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Old 10th June 2015, 14:09   #151
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Default Re: The Duke of Direwolves - Lisbeth, my KTM Duke 200

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Originally Posted by theexperthand View Post
What are the options available in market for tubeless, off road friendly tyres for Duke? Not that I am going to change immediately, but if the cost is not prohibitive (may be around 5-7.K for a pair), I will change then in next couple of months.

I am OK to sacrifice some corner craving ability and some top speed, if in return, I can get decent off road grip, in slush and in loose gravel. But the tyre have to be tubeless - do not want to go back to tube tyes, only because of the hassle of getting punctures fixed.

--Anoop
Take a look at these -

http://www.team-bhp.com/forum/motorb...ml#post3726349 (Michelin Pilot Road 2 & Pilot Street Radial Motorcycle Tyres launched)
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Old 10th June 2015, 15:23   #152
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Default Re: The Duke of Direwolves - Lisbeth, my KTM Duke 200

Doc, but these wont fit Duke 200, right? I saw this and first thing I did was to check if these (Ralson Speed Blaster) are available for Duke. Pilot Street will be better than the stock MRFs on tarmac, but on off the road? If I can get something like the old M45 ( in any brand), my search will be done.

--Anoop
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Old 10th June 2015, 15:38   #153
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Default Re: The Duke of Direwolves - Lisbeth, my KTM Duke 200

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Doc, but these wont fit Duke 200, right? I saw this and first thing I did was to check if these (Ralson Speed Blaster) are available for Duke. Pilot Street will be better than the stock MRFs on tarmac, but on off the road? If I can get something like the old M45 ( in any brand), my search will be done.

--Anoop
Why would they not fit? If Ceat Vertigo Sport can fit, then these can fit too.

Both have the rear as tubeless and the front as tube type. Both rears are same size (120/80 R17) but the Ceat front is a bit wider than the Ralson (110/80 vs 100/90 R17, respectively).

Last edited by ebonho : 10th June 2015 at 15:42.
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Old 10th June 2015, 15:43   #154
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Default Re: The Duke of Direwolves - Lisbeth, my KTM Duke 200

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Why would they not fit? If Ceat Vertigo Sport can fit, then these can fit too.

Both have the rear as tubeless and the front as tube type.
120/80-17 instead of the stock 150/60-17? Or, am I missing something?

I have seen Vertigo Spot of unk9ja's duke, but somehow, I thought they are tube type tyres and not tubeless.

--Anoop
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Old 10th June 2015, 15:46   #155
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Default Re: The Duke of Direwolves - Lisbeth, my KTM Duke 200

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Originally Posted by theexperthand View Post
120/80-17 instead of the stock 150/60-17? Or, am I missing something?

I have seen Vertigo Spot of unk9ja's duke, but somehow, I thought they are tube type tyres and not tubeless.

--Anoop
Ya the 120/80 R17 fits on the stock Duke rims, as does the 110/80 R17. There are photos somewhere of the same as well. Just the front fender need to be raised a bit. No other mod.

Remember the front is not tubeless. Some fitters might fit it as a tubeless tyre, but I would not.

Last edited by ebonho : 10th June 2015 at 15:47.
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Old 10th June 2015, 16:20   #156
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Default Re: The Duke of Direwolves - Lisbeth, my KTM Duke 200

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Originally Posted by theexperthand View Post
If I can get something like the old M45 ( in any brand), my search will be done.

--Anoop
You can get better. The Michelin Sirac Street has two 100/90 R17 tyres. If either/both are tubeless, then your search for tubeless dual purpose tyre for the front is over. And the pattern would be a good match with the Ralco Speed Blaster tubeless at the rear. Makes a difference.

Personally having ridden on the Vertigo Sports for quite some distance off road and in gravel as well as of course on road, I would give the Ralco a shot.

Addendum: The only issue is that the Siracs are actually Rear tyres. So to use them as Front tyres, you would probably have to flip them around (as people did with the M45s).

