[aveoman19]

Originally Posted by nikhilthegunner

I personally don't understand the fascination with AWD. Would people start offroading every day if the Safari had a 4x4 version? What difference does it make if it is there?

Well Sir, here's my take on the same. Living in Europe for more than 7 years, I have learnt the hard lesson of not finding traction in 2WD cars on snow, ice and slush. It isn't a great feeling when an accident happens at 10 kmph. Slowly watching the car slide towards a pole.

If you see the current situation in the northern areas of India, there is heavy snowfall and ice on various sections of the road. Granted these places make up for less than 5% of the remaining more accessible places in our country but what's the point if one buys the "Safari" and plans on a trip to Himachal Pradesh or Jammu, Ladakh and Kashmir or even some parts of Uttarakhand? Should I park the "SUV" in the parking lot of a resort and then book a Gypsy Taxi to reach those places? What if I wanted to take my Safari through the Atal Tunnel and beyond during heavy snowfall?

Another fear that comes to my mind is the weight of the vehicle and the inherent handicap an SUV or a large Crossover brings with it. It is always better to have more traction. The chances of getting stranded with a family in certain remote places should be minimised.

This is just a clarification of the argument to wish for an All Wheel Drive variant. Not for bragging rights. There isn't anything wrong with wishing for more is it? We are after all human beings. For some it may be a Large Panaromic sunroof but for me it will always be an AWD.

[ASP007]

As per the reports, Safari (Gravitas) will be launching without offering 4WD option! Looks like they haven't learned anything from the past launches.





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[Guna]

Originally Posted by nikhilthegunner

I personally don't understand the fascination with AWD. Would people start offroading every day if the Safari had a 4x4 version? What difference does it make if it is there? Frankly, I feel it would make sense if someone bought it and made good use of the system. At least, as opposed to using it once a year or something. I don't see why the absence of a four wheel drive system should be a deal breaker.

Obviously you don't understand because you don't have any such requirements. It is not necessary that one has to go off-roading everyday to justify the feature. For most of the people including me, using it couple of times in a year to go further in to a beaten trail which you would hesitate if you are driving a 2WD car is totally worth it.
Another aspect of AWD is that they enhance the safety of even normal (especially highway) driving by improving the traction, road-grip, cornering on slippery/wet roads.
Many 2WD cars tend to have torque steer but their 4WD counterparts wouldn't have it (XUV 500 is an example).

[vigneshkumar31]

Originally Posted by nikhilthegunner

I personally don't understand the fascination with AWD. Would people start offroading every day if the Safari had a 4x4 version? What difference does it make if it is there? Frankly, I feel it would make sense if someone bought it and made good use of the system. At least, as opposed to using it once a year or something. I don't see why the absence of a four wheel drive system should be a deal breaker.

Good question. And I want to answer this in detail as Im one of them people actually waiting for the AWD+AT combination to buy the Safari.

I drive a very first batch Safari Storme EX 4x2 and pushing it in the ninth year of proud ownership. I wanted to buy the VX 4x4 version but the difference of 2 lakhs was too steep for me, then. So I settled for the 4x2. I've been all around the country and used my Safari from hills to deserts to highway for intercity transfers, intra city household shifts and possibly every imaginable purpose. It is currently serving me well doing duty in the islands of Andaman. While I agree in these nine years, most of the time I got away with 4x2, I vowed that my next vehicle has to be AWD/4x4. The reasoning is better echoed in my post from the D2 SUV thread.

https://www.team-bhp.com/forum/suvs-...-shootout.html (The definitive full-size 7-seater Premium SUV shootout)

