arti...don-t-deadlift

http://oldschooltrainer.com/bill-starrs-5-x-5-training/ (check out the Bill Starr's programs, no deadlifts in certain progs)

[fine69]

To each his own I guess. What I've learned in the brief period of my training and through certain feedback on this thread also, is that one shouldn't follow the herd blindly.

For a fat skinny guy like me with absolutely no muscle in the body, it was pretty hard and a lot of times I tried to imitate the exact stance as was shown in that youtube video, I ended up straining some part of my ligament/tendon/muscle a little too much.

My view, however unimportant it might be amongst all experts here, is that one should gradually up the weights, start out small but do make progression little by little and never ever think that what works for everybody else would work for them too.

On the internet, for every conventional and most recommended routine, there's an equally convincing unconventional routine that has worked for someone.

I say:

- read up but not too extensively, you might end up getting confused instead of being learned. Knowledge is indeed power but with internet you end up reading a whole lot of broscience instead of actual stuff.
- start with light weights so that you don't injure yourself even with bad form. When you do this you get to learn what works for your body and your own experience is always better than trying to figure out whether a certain advice is fact based or simply broscience
- listen to your body, when it tells you to not do a certain movement, STOP. Doesn't matter if everybody else can do it easily without any issue, you are Unique!
- live a certain way (for a while) and objectively assess your progress before you conclude which training routine or food works or doesn't work
- as alpha1 once said, don't let an injury convert into disability, so to re-iterate, listen to your body and don't further strain your injuries, wait them out
- accept the fact that you are NEVER going to look like Arnold or Dwayne or Lazar or whoever has that dream bod as per you, unless of course that becomes the single most important aspect of your life and you are willing to spend a lot of your time, effort and money towards achieving that. Oh and genetics is real too! Not that you can't beat it (somewhat) but what all are you willing to do is the question
- as samurai once said, follow a routine that you are able to sustain for life. I mean if certain routine cannot be part of your lifestyle over long period of time then you either end up frustrated or compromise on other important stuff
- Last and most important as per me, enjoy your workouts and don't let it take over the other actual important stuff in your life i.e. family, friends and enjoying that junk food or ice cream with your gf/better half/kid once in a while

[DieselFan]

Originally Posted by fine69

My view, however unimportant it might be amongst all experts here, is that one should gradually up the weights, start out small but do make progression little by little and never ever think that what works for everybody else would work for them too.

Yes this is true. One has to very gradually increase the weights. Never exceed ones limits and try something extra-ordinary. I have seen people getting spinal/neck injuries because they thought they could lift above their limits.

My suggestion is to start an exercise without any weights. Just by body weight - weather it is squats, bench press or deadlift. Do the exercise with right posture without any weights. Then start with smallest dumbells you can lift with ease and slowly increase weights. Once you have reach 10+ kgs on dumbells then and then alone should one go for barbells as barbells weigh 20 kgs without any weights.

It is also true that each and every person is different. Also as the person ages the capacity changes. So the same person in his 20s will do far greater weights than in 30s or 40s.

DF

[Piyadassi]

Originally Posted by alpha1

A flipside: http://www.westside-barbell.com/arti...don-t-deadlift

http://oldschooltrainer.com/bill-starrs-5-x-5-training/ (check out the Bill Starr's programs, no deadlifts in certain progs)

Personal preferences... yes they do have a big role in making choice.

However, I must add that deadlift, I think, is one exercise that makes biggest difference to your posture, especially the hind.

[fine69]

I was talking to this gym goer in my office and realized that he wears something called a supporter under his briefs while lifting. He said that its like a langot only and is imperative if I'm looking at avoiding hernia during heavy lifting.

I started reading stuff on the net and realized that people have mixed opinions about it and there have been ample folks who've made it without a supporter absolutely fine.

This pursuit of mine is starting to look scary now, what are you guys doing when it comes to supporters? By the way, when it comes to Hernia, it doesn't look like it can be prevented simply by wearing a supporter. I mean what would really change in terms of pressure in the abdominal area just because I'm wearing extremely tight briefs?