Last edited by ebonho : 10th June 2015 at 16:36.
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Old 10th June 2015, 16:34   #157
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Default Re: The Duke of Direwolves - Lisbeth, my KTM Duke 200

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You can get better. The Michelin Sirac Street has two 100/90 R17 tyres.
Having used both M45 and Sirac Street on same bike (Unicorn), I will any day pick M45 over Sirac. It is not that Sirac is bad when taken alone, but the tyre loses out when compared to M45.

M45 have superior wet breaking performance and have better traction in mud. On gravel, unless you need to break, both are fine - but under breaking, M45 holds the grip better than Sirac Street.

I guess the superiority of M45 may be because of the compound used - the tyre life was not great and I have never got more than 25K km from an M45, but I will take that any day over (assumed) 40K from a Sirac street.

Now that the rant is over, yes - the combination actually looks good, but the fly in the ointment is that the 100/90-17 Sirac Street (100/90 - 17 M/C 55P S.STREET) appears to be tubed type.

--Anoop

Last edited by theexperthand : 10th June 2015 at 16:38.
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Old 10th June 2015, 16:40   #158
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Default Re: The Duke of Direwolves - Lisbeth, my KTM Duke 200

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Originally Posted by theexperthand View Post
Having used both M45 and Sirac Street on same bike (Unicorn), I will any day pick M45 over Sirac. It is not that Sirac is bad when taken alone, but the tyre loses out when compared to M45.

M45 have superior wet breaking performance and have better traction in mud, in gravel, unless you need to break, both are fine - but under breaking, M45 holds the grip better than Sirac Street.

I guess the superiority of M45 may be because of the compound used - the tyre life was not great and I have never got more than 25K km from an M45, but I will take that any day over (assumed) 40K from a Sirac street.

Now that the rant is over, yes - the combination actually looks good, but the fly in the ointment is that the 100/90-17 Sirac Street (100/90 - 17 M/C 55P S.STREET) appears to be tubed type.

--Anoop
Its not a rant at all. I know many M45 purists/fanatics.

There are two 100/90s - check if the other one is tube type as well.

P.S. Did you get the same central tread scalloping issue with the M45s on the front wheel? A friend of mine did, and we never discovered why. Put it down to using a rear tyre on the front (even though we did flip it around).
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Old 10th June 2015, 16:51   #159
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Default Re: The Duke of Direwolves - Lisbeth, my KTM Duke 200

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Originally Posted by ebonho View Post
Its not a rant at all. I know many M45 purists/fanatics.

There are two 100/90s - check if the other one is tube type as well.

P.S. Did you get the same central tread scalloping issue with the M45s on the front wheel? A friend of mine did, and we never discovered why. Put it down to using a rear tyre on the front (even though we did flip it around).
I could find only one on the website, will scout the local tyre shops for sure.

Not sure if I can call it scalloping, but yet, I did get uneven wear. Till date, I was putting it down to my rim being out of shape due to the torturer it suffered. I never ran them till the threads did go all bald, used to change them when the threads are 3/4th of their life.

--Anoop
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Old 10th June 2015, 18:47   #160
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Default Re: The Duke of Direwolves - Lisbeth, my KTM Duke 200

Check out the reviews of the tyres for the D390 by Riderzone. It may help you to make a decision.

http://riderzone.in/best-tire-for-ktm-duke-390/

The Pilot street is also available in 150 section now.

I still have the Ceat Vertigo on my D390 and is still going good after 15k+ kms of use with no punctures till date, touchwood. Still good for a couple of thousands atleast as I can say form the tread depth.

This tyre is heavy, drops your top whack by atleast 30kmph in initial days and worsens over its life. Needs a mudguard raise in the front end. But great one for off roading. With a tyre protection you can go anywhere with minimum apprehensions. But with the Michelins advent with its superior tyres, this is loosing its sheen in the market. Still a VFM product for 2700INR for rear and 2200INR for the front.

And YES it is a tubeless.
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Old 11th June 2015, 12:14   #161
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Default Re: The Duke of Direwolves - Lisbeth, my KTM Duke 200

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And YES it is a tubeless.
Their official website says only the 120/80 one is tubeless. The 110/80 front one is actually a tube type tyre.

Also, please help me understand how the advent of the Michelins has taken the sheen off these tyres? The Michelins are pure tarmac tyres with tarmac tread, while these are on-off road button tyres.