There has been enough debate within the forum and without it, regarding the relevance of offroad prowess or more specifically 4x4 provision in these premium SUVs. Naysayers argue - How many of the owners actually go off road? Why can’t hardcore off-roaders pick a Gurkha or a Thar instead of wrecking a 40 lakh asset? Well, I beg to differ. In my fantastic utopian garage I would have a hot hatch for zipping around town, a performance sedan with a vRS badge, a basic, tough as nails off-roader with park benches for seats, and a comfortable large family tourer that seats 5 adults even after a child seat is installed. But I can’t afford the cash, space or time for all of them. The SUV has to be the one car do all for me. I agree I’m not in the habit of driving around looking to arm wrestle gnarly rocks for fun on what is simply a moving 2BHK, but if during travels, I get mischievous or adventurous or both, or if I am faced with situations that 4x4 capability would inspire confidence, then there’s no point regretting going for 4x2 and saving few lakhs, a lesson learnt the hard way with 7 years on a 2WD safari. If its an SUV, it has to be 4x4. Having said that, a jack of all trades large family SUV might not necessarily need dedicated hardcore offroad kit to handle the above said minor misadventures and hence AWD would be an acceptable compromise if one looks to balance on-road behaviour where the car would spend most of its life with limited off the road capability. Settling for a 4x2 Fortuner? If you can get over body type, take a long hard look at the equally capable, better loaded Innova instead, sitting on the same platform, costing much lesser.

Premium/ luxury vehicles and go anywhere capabilities are not any more mutually exclusive. The best proof of this argument comes from a few segments above, where the pure luxe brands belting out the Urus' Levante's of the world. The best cheeky explanation for embracing the market's shift to SUVs ,was given by Rolls Royce in their Cullinan description as 'last mile connectivity' Not to be mistaken for an e-rikshaw we might take from the metro station, this SUV capability, is apparently for its highly affluent clientele to be able to traverse the last mile of tough trails, to eventually reach that exotic ski resort/ or a shooting spot in the middle of the desert, after plying on smooth tarmac all day for most of its life. While I am not planning to sign any movies or shoot in exotic locations, there's no doubt that simple family adventures can be all the more exciting with a little added confidence in turning all 4 wheels.

Just because we want an AWD capability we dont have to off road all day, just like every Porsche owner doesn't have to redline between every signal. The capability exists to paste a grin on our face on those special occasions when we need it.

[db DrivE]

I have a small question for those who have seen the all new Safari in reality.

How much of a size difference does it show in comparison to the Endeavour or the Fortuner?

This definitely seems larger than its fair competition though.

[Sebring]

Panoramic sunroof available? Wow, this news is really awesome and RavenAvi has been proven correct. Most of us were terribly disappointed when someone said that wont be provided. It was like pouring cold water on a hot launch

Originally Posted by CarguyNish

Got this information regarding New Safari.

• Will be available in 4 variants - XE/XM/XT/XZ
• 2 Seating Configurations available - 6 Seater (Captain Seats) & 7 Seater (Bench Seat).
• 3 colors have been confirmed - Royale Blue/Orcus White/Daytona Grey.
• Rear Disc Brakes & Electric Parking Brake Available.
• Panoramic Sunroof available in XT & XZ.
• 6 Speed Manual & 6 Speed Automatic available.
• Dealer training is scheduled for 3rd Week of January.
• Official Bookings will start soon after Unveil on January 26th.
• Test Drive Cars will be available from last week of January.

[CEF_Beasts]

One more spy shot. Must say it looks very classy in this white shade!

[Venkatesh]

Safari Taillights design revealed by Pratap Bose

[Familyguy]

Looks like they're making decent attempts to make the Safari look more SUV-ish by using angular design cues rather than the curvy ones of the Harrier.

[aansh singhania]

Originally Posted by ASP007

As per the reports, Safari (Gravitas) will be launching without offering 4WD option! Looks like they haven't learned anything from the past launches.

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IIRC it was never going to be offered with a 4wd right at launch. I am pretty sure the chances of them offering it even after launch are pretty slim. All this talk about 4wd only became hot after the renaming of the gravitas to the safari.

