[JayKis]

Originally Posted by Porschefire

Let me get this right. Your hate for Rossi is because his strategy of riding a fast bike slow and then passing his opponents late in the race did not work against Stoner and Lorenzo?

Lastly, its not only us fans who are harping about the "one true religion",

I rest my case.

All of this was started by Rossi fan boys who were eloquently waxing their rider to be the greatest rider of all time, called him a bike developer, supreme hustler. There was 21 categories (which got deleted). Showed them facts, opinions from other credible sources. They questioned the facts without reason, they questioned the reporters without reason, they questioned my character without reason. They gave all their ugly opinions and then I gave mine. Then it stopped. Posts got deleted and you arrive just in time to start another round now.

Fact is that Rossi is not the greatest racer of all times. He is a great racer, no doubt. The facts also provide that Rossi has a bad head-to-head against Stoner, Lorenzo and Marc Marquez.

He is a legend, which I have already agreed to. You can support Rossi all through what you want. You can worship him. If you are worshipping some one, then doesnt that mean its a religion? Religion makes you blind-was the point. You can believe in your mind that he is the greatest racer to have ever walked on earth. But if you post it here, people are going to question it!

Am not taking anything away from Rossi here. Rossi himself is a realist as Burgess says. He knows where he stands w.r.t his current competition. But some of fan boys refuse to see the reality of a gradual decline, all relative.

Lets be objective.

Originally Posted by MonsterPatrol

Wow! Another fanboy joins the debate.. Ill informed (as usual) of the recent ugly remarks made by his gang totally unaware of the continuous edits/deletion/moving of posts by the mods. Ready to point fingers always. Amazing!

Not in diapers,Lorenzo was already an Aprilla 50cc champion then.Kindly get your facts right before posting nonsense.

edit: previous post AGO 15. Typo.

Lets give him a benefit of doubt, before he proves himself the other way, right?

[JayKis]

And for the one who posted on the Brittens. Got this lovely piece accidentally.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4MbvMqNAFVY

[Sheel]

Originally Posted by JayKis

So if some one questions Rossi it becomes a bickering or a moaning? Why would KR Jr want to bicker about Rossi in 2012?

Simple, because after Rossi's arrival, whatever hopes Roberts Jr had of repeating the standards set by his dad, evaporated.

Burgess or Agostini haven't really said that and whatever they have said, has some truth in it or is of different perspective.

About the comment he cant race in the wet isnt true anymore. He used to be bad in wet weather but his results of late shows he has become good at it.

Sorry, he still can't. In which wet-race did he score a podium? Forget a win in his career in a wet-race.

Also, not riding in the rain fast enough doesn't make him less, similar to what Rossi did on Ducati. I will say, this being a wise decision for both.

Racing is not a contact sport! Rossi and Marquez are the only ones who regularly indulge in it.

Jay, I am really glad Dorna & FIM don't think the way you do. Because your favorite rider can't slug it out, you will post anything to defend.

If it would be dangerous, contact would have led to penalization/ride through [still does if they feel its on purpose]

So, how many times has Rossi been penalized for dangerous riding?

Rossi's record speaks for himself and his lack of record versus his current competition speaks of the others.

This I agree to some extent and I won't give lame excuses like age or has been there/done that etc

But he is still good and he will either be the World Champion in 2015 or the runner up, not bad, eh...?

Let me say this again, as stated by you, I have no where found Rossi to ridicule his competition [which is on record] If you have any video, then please post, else I would humbly request you to take back those words

[Parth46]

The recent tone of some folks here has become even more toxic, despite requests from several senior members to see some sense and stop flaming and pitching for fights.

And regarding deleted posts and edits by mods, please look at how many of your own posts have been deleted by mods and received infractions, before blaming Rossi fanboys. Talk about respect for other riders and the sport only when you're willing to give some. Constantly trying to insult the GREATEST OF ALL TIME TO WALK GOD'S GREEN EARTH and then talking about respect. LOL.

It's a very simple case of trying to prove your favorite rider is god, even though it's impossible, folks will die tryin'.

And the Valentino Rossi support that keeps pouring in only helps in making them feel more isolated and pissed off, hence the aggravation.

No dearth of haters in the world. Haters gonna hate, Rossi's gonna win.

They accuse fanboys of character assassination, and then they go posting nonsense about Rossi himself, and when members ask for supporting videos to show where Rossi has bad-mouthed competitors, it's a mountain of gibberish to the rescue.

It would've been funny if it wasn't so stupid.

[MonsterPatrol]

Originally Posted by Sheel

Sorry, he still can't. In which wet-race did he score a podium? Forget a win in his career in a wet-race.

