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Old 2nd November 2021, 18:20   #7666
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Re: The Official Fuel Prices Thread

Is it too difficult to allot seperate and dedicated petrol bunks for just commercial vehicles - trucks and all, and give them subsidized diesel ?
( Just thinking - can be wrong !)

Few across the highways, few on major city outskirts and so on.

Atleast this will prevent unnecessary inflated transport cost across all sectors depending on road transport.

I know as end users we'll continue to pay high cost, but this can try to bring inflation at a check.

Last edited by ptaneja : 2nd November 2021 at 18:21. Reason: Auto correct spelling!
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Old 2nd November 2021, 18:59   #7667
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Re: The Official Fuel Prices Thread

Quote:
Originally Posted by ptaneja View Post
Is it too difficult to allot seperate and dedicated petrol bunks for just commercial vehicles - trucks and all, and give them subsidized diesel ?
( Just thinking - can be wrong !)

Few across the highways, few on major city outskirts and so on.

Atleast this will prevent unnecessary inflated transport cost across all sectors depending on road transport.

I know as end users we'll continue to pay high cost, but this can try to bring inflation at a check.
This only opens up another avenue for corruption. How exactly do you think they are going to enforce it? Guys will just fill up in jerry cans/water bottles from these outlets.

I do remember reading that UK uses colored diesel for commercial vehicles and you will end up paying a heavy fine if they check for it in your car. Not sure how true/effective it has been in the field.
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Old 2nd November 2021, 19:25   #7668
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Re: The Official Fuel Prices Thread

i've been reading the last few pages of this thread since 30 minutes or so. I just realised that it's better I stop now and jump out and go fill a tankful for an upcoming trip this weekend. Else by the time I finish reading and reach the bunk, prices would've further gone up by then.

What could be the cost of building an underground massive fuel storage tank? If I'm allowed to construct one, guess I can breakeven in a matter of weeks, no matter the cost of it

Hope they don't resort to hourly price increases instead of daily

Last edited by Bibendum90949 : 2nd November 2021 at 19:42.
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Old 2nd November 2021, 20:33   #7669
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Re: The Official Fuel Prices Thread

Don't you realize that it is calibrated as per global crude oil prices and the rupee-dollar exchange value? So the pricing is totally out of their hands.

It is unfortunate that we import almost all crude and the rupee value keeps fluctuating.

So please don't blame them for the sky high prices. Eat less. Drive less.
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Old 2nd November 2021, 20:41   #7670
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Re: The Official Fuel Prices Thread

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Originally Posted by Nalin1 View Post
Don't you realize that it is calibrated as per global crude oil prices and the rupee-dollar exchange value? So the pricing is totally out of their hands.

Ha ha. Union Govt tax on Petrol has been raised from 9 Rs in 2014 to 33 Rs now.
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Old 2nd November 2021, 21:08   #7671
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Re: The Official Fuel Prices Thread

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Originally Posted by Nalin1 View Post
Don't you realize that it is calibrated as per global crude oil prices and the rupee-dollar exchange value? So the pricing is totally out of their hands.
When global crude oil prices goes down, “additional” excise duty increases. When global prices goes up, the increased additional excise duty doesn’t come down. What a calibration!!
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Old 2nd November 2021, 21:58   #7672
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Re: The Official Fuel Prices Thread

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Originally Posted by Nalin1 View Post
It is unfortunate that we import almost all crude and the rupee value keeps fluctuating.
India imports about 82% of it's oil needs. We do have Oil production but the output has been declining for the past 8 years by more than 15%. Perhaps the local production is being reserved to build our Strategic Petroleum reserves.

The Official Fuel Prices Thread-screen-shot-20211102-9.16.29-pm.png

We are the second biggest importer of crude after China. We are the 3rd largest consumer of crude after US and China. We consume about 5% of total Crude in the world. Not bad considering that we have about 18% of world population.

Crude and Natural gas are the 2nd and 3rd largest sources of electricity generation after coal. Crude oil accounted for 10.34% and natural gas accounted for 8.7% of the total electricity produced in 2017–18. This is apart from the 0.3% generated from Diesel. About 36% of electricity generated is from Diesel generators not connected to the grid (only >100 kVA are considered, not the smaller ones that are more ubiquitous). Also about 1 million tons of fuel is used in Coal power stations to start up and low powered operations.