[Holyghost]

Originally Posted by The Rationalist

When Safari was available there were no 4WD lovers to be seen! Now when Gravitas is renamed as Safari everyone wants a 4WD. I would rather be worried about Harrier which is built on same platform being not yet crash tested, so this one also won't be crash tested before launch like Altroz. That is suspicious since all other cars from Tata stable have been crash tested. 4WD they can add later, safety I'm not sure.

I owned a Safari 4x4 and I guess I am entitled to say that I am totally disappointed the new Safari not having 4x4. It is not about whether people buy 4x4 or not, It is more about the product marketing/positioning.

Don't we all remember the beautiful Ads of Safari; Make Your Own Road, Reclaim your Life etc. Many love a car for its features and what it is capable of and not because of what they would do with it once they purchase. Safari brand name was built on being a go anywhere vehicle. Their Ad campaigns highlighted the 4x4 capability in almost all of their Ads. Though we all agree it was not as capable as a Gypsy or Thar, but it still struck a chord in our hearts. During my younger age, whenever I saw someone driving a Safari, the kind of image that pops up in my mind was a person who takes the car to some remote mountains/forests for weekend drives. Almost after 10 years, when I went to purchase the Safari, I didn't have the budget for 4x4, but a Ladakh and Bhutan trip was on the cards and thought I shouldn't regret not having 4x4 during the trip. Hence I stretched my loan amount by another lakh and went for the EX 4x4 version. The reason I loved and wanted to buy the car was due to the brand image it had created over the years, but still I was okay to buy its 4x2 version like the majority buyers of that vehicle. But I have to admit that decision was one of the best decisions I had taken. The confidence of having 4x4 and a Low Range gear box is huge. There were many instances where the 4x4 came to rescue. Not to forget the immense fun I used to have on beaten tracks, beaches, river crossings etc. These were not real off roading, but during vacations/trips, whenever I see some mild off road, I used to switch that 4x4 button and have some fun.

Only a few percentage of buyers would opt for 4x4 and even among them, only a few would take it to places where they'll actually need 4x4. However, it is this few buyers who creates the halo effect for the product. Think about international products like Defender, Land Cruisers, Pajeros etc. What is the first thing that comes to our mind when we think of these vehicles? What come to my mind is the off-roading videos and the Ads showing its off-roading prowess. Now think how would we feel if the manufacturer stops the 4wd versions of these vehicles citing lack of 4x4 demand in their home market?
For most including me, it is a similar feeling with the brand Safari even though it is not as capable as them, it had a similar fan base in India. It was the affordable desi version of a Pajero or a Land Cruiser. Such a brand image was built over decades and we expect Tata to do justice to that brand by launching a 4x4 or atleast an AWD version.

[Sebring]

But, why do you want that at launch? AWD is definitely coming as per the Tata top boffins. Maybe another 6months

Originally Posted by Holyghost

I owned a Safari 4x4 and I guess I am entitled to say that I am totally disappointed the new Safari not having 4x4.

[r0ckstar.1]

Originally Posted by Sebring

But, why do you want that at launch? AWD is definitely coming as per the Tata top boffins. Maybe another 6months

Do you have any data to support this timeline? I don't think a AWD/4x4 will be available to Safari in the next 12-18 months. That's a long wait and the mindshare of a product is when it's launched. If you lose that golden period, you are stuck with a product that doesn't excite the customers any more. Marketing guys may throw some more light into it. Tata will end-up in a catchup game for ever.

[Holyghost]

Originally Posted by Sebring

But, why do you want that at launch? AWD is definitely coming as per the Tata top boffins. Maybe another 6months

I dont think they committed to any timeline for AWD. The only comment I saw from the management was that the platform is capable of accommodating AWD and they can do it if there is demand. I really hope they launch the AWD. That showed they were not that serious about continuing the 4x4 legacy for the Safari brand.

[Sebring]

No, I don't have data on the timeline. Hoping it would come sooner, that's all

Originally Posted by r0ckstar.1

Do you have any data to support this timeline? I don't think a AWD/4x4 will be available to Safari in the next 12-18 months.