Last edited by ebonho : 11th June 2015 at 12:28.
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Old 11th June 2015, 17:56   #162
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Default Re: The Duke of Direwolves - Lisbeth, my KTM Duke 200

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Originally Posted by ebonho View Post
Their official website says only the 120/80 one is tubeless. The 110/80 front one is actually a tube type tyre.

Also, please help me understand how the advent of the Michelins has taken the sheen off these tyres? The Michelins are pure tarmac tyres with tarmac tread, while these are on-off road button tyres.
Doc, Even I had the same q in mind when I saw their website last year. I went to Madhus Tyre and enquired about it. I got a positive feedback on the tubeless ones. And I jumped onto the Ceat bandwagon.

Today off roading terminology is riding upto Ladakh as I see in Bangalore. And 95% of the riders take the classic one doing it in 8 days max. And 90% of this lot transport the bikes to Delhi and ride from there. The route is mostly good when you compare it with Zanskar, Wari La or Marsimik La. The normal Jammu-Srinagar-Kargil-Leh-Nubra-Pangong Tso-Leh-Pang-Keylong-Rohtang-Manali-Delhi is about 3k kms all round. This can be done on a Metz if you dare to.

With a Ceat, you can do it pretty well but you will definitely not enjoy the ride for the rest of its life if you are a wringer of throttle. The bike is a bit lazy to move, loses its top whack as the life goes down. So the balance is Michelin. It is not so bad on the off roading, not so good as Metz in tarmac but a delicate balance in between. So people are more inclined towards the Michs and Pirellis so that they can enjoy the almost Metz feeling later too.

Also the weight factor, the Ceats are really heavy when compared to the Michs. And also the front end is not a 1:1 swap, the mudguard mounts needs to be reworked. All these are now stacked up against the Ceat.

Last year 5 of riders on Dukes from Bangalore had Ceats and 2 on Michs, but none this year on Ceats as everyone switched to Michs and Pirelli owing to the life after Ladakh factor. This is the reason I said the advent of Michs have taken the sheen off the Ceats.
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Old 11th June 2015, 18:19   #163
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Default Re: The Duke of Direwolves - Lisbeth, my KTM Duke 200

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everyone switched to Michs and Pirelli
You guys are getting PSDs in Bangalore? Manufacture year? I would prefer them over the Michelins if I were to move away from the Metzs. In spite of the fact that they are a bit heavier (very small difference).
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Old 11th June 2015, 18:23   #164
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Default Re: The Duke of Direwolves - Lisbeth, my KTM Duke 200

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Doc, Even I had the same q in mind when I saw their website last year.

Last year 5 of riders on Dukes from Bangalore had Ceats and 2 on Michs, but none this year on Ceats as everyone switched to Michs and Pirelli owing to the life after Ladakh factor. This is the reason I said the advent of Michs have taken the sheen off the Ceats.
Thank you for the detailed report, and the link. 30 KMph drop from top is a serious worry for D200, but more importantly, did you feel that the handle become heavier? On the handling department, what kind of difference did you observe?

Sadly, I have no experience of Leh, so I am not really able to gauge the situations from your post. My use will be closer to home - for the off the road and trail rides I enjoy in and around Bangalore. Sadly, I do not know how to give you a realistic picture of my usage pattern, but I love taking the bike where most of the normal people do not even think they can take their bike - be it Slush, dirt or gravel, and I do not hold back myself when I hit the trail.

I am really smitten by the Vertigo and Ralco, and also by the idea planted by Doc - Using Sirac Street on front (If available in its tubeless avatar).

--Anoop
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Old 15th June 2015, 13:07   #165
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Default Re: The Duke of Direwolves - Lisbeth, my KTM Duke 200

Been to madhus yesterday to get the alignment and balancing done for my car. While I was there, casually enquired about options for Duke 200 - they have Michelin Pilot Street radial in stock and recommended them - total cost 10K for both front and rear.

I checked with them if we can get Ralson or Ceat but they said they are not aware of either of them to be a correct fit on a Duke and have said they have never fixed one :(
Also, no tubeless design available in Sirac street.

--Anoop
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