This information is from Wikipedia, referenced from http://www.mospi.gov.in/sites/defaul...019-finall.pdf

Thus my understanding is that though fuel prices are high, it will not affect the common population as our total consumption is very low compared to our population.

Also EV does not really reduce the dependence on crude as that percentage is very low. We will continue to import crude and NG for other uses.

Also while the consumption figures are scary when taken in isolation, when we factor the population of 138 Cr, the actuals are very low.

What is scary is that considering the tax collection of 2.95 LCr on fuel and NG, per capita tax last year was Rs. 2,137.68. IE every man, woman and child in India has paid >2K as tax on Fuel itself.

Per capita Net National Income was ~1.2 Lakhs, However actual household incomes are estimated to be around 44K (estimated because consumption data has not been published after 2011-12). https://www.iipsindia.ac.in/sites/de...compressed.pdf See Pg 93.
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Old 2nd November 2021, 22:08   #7673
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Re: The Official Fuel Prices Thread

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Originally Posted by wildsdi5530 View Post
India imports about 82% of it's oil needs. We do have Oil production but the output has been declining for the past 8 years by more than 15%. Perhaps the local production is being reserved to build our Strategic Petroleum reserves.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Nalin1 View Post
Don't you realize that it is calibrated as per global crude oil prices and the rupee-dollar exchange value? So the pricing is totally out of their hands.
Such numb and blind point of view without considering the fact that high fuel prices are simply due to the Central government looting by increasing the excise duty on fuel from 9 rupees a liter to 33 rupees a liter. That is why our petrol and diesel prices did not drop below 75 rupees a liter even when crude prices went negative.

India has been importing over 80% of crude for decades now . What is new here ?

This kind of relentless justification definitely has a political edge to it and is downright offensive to the hard working man and woman. Will go ahead and report both posts.

Last edited by Ragavsr : 2nd November 2021 at 22:17.
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Old 2nd November 2021, 22:30   #7674
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Re: The Official Fuel Prices Thread

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Originally Posted by Gotcha View Post
Instead of just endlessly discussing about the rising fuel prices and taxes we need to start doing something we can. I feel the best way to show our displeasure in a completely democratic way is to start decreasing our consumption of everything non-essential: just buy only veggies, grains and the bare essentials for a month or two. Put off buying new electronics, home appliances or a car (so called luxury & sin items@28% GST ), minimize travelling for leisure and be in a state of self imposed lockdown (atleast for those who can work remotely). The tax revenues will start going down, economy will shrink and "they" will feel the pinch too!
You are naive to think so. Some govt. babu, ever ready to screw middle class, will figure out that people are saving and not spending and will announce new taxes/mechanism to snatch it from you. Just remember one thing - you can reduce your expenses, govt. can't/won't and ultimately those expenses will have to be borne by the taxpayers.
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Old 2nd November 2021, 22:48   #7675
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Re: The Official Fuel Prices Thread

We have a cumulative monthly running of 4,500kms shared between our two cars, one is a petrol and the other is a diesel. And in my state there’s only Rs 1 difference between petrol and diesel, so it hardly makes a difference as Kwid and Rapid give almost same mileage. Just this evening we were having this particular discussion that monthly fuel bills have actually started to pinch our pockets for real and the kind of roads we have only adds salt to it. When we bought Rapid, we used to get a full tank for approx 3200 and now the same costs ~4800. My mom wants to shift to an EV now but the problem is EVs are not yet there in the accessible range for an average buyer.
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Old 2nd November 2021, 22:56   #7676
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Re: The Official Fuel Prices Thread

Just filled 50 litres of regular diesel in an Indian oil outlet in Bangalore. Paid Rs. 5225/- at nearly Rs.104.50 per litre! I just cannot understand how we got here! I mean, how come there hasn’t been much of resistance from trade unions and transport companies? It’s just unreal pricing, which in turn pushes the prices of all essentials!

In 2008 when I bought my first car, a diesel, I recall paying something around Rs.28 to Rs.35, or thereabouts, and now we are at nearly Rs.105 now! I don’t know if any other essential commodity had risen in prices like fuel in India!

And the worst part is that there is just no going back now. Even if a new government comes in, they would not want to lose this easy revenue.

For a moment, let’s forget about us and just think how this affects the lower income groups in our country! Extremely sad! I feel the government owes an explanation, but who am I kidding!
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Old 2nd November 2021, 23:30   #7677
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Re: The Official Fuel Prices Thread

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Originally Posted by Ragavsr View Post
Such numb and blind point of view without considering the fact that high fuel prices are simply due to the Central government looting by increasing the excise duty

This kind of relentless justification definitely has a political edge to it and is downright offensive to the hard working man and woman. Will go ahead and report both posts.
Hi Ragavsr,

You missed my sarcasm completely .

