[ebonho]

I hope not too. And I hope they are more proactive and do not wait for a customer to complain before moving.

I mean if its something the company knows, then the vehicle owners should be called and the cars called in for a retro-fit automatically.

Not wait to see who complains and raises a storm (pardon the pun!)

[swiftnfurious]

Originally Posted by supersom

Thanks, Luke! I will definitely speak to him. Is the name of the Prerana sales head Karthik? Thanks for the reference - i'll mention Ranganath - and will keep everybody posted...

Karthik is a sales manager in Prerana. Ranganath is AGM - Sales (Passenger vehicles), Prerana.

[supersom]

Originally Posted by ebonho

Apparently there was a problem in the rear door hinges/locks in the 2012 lots which has been rectified in the 2013 lots. These were replaced on a customer's 2012 Storme when he complained of the rattling.

That is the sort of stuff that I'm talking about. I'd much rather have a something fixed proactively and at the factory than to go through iterations with the service center. Leads to wasted days and an iffy mind.

Originally Posted by swiftnfurious

Karthik is a sales manager in Prerana. Ranganath is AGM - Sales (Passenger vehicles), Prerana.

Not sure if he is the Ranganath Luke has spoken of. If he is, I can understand why the exception was made. I called up Prerana yesterday, armed with the info from Luke, and they were quite vehement that they are not committing black 2013 LXs to anyone. Interesting!

Concorde said that black 2013 LX can be had in about 25 "working" days (he was specific about the "working" part). That's about 1.5 months, which takes us into April already. My experience with Concorde thus far hasn't been the greatest and I would prefer to stick with Prerana, unless it makes a huge difference on another front.

[ebonho]

Originally Posted by supersom

That is the sort of stuff that I'm talking about. I'd much rather have a something fixed proactively and at the factory than to go through iterations with the service center. Leads to wasted days and an iffy mind.

Problem here is how long (and how many iterations) do you wait for before you decide that its (probably) safe to pick one up now?

P.S. The situation is the same for Black Ex's. Apparently there are still 2 from 2012 in stock with Tata Motors, before they start billing the 2013 ones.

[Lukeskywalker]

Not sure if he is the Ranganath Luke has spoken of. If he is, I can understand why the exception was made. I called up Prerana yesterday, armed with the info from Luke, and they were quite vehement that they are not committing black 2013 LXs to anyone. Interesting!

Are you conveying that you did indeed speak to Ranganath and he said that the Black LX 2013 cannot be committed? If that is the case, I find it strange as Ranganath says he hasn't heard from anybody who has referred my reference so far. If you speak to Karthik, ask to speak to Ranganath, I'm sure your anxiety will be cleared.

[supersom]

Originally Posted by Lukeskywalker

No, he booked his car a couple if days ago, I spoke to the sales head at Prerana, he still says there is no such thing as clearing old stock, maybe you can speak to him as well and refer this thread, his name is Ranganath.

Terribly sorry; I got this all wrong. I thought Ranganath is the name of your friend and the sales head is Karthik. Very sorry.

Originally Posted by Lukeskywalker

Are you conveying that you did indeed speak to Ranganath and he said that the Black LX 2013 cannot be committed? If that is the case, I find it strange as Ranganath says he hasn't heard from anybody who has referred my reference so far. If you speak to Karthik, ask to speak to Ranganath, I'm sure your anxiety will be cleared.

Karthik called again today morning and informed that the status of black 2013 LXs is still the same. Now, I will ask him to put me through to Ranganath. Could you PM me Ranganath's number, as I cannot send a PM.

[methecupid]

I am so surprised that so little has been said about the safety of this car (or variant)!

It wasn't until yesterday that i realized the LX/EX versions don't have airbags. Not 2, 4, 6, 12; not side or curtain et al. None! Now this is a car that is being raved about on the engineering marvel, updated platform, butch looks. This is also a car that apparently will take me on extreme off-roading and has better handling dynamics at 3 digit speeds. This is also a car which will ram the steering into my chest and the shards of glasses/ dashboard onto my passenger face in case any of the aforementioned events go wrong!

I can't wait for this insipid Govt. or regulators to wake up from your their slumber and say "well! from so an so date no vehicle without a minimum of 2 front airbags are allowed to be sold"; just they have rolled out BSII, BSIII, BSIV blah! blah!

So, do i still think EX is the best VFM? Go figure!

[tsk1979]

Originally Posted by methecupid

I am so surprised that so little has been said about the safety of this car (or variant)!

It wasn't until yesterday that i realized the LX/EX versions don't have airbags. Not 2, 4, 6, 12; not side or curtain et al. None! Now this is a car that is being raved about on the engineering marvel, updated platform, butch looks. This is also a car that apparently will take me on extreme off-roading and has better handling dynamics at 3 digit speeds. This is also a car which will ram the steering into my chest and the shards of glasses/ dashboard onto my passenger face in case any of the aforementioned events go wrong!

I can't wait for this insipid Govt. or regulators to wake up from your their slumber and say "well! from so an so date no vehicle without a minimum of 2 front airbags are allowed to be sold"; just they have rolled out BSII, BSIII, BSIV blah! blah!

So, do i still think EX is the best VFM? Go figure!

Till the Govt makes airbags compulsary, there will always be a cheaper variant with no airbags.
Let me give you an example.
The Liva GD has ABS and no airbags. Paying 20,000 more gives you airbags. But most people buy without airbags.
Same story here. You have an option to buy airbags.