Since the arrival of Jorge Lorenzo in the premier class there have been 15 wet races.

A comparison of Lorenzo vs Rossi in wet conditions.

Lorenzo – 4 wins, 2 2nd places, 3 3rd places.
Rossi – 2 wins, 3 2nd places, 2 3rd places.

Total points in wet races
Lorenzo – 226 pts.
Rossi – 196 pts.

Indeed rain separates men from the boys!

[Sheel]

Originally Posted by MonsterPatrol

Since the arrival of Jorge Lorenzo in the premier class there have been 15 wet races.

A comparison of Lorenzo vs Rossi in wet conditions.

Lorenzo – 4 wins, 2 2nd places, 3 3rd places.
Rossi – 2 wins, 3 2nd places, 2 3rd places.

Hi!

Could you please provide me with the link where you got this source of information?

And, since Lorenzo's arrival, who has won the most no of races in wet-conditions? [Of course other than these both]

[b16h22]

Originally Posted by MonsterPatrol

Since the arrival of Jorge Lorenzo in the premier class there have been 15 wet races.

A comparison of Lorenzo vs Rossi in wet conditions.

Lorenzo – 4 wins, 2 2nd places, 3 3rd places.
Rossi – 2 wins, 3 2nd places, 2 3rd places.

Total points in wet races
Lorenzo – 226 pts.
Rossi – 196 pts.

Indeed rain separates men from the boys!

You forgot Vale was on a slow ducati for a couple of seasons. These stats are pointless. I still remember Lorenzo signalling the race to be stopped in the rain hit 2012 sepang gp just because he was scared.

[MonsterPatrol]

Originally Posted by Sheel

Hi!

Could you please provide me with the link where you got this source of information?

And, since Lorenzo's arrival, who has won the most no of races in wet-conditions? [Of course other than these both]

Motogp.com/results.

I will do that and post it as soon as I can. I think it is Pedrosa,not entirely sure.

Originally Posted by b16h22

You forgot Vale was on a slow ducati for a couple of seasons. These stats are pointless. I still remember Lorenzo signalling the race to be stopped in the rain hit 2012 sepang gp just because he was scared.

Sir, not sure how well you know your motogp but the ducati has always been a great performer in wet conditions. Everyone on the paddock knows this.If it's wet Ducati will be up there.Watch the older races. Some of Nicky hayden's best results on the Duc in wet conditions.

[JayKis]

Originally Posted by Sheel

Simple, because after Rossi's arrival, whatever hopes Roberts Jr had of repeating the standards set by his dad, evaporated.
Burgess or Agostini haven't really said that and whatever they have said, has some truth in it or is of different perspective.

Kenny Roberts Jr retired in 2007. He was asked about Rossi's bike development skills and his travails at ducati in 2012. That is when he made the statements.
http://www.superbikeplanet.com/2012/Apr/120413-1046.htm

Agostini's statement on GPone!
http://www.gpone.com/en/201110035107...-Hailwood.html

Jeremy Burgess on Rossi
http://www.foxsports.com.au/motor-sp...-1226321784807

I believe you cant even question the characters of Agostini and Burgess!

Originally Posted by Sheel

Sorry, he still can't. In which wet-race did he score a podium? Forget a win in his career in a wet-race.

4 wins, 7 podiums in all! The Stats also show that Lorenzo is getting better and better at wet weather races! Whereas Rossi is the one slipping! He has only 3 podiums since 2009 and his last win came in 2009 Jerez!

Originally Posted by Sheel

If it would be dangerous, contact would have led to penalization/ride through [still does if they feel its on purpose]
So, how many times has Rossi been penalized for dangerous riding?

Favourite boy getting the favourite treatment. How else do you explain a WLF on his leather? Marc Marquez is in the same mould. Both of them backed by tons of money and Dorna's hands seemed to be cuffed.

Originally Posted by Sheel

Let me say this again, as stated by you, I have no where found Rossi to ridicule his competition [which is on record] If you have any video, then please post, else I would humbly request you to take back those words

There are two aspects to this. Respect as a racer, respect as a personality. Not taking away the respect to Rossi being a racer. He is a very good one. Respect as a personality is suspect. Rossi has a feud with each and every major competitor of his. Typical bully behaviour. Just because of the money backing.

Rossi's feuds with Biaggi (Rossi infact hit Biaggi).
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/sport/mot...s-witness.html

Rossi's feud with GIbernau
http://thedoctor.ru/en/news/rossi-gi...st-behind-them

Rossi on Stoner (after retirement)
http://www.visordown.com/motorcycle-...ugh/21958.html

Rossi says his rivals are Pussies
http://www.foxsports.com.au/motor-sp...-1226054408785


You can try discrediting all his competition and all the news articles but the point is his personality is cheeky and he gets no respect for his personality.