[iss1307]

Originally Posted by fine69

I was talking to this gym goer in my office and realized that he wears something called a supporter under his briefs while lifting. He said that its like a langot only and is imperative if I'm looking at avoiding hernia during heavy lifting.

I started reading stuff on the net and realized that people have mixed opinions about it and there have been ample folks who've made it without a supporter absolutely fine.

This pursuit of mine is starting to look scary now, what are you guys doing when it comes to supporters? By the way, when it comes to Hernia, it doesn't look like it can be prevented simply by wearing a supporter. I mean what would really change in terms of pressure in the abdominal area just because I'm wearing extremely tight briefs?

Supporters are very important.
Don't look at the rubbish claims.
If you want saggy balls go ahead lift heavy without a supporter.
Any heavy exercise or physical work you do, there are 2 things that always work. One is your core(abs) and second your ball sack contracts.
Now you call figure it out on your own how and why supporters are a must.

[fine69]

Originally Posted by iss1307

Any heavy exercise or physical work you do, there are 2 things that always work. One is your core(abs) and second your ball sack contracts.

Isn't it because it pushes the blood out of that area? I mean I've been swimming also for a few years and obviously my scrotum would shrink during and after the workout (even if I was swimming in temperature controlled water).

I tried to figure out which muscle was responsible for this but it looks like its an involuntary action which cannot really be controlled by wearing a tight brief or supporter. This contraction or expansion is purely a result of temperature change and nothing else. I'm trying to figure out the logic here.

[bking]

Hi fellow BHPians.

I am an ectomorph who is just trying to put on some weight and muscle. I am 5'10 and 45KGs which might give you an idea of how severely underweight I am.

I like to eat but the problem is that I can't eat much plus I don't have the time to take like say 5 meals a day, I have other things to focus on too.

I wanted to know your views on supplementing protein shakes for meals and the likes, I would just like to be a medium weighed person with a lean body.

Thanks
Regards
Bhushan Bhati

[fine69]

Originally Posted by bking

I like to eat but the problem is that I can't eat much plus I don't have the time to take like say 5 meals a day, I have other things to focus on too.



I wanted to know your views on supplementing protein shakes for meals and the likes, I would just like to be a medium weighed person with a lean body.

Honest question, have you seen a doctor just to rule out the fact that there's absolutely nothing else going on, 45kg at 5'10" is pretty skinny.

I have a girl friend who was very very skinny. I mean she ate anything and everything but was all bones, even in hips n thighs. Then she got a job in Jakarta (Indonesia) and within a year she gained good weight. I asked her if she changed her diet or anything but she was cooking herself the same food she used to cook here. After about 3 years she came back but this time with a paunch! Just thought I'd share because at times other variables might come into play too. Its still a mystery how she gained the kind of weight she did.

As for your questions, to gain weight one would have to eat a little more than they might be comfortable with and protein supplements alone don't do anything when it comes to gaining weight.

[bking]

Originally Posted by fine69

Honest question, have you seen a doctor just to rule out the fact that there's absolutely nothing else going on, 45kg at 5'10" is pretty skinny.
.
.
.
As for your questions, to gain weight one would have to eat a little more than they might be comfortable with and protein supplements alone don't do anything when it comes to gaining weight.

I am contemplating visiting a nutritionist soon, as soon as I find time for it. Was just hoping to get some advice from the people here. Seems like the doctor will give me a better idea, thanks though.

[alpha1]

Originally Posted by fine69

He said that its like a langot only and is imperative if I'm looking at avoiding hernia during heavy lifting.

Can you please ask him:
a) what exactly is this term called "hernia"
b) which precise form of hernia is he referring to (which may happen while lifting weights)
c) how will the langot help in this case to prevent the occurrence of hernia?

Originally Posted by iss1307

If you want saggy balls go ahead lift heavy without a supporter.

Why don't you provide the answers to the questions I asked?