If an when Govt refuses to be Arm twisted by SIAM, airbags will be compulsary, and then you will find airbags on all variants. Now air bag cost is only about 5-15000 INR. For a small car costing 2L. its a significant increase, but for 10L vehicles it won't matter much.

[methecupid]

Originally Posted by tsk1979

Now air bag cost is only about 5-15000 INR. For a small car costing 2L. its a significant increase, but for 10L vehicles it won't matter much.

Exactly the point. We are not talking about the late 80s when the only cars revving up were Padminis and Standard 2000s. We get up to some serious speeds these days. Speeds which should not be safe on Indian roads. I stay in a place in Navi Mumbai which sees speeds of more than 120 easily and accident galore just as easily as well.

My point is that it is sacrilegious for a car of this mass not to have a basic setup of airbags - specifically when it is not inexpensive. I am sure they will put in airbags in their revised EX model in a few months or years, just feel it's like shortchanging the guys who go for it up front. If one doesn't care for airbags go for the LX. But I shouldn't be asked to get the top model to get airbags!

[tsk1979]

Originally Posted by methecupid

Exactly the point. We are not talking about the late 80s when the only cars revving up were Padminis and Standard 2000s. We get up to some serious speeds these days. Speeds which should not be safe on Indian roads. I stay in a place in Navi Mumbai which sees speeds of more than 120 easily and accident galore just as easily as well.

My point is that it is sacrilegious for a car of this mass not to have a basic setup of airbags - specifically when it is not inexpensive. I am sure they will put in airbags in their revised EX model in a few months or years, just feel it's like shortchanging the guys who go for it up front. If one doesn't care for airbags go for the LX. But I shouldn't be asked to get the top model to get airbags!

This is where regulation steps in.
The company can offer "airbags" for 20K more. But why would they do that? If they can earn more profit by forcing you to pay 2L more and get extra things, they would like to do that as long as they can.
Now, if the competition, which is scorpio allowed you airbags in base version by paying 20K more, and that actually hit the bottom line, they would do that.
The companies exist to maximize profit for their shareholders. Contrary to what brochures and "social corporate responsibility" like presentations they show, the only thing that exists for corporations is profit. They will donate to charity only if it creates a goodwill which in turn translates to better sales.

Remember the 1990s. Most cars came without seatbelts. Only when govt made it compulsary, manufacturers started putting in those inertia seat belts.

Its the govt's responsibility, but they time and again get arm twisted by the manufacturers(SIAM).
Even the pollution norms came in when the highest courts stepped in and gave the order.
Before this Maruti was selling Carb engined cars because nobody would pay extra because it was less polluting.

[supersom]

Originally Posted by methecupid

I am so surprised that so little has been said about the safety of this car (or variant)!

At least the Storme has ABS as a standard feature. I don't see too many models around the 10 lakh mark with even that. So, I'd not be so harsh on TML and call the Storme a safer car, based on the standards I see around. The Scorpio definitely comes close with ABS on the SLE, but the Storme is updated and dynamically way better than the Scorpio. Maybe competition is what forced TMLs hand, but the outcome did make the Storme safer.

Personally, as a safety feature, I'd rate ABS as more critical as it helps in collision avoidance. It makes the roads safer for those outside the car. Airbags keep the occupants safe - the same occupants that bought the vehicle, or whom the vehicle was bought for. While buying the car, it's your call whether you want to keep yourself and your passengers safe and can opt for the version with airbags.

That having been said, I totally agree that the regulators should mandate airbags and ABS so that manufacturers are not able to hold such critical safety features to ransom. Until that happens, I don't think we can avoid being fleeced in the name of safety features, for reasons TSK has amply clarified.

[ACM]

Yep totally agree ABS should be compulsory in all cars and front 2 Airbags in all vehicles costing more than say Rs. 6 or 7L exshowroom.

But it is only regulation that will make this happen not self monitoring.

[methecupid]

Originally Posted by ACM

Yep totally agree ABS should be compulsory in all cars and front 2 Airbags in all vehicles costing more than say Rs. 6 or 7L exshowroom.

But it is only regulation that will make this happen not self monitoring.

Seriously a sad state of affairs considering we are one of the largest markets and we have been consistently providing the manufacturers with a large top line.

I am not for specifying a value for essential safety features like airbags and ABS. It should be present in all calls,regardless of it's price point. Case being what if I am driving my new 30l Mercedes in the craziest fashion and ram into a hapless family in a Swift/ i10 or something. We often forget that airbags maybe necessary even if we are not at fault.

Having witnessed a few accidents on Palm Beach Rd. I can safely say that there are many times where the only reason the occupants of a car survived to see another day was because of airbags. Then there are also cases like the 520 which crashed on Mumbai-Pune where the bags didn't deploy.

This "he doesn't, so I wouldn't" philosophy should stop! Can't we start a petition here in Team BHP for this? Left to SIAM and the government, we will be left discussing these on such forums till the cows come back home

[ebonho]

Seeing the clout a huge group like Team BHP would have, I am all for a signature campaign petition.

Admin and management should please look into this. A worthy cause.

[Rocky_Balboa]

I test drove the Storme yesterday and found the following irritating:
(a) Prominent nose-dive on sudden braking even at 10kph
(b) A slight correction @40kph made the vehicle and me nervous
(c) The ride was bumpy and this may be due to the tyre pressure
(d) When releasing the clutch, my size 9 shoe, constantly hit a part of the panel extending from dash (shown in the pic, pic courtesy: our official review).


I loved the vehicle otherwise, but all the above wanna make me stick to the Duster I had booked already.