Originally Posted by MonsterPatrol

Since the arrival of Jorge Lorenzo in the premier class there have been 15 wet races.

A comparison of Lorenzo vs Rossi in wet conditions.

Lorenzo – 4 wins, 2 2nd places, 3 3rd places.
Rossi – 2 wins, 3 2nd places, 2 3rd places.

Total points in wet races
Lorenzo – 226 pts.
Rossi – 196 pts.

Indeed rain separates men from the boys!

You are the man with reason. You see things objectively. You can see that water is not wine! Rain separates the men from the boys!

I could see 17 races thou from 2008 to 2014. Got the data out of wiki thou.

Originally Posted by Sheel

Hi!

Could you please provide me with the link where you got this source of information?

And, since Lorenzo's arrival, who has won the most no of races in wet-conditions? [Of course other than these both]

Originally Posted by MonsterPatrol

Motogp.com/results.

I will do that and post it as soon as I can. I think it is Pedrosa,not entirely sure.

You are right, it is Pedrosa.

From 2008 to Current.
Pedrosa has 5 wins, 3 second places, 2 third places
Lorenzo has 4 wins, 1 second place and 2 third place
Rossi has 3 wins, 2 second places, 1 third place

A comparison with Stoner yields this.
From 2006 to 2012,
Stoner has 5 wins, 6 third places.
Pedrosa has 4 wins, 2 second places, 2 third places
Rossi has 3 wins, 2 second places, 2 third places

Originally Posted by b16h22

You forgot Vale was on a slow ducati for a couple of seasons. These stats are pointless. I still remember Lorenzo signalling the race to be stopped in the rain hit 2012 sepang gp just because he was scared.

Ducati is good in the rains. Rossi's one podium came in a wet Lemans race on the Ducati.
Was lucky enough to watch that 2012 motogp in Sepang itself. We were sitting in the first corner and the conditions were wretched and it was difficult to see the bikes. It was not only Lorenzo, a lot of riders were signalling the race to be stopped. Lorenzo in fact did a massive save in the final lap (before it was red flagged)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=v0YNNfE8dsk

[JayKis]

Originally Posted by MonsterPatrol

Since the arrival of Jorge Lorenzo in the premier class there have been 15 wet races.

A comparison of Lorenzo vs Rossi in wet conditions.

Lorenzo – 4 wins, 2 2nd places, 3 3rd places.
Rossi – 2 wins, 3 2nd places, 2 3rd places.

Total points in wet races
Lorenzo – 226 pts.
Rossi – 196 pts.

Indeed rain separates men from the boys!

My sincerest apologies. Got the 2009 data incorrect. Wrongly attributed an extra win to Rossi and took one away from Stoner! Still found two data point anomalies. (With Lorenzo having an extra third and Rossi having an extra second).

Not that it changes the crux of the discussion. Pedrosa leads by a whisker from Lorenzo. Both lead Rossi and Rossi's last wet weather win came in Indiannapolis in 2008! So the bravery and cowardice point still sticks!

2008 to 2014 -Pedrosa leads Lorenzo by a whisker.
Pedrosa - 3 wins, 4 2nd places, 2 3rd places
Lorenzo – 4 wins, 2 2nd places, 2 3rd places.
Rossi – 2 wins, 2 2nd places, 2 3rd places.

Stoner was the man for wet weather though. He leads everyone by a country mile in their time together. We knew he was a brave pilot. His results are telling.

2006 to 2012
Stoner - 6 wins, 0 2nd place, 5 third places.
Pedrosa - 2 wins, 3 2nd places, 2 3rd places.
Rossi – 2 wins, 2 2nd places, 2 3rd places.

2008 to 2012
Stoner - 5 wins, 0 2nd place, 4 third places.
Lorenzo - 3 wins, 2 2nd places, 1 3rd place.
Pedrosa - 2 wins, 3 2nd places, 1 3rd place.
Rossi – 2 wins, 2 2nd places, 2 3rd places.



Mods please remove the last attachment from the post( before this one) on wet weather results. The latest one is more correct. We are in the process of reconcilation!

[killjoy]

https://ayodonkbaby.wordpress.com/20...ter-in-motogp/

http://www.idolium.com/idol/publicat...ider-all-times

No words needed from me.

[Sheel]

Originally Posted by MonsterPatrol

Motogp.com/results.

I will do that and post it as soon as I can. I think it is Pedrosa,not entirely sure.