I am fuming underneath. Right now I need to refuel as my car is displaying low fuel warning. But I am still calculating a reasonable amount for about 4 days now, before heading to the bunk.

I am checking this thread regularly as I trust this forum to come up with a wild idea on how to navigate this unprecedented situation.
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Old 3rd November 2021, 00:03   #7678
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Re: The Official Fuel Prices Thread

Ok - This is my last post on this thread and then I click unsubscribe. A lot uninformed trolling here!

Yes, fuel prices are very high and will affect budgets for many. When duties were increased they were an opportunity to get cash for the Govt. and then taxes were cut to give economic growth in the right sectors and then Covid happened, stimulus packages were given, and then this crude price went up leaving a lot of Govts. around the world in this situation. (I know a lot of economists on this thread think cheaper fuel is the only important thing).

See fuel prices of other countries here maybe it brings peace to some of you.

https://www.globalpetrolprices.com/gasoline_prices/

Picked out some relevant ones:

India: USD 1.445 /L
China: 1.272
Canada: 1.344
Japan: 1.435
South Korea: 1.525
Czech Republic: 1.643
Spain: 1.736
New Zealand: 1.875
Singapore: 1.884
France: 1.910
Germany: 1.949
United Kingdom: 1.966
Italy: 2.021
Netherlands: 2.282
Hong Kong: 2.648
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Old 3rd November 2021, 02:15   #7679
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Re: The Official Fuel Prices Thread

Quote:
Originally Posted by SLK View Post
Ok - This is my last post on this thread and then I click unsubscribe. A lot uninformed trolling here!

Yes, fuel prices are very high and will affect budgets for many. When duties were increased they were an opportunity to get cash for the Govt. and then taxes were cut to give economic growth in the right sectors and then Covid happened, stimulus packages were given, and then this crude price went up leaving a lot of Govts. around the world in this situation. (I know a lot of economists on this thread think cheaper fuel is the only important thing).

See fuel prices of other countries here maybe it brings peace to some of you.

https://www.globalpetrolprices.com/gasoline_prices/

Picked out some relevant ones:

India: USD 1.445 /L
China: 1.272
Canada: 1.344
Japan: 1.435
South Korea: 1.525
Czech Republic: 1.643
Spain: 1.736
New Zealand: 1.875
Singapore: 1.884
France: 1.910
Germany: 1.949
United Kingdom: 1.966
Italy: 2.021
Netherlands: 2.282
Hong Kong: 2.648
It will be better to see this small data with reference to another data set. Otherwise, it is like comparing the size of Earth vs Jupiter withtout taking into consideration say volume or density. Or it will be like analysing the share price of a company using just one metric say PE ratio. It tells little witout any other ratio being taken into consideration. Or it will be like comparing the BHP of two cars without taking into consideration their kerb weights (BHP/tonne).


Taking the above data and simultaneously jotting down the price of a Big Mac Burger from Mc Donald's gives a fair idea of the real life prices. Have a look.

The Big Mac Index being produced by The Economist since many decades is an easy way to explain to newbies the concept of PPP. There can be a whole lot of analysis done on te basis of this table but for the sake of simplicity, lets just leave it to that. See the price of petrol in a country and the price of the burger there. The price of the burger tells you how affordable it is to buy the burger (which is exactly same in all countries) in a particular country and then see the petrol price to imagine/assess if the price of the petrol is relatively high or low in India.

Source of Big Mac Index Data: https://www.statista.com/statistics/...for-a-big-mac/
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Old 3rd November 2021, 06:42   #7680
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Re: The Official Fuel Prices Thread

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Originally Posted by SLK View Post
Relevant meaning "only the ones which are higher"!!!

First compare with poor countries like India
India - 1.449$
Pakistan - 0.804$
Nepal - 1.085$
Bangladesh - 1.039$
Uzbekistan - 0.916$
Morocco - 1.160$
Philippines - 1.192$


And even some richer countries

USA - 0.988$
Argentina - 0.966$
Mexico - 1.167$
Thailand - 1.202$
Botswana - 0.961$
Sri Lanka - 0.911$
Brazil - 1.155$
Canada - 1.339$
Australia - 1.269$

There are lots more.
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