Please do so. It won't burst any bubble of mine, I don't carry any inhibitions either, but am under the impression that Rossi had an edge under wet-conditions. Andrea Dovizioso is very good as well. Frankly, in Moto-GP, haven't found Chris Vermeulen to be the rain master [as called]

Originally Posted by JayKis

Kenny Roberts Jr retired in 2007. He was asked about Rossi's bike development skills and his travails at ducati in 2012. That is when he made the statements.
http://www.superbikeplanet.com/2012/Apr/120413-1046.htm

Agostini's statement on GPone!
http://www.gpone.com/en/201110035107...-Hailwood.html

Jeremy Burgess on Rossi
http://www.foxsports.com.au/motor-sp...-1226321784807

I believe you cant even question the characters of Agostini and Burgess!

Sour grapes.

Kenny could never have an upper hand against Rossi and Burgess was unceremoniously dropped, so they both will blabber. Stoner might be like Mika, but that is not the point. No where does Ago mention that Rossi's wins are attributed because of something else.

Favourite boy getting the favourite treatment. How else do you explain a WLF on his leather? Marc Marquez is in the same mould. Both of them backed by tons of money and Dorna's hands seemed to be cuffed.

Sorry, but you don't convince me enough. If it would have been dangerous to be fatal, they would have been penalized.

Rossi's feuds with Biaggi (Rossi infact hit Biaggi).
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/sport/mot...s-witness.html

You don't want me to post the video [where Biaggi tried to push Rossi off], do you?

Rossi's feud with GIbernau
http://thedoctor.ru/en/news/rossi-gi...st-behind-them

And Sete Gibernau didn't win a race after that. That is what bad omen does.

Rossi on Stoner (after retirement)
http://www.visordown.com/motorcycle-...ugh/21958.html

Rossi says his rivals are Pussies
http://www.foxsports.com.au/motor-sp...-1226054408785

Don't get me started on Stoner. Why isn't he fishing or racing V8 cars? Why is he not racing?
He did have talent, but he made his mouth bigger than that.

You can try discrediting all his competition and all the news articles but the point is his personality is cheeky and he gets no respect for his personality.

You either understand binary or you don't.

Where has any other rider said, I don't like Rossi's personality or he has not been helpful or something on those lines?

If it merely the way you see things, then fine, you are entitled to your opinion, but please [without facts] don't push it through.

Could you and official J Lo fan answer, as to why did Lorenzo change from #48 to #99? What is the trivia behind it? Would like to know

I just wish, Marc to gain back his composure and bring some much needed interest in the 2015 championship. For nothing does one win a Moto GP championship on debut.

Thanks.

[MonsterPatrol]

Originally Posted by JayKis

Was lucky enough to watch that 2012 motogp in Sepang itself. We were sitting in the first corner and the conditions were wretched and it was difficult to see the bikes. It was not only Lorenzo, a lot of riders were signalling the race to be stopped. Lorenzo in fact did a massive save in the final lap (before it was red flagged)

Wow Jay that must've been a great experience. Do share

Originally Posted by Sheel

Please do so. It won't burst any bubble of mine, I don't carry any inhibitions either, but am under the impression that Rossi had an edge under wet-conditions.

The results say otherwise. Rossi a distant 4th compared to Lorenzo, Pedrosa and Stoner.

Originally Posted by Sheel

Sour grapes.
Kenny could never have an upper hand against Rossi and Burgess was unceremoniously dropped, so they both will blabber. .

Burgess was sacked 18 months after this interview not before.

Originally Posted by Sheel

Don't get me started on Stoner. Why isn't he fishing or racing V8 cars? Why is he not racing?

He will be racing in the famed Suzuka 8 hours event this year.

Originally Posted by Sheel

Could you and official J Lo fan answer, as to why did Lorenzo change from #48 to #99? What is the trivia behind it? Would like to know

He wanted to change his number after parting ways with his manager who used the same number 48 back in his racing days. He had shortlisted a few numbers and let his fans decide for him through voting. Number 99 got the highest votes.

[Sheel]

Originally Posted by MonsterPatrol

The results say otherwise. Rossi a distant 4th compared to Lorenzo, Pedrosa and Stoner.

Please post the link of the same.

He will be racing in the famed Suzuka 8 hours event this year.

I meant Moto GP.

He wanted to change his number after parting ways with his manager who used the same number 48 back in his racing days. He had shortlisted a few numbers and let his fans decide for him through voting. Number 99 got the highest votes.

Good to know, thanks for sharing

[killjoy]

Originally Posted by MonsterPatrol

He wanted to change his number after parting ways with his manager who used the same number 48 back in his racing days. He had shortlisted a few numbers and let his fans decide for him through voting. Number 99 got the highest votes.

Please read the links that I have posted in my previous post to this.