[condor]

Originally Posted by swiftnfurious

Since there are a bunch of people reporting the issues, lets say the design is NOT the best / optimized. And I re-iterate; when other cars in the 1L-20L can do a better design, Storme should have fit in there as well!
a very simple ergonomic failure; though limited to a set of people with certain physical attributes.

Well, NO CAR in the world will fit every one's requirements. Even your Bentley or which ever car you want take up will have things to complain about. Two people, or a few people finding a problem for themselves is quite a like a few people finding themselves on the winning side of a lottery, (Oh, I'm only refering to the odd's). As such, if you have found a problem, you can leave the car. TML can wash their hands off a one or a few people who dont want their cars. They dont have to be answerable to that minority, just as much as much as any other manufacturer is required to.

Originally Posted by lohithrao

This is news to me, never faced this issue neither in my Safari nor the Storme. btw my shoes size is 10.

[sourabhzen]

Originally Posted by condor

Even your Bentley or which ever car you want take up will have things to complain about.

The importance of these discussions is that people interested in Storme with pay extra attention to such issues during the test drives. They may then decide to consider them as deal breaker or a non deal breaker.

(On a lighter note) Please do not drag Bentley into these discussions. Apart from them being environment unfriendly, they are perfect (untill Bentley produces a next generation variant).

[swiftnfurious]

Originally Posted by condor

...Two people, or a few people finding a problem for themselves is quite a like a few people finding themselves on the winning side of a lottery, (Oh, I'm only refering to the odd's)...

Well, we are talking about products that are supposed to be well engineered!! Not about a gamble or a poker game which are at best left to luck or God's grace to hit the right spot.

If a lot other manufacturers & TATA themselves have managed to make multiple products above & below Storme without having the mentioned issues for the same set of people (or at-least me), then it's a proof that they have screwed up something in the design of the car. No number of excuses hide that fact.

Originally Posted by condor

.... As such, if you have found a problem, you can leave the car...

Ofcourse, TML or "Storme" is NOT a halo brand for me to stick on regardless of such ergonomic disasters.

Originally Posted by condor

TML can wash their hands off a one or a few people who dont want their cars. They dont have to be answerable to that minority, just as much as much as any other manufacturer is required to.

Well put and I agree! But it's also good to remember that the impact of 10 people discarding Alto is NOT the same as 10 people discarding Storme!

I think it's time they pull up their socks and work on such things to gain the customer trust back. They have first of all few customers for this product (because of their atrocious reputation), and developing a cold shoulder to potential customers will only damage their reputation further. Word-of-mouth marketing can make or break enough deals, especially for a brand / product like Storme!

[condor]

Originally Posted by swiftnfurious

Well, we are talking about products that are supposed to be well engineered!!

Oh, please go ahead, Sue TML for what, in your opinion is a design flaw .. I mean, design failure

[swiftnfurious]

Originally Posted by condor

Oh, please go ahead, Sue TML for what, in your opinion is a design flaw .. I mean, design failure

If the consumer forums were really customer centric & quick, I would have.

[freewheelburnin]

I had a short test drive of the Storme and here are things i noticed.
Good bits
1)Found the overall perceived quality leagues ahead of the previous generation including fit and finish,plastics,paint quality etc
2)The engine feels more smoother and NVH levels lower.
3)Gear shifts feel more precise
4)Body roll is significantly reduced.Example if there was a 10 degree roll, here it may be 5 degrees or lesser
5)AC switches have a more upmarket clicky feel to it.
6)Power mirror knob looks and feels better.

Bad bits:
1)Probably the dual mass flywheel is eating into the peppy performance (lacks the certain thrust) that I was used to in my Safari.Something like an elastic effect, though I dunno whether it's the right word to use.
2)The front grill looks like a sewer grill .
3)Front seats under thigh support has suffered.

[Lukeskywalker]

Front seats under thigh support has suffered.

With respect to the above, let me put in my views, even I was very disappointed with the lack of enough thigh support and the "firm" seats in the front, I was so used to my current Safari that I felt there was a flaw in the seating of the Storme, , BUT, when I drove the Storme for slightly over 1500 kms in 2 days, I discovered that the Storme's seat was less of a strain physically than my Safari, the firm seat offers excellent support to our backside and there is no automatic slouching over long drives, and the smaller thigh support actually helped me move my legs more easily and with less effort.
Let us wait for the owners to post their findings over a larger distance than jump at conclusions after taking a Test Drive for a couple of kilometres.

[narayan]

Originally Posted by freewheelburnin

Bad bits:
1)Probably the dual mass flywheel is eating into the peppy performance (lacks the certain thrust) that I was used to in my Safari.Something like an elastic effect, though I dunno whether it's the right word to use.

Storme does NOT have the dual mass flywheel

[freewheelburnin]

Then it's probably a heavier fly wheel(Mentioned high inertia flywheel) which is robbing it off outright peppiness.

Originally Posted by narayan

Storme does NOT have the dual mass flywheel

[tsk1979]

Originally Posted by Lukeskywalker

With respect to the above, let me put in my views, even I was very disappointed with the lack of enough thigh support and the "firm" seats in the front, I was so used to my current Safari that I felt there was a flaw in the seating of the Storme, , BUT, when I drove the Storme for slightly over 1500 kms in 2 days, I discovered that the Storme's seat was less of a strain physically than my Safari, the firm seat offers excellent support to our backside and there is no automatic slouching over long drives, and the smaller thigh support actually helped me move my legs more easily and with less effort.
Let us wait for the owners to post their findings over a larger distance than jump at conclusions after taking a Test Drive for a couple of kilometres.

I hated the storme steering position initially. Whenever I review a vehicle, I take notes. My initial note was.
"Uncomfortable seating, no longer a comfortable long distance cruiser"

However, after 300kms, I realized that the fatigue on my back was actually less, and the vehicle seating was better. Of course under thigh support is lacking, not just in the storme, but also in the old safari.
but eventually, I crossed that out.

Over long distance driving, the storme seats have excellent support. Its just a matter of getting used to the different seating position.

Speaking of clutch pedal shoe issue.
I never faced it, not any other safari owners. Its similar to old safari. However, I have seen that people coming from sedans are facing difficulty.
I wear size 11 shoes, and I use the front part of my foot to press the clutch. If you are suing middle part, I guess there will be issues

Just to check, I tried pressing clutch of the liva with middle of the foot, guess what, my foot got stuck. I guess its just a matter of which part of the foot you use to press the clutch.

The safari clutch is pretty high, so using the front of the foot is actually more convenient, and you do not get issues like the shoe hitting the center console area.

[Fortuner71]

Originally Posted by tsk1979

Over long distance driving, the storme seats have excellent support. Its just a matter of getting used to the different seating position.

Speaking of clutch pedal shoe issue.
I never faced it, not any other safari owners. Its similar to old safari. However, I have seen that people coming from sedans are facing difficulty.
I wear size 11 shoes, and I use the front part of my foot to press the clutch. If you are suing middle part, I guess there will be issues.

The safari clutch is pretty high, so using the front of the foot is actually more convenient, and you do not get issues like the shoe hitting the center console area.

You are absolutely spot on I was a sedan driver for 10 yrs , I use the front portion of my left feet for the clutch , have no issues . Did a 510 km mysore - Pondy trip , comfort cannot get any better .

[Palio_2005]

I agree with tsk. I use the middle of my foot to press the clutch. The Linea clutch is high set as well and it's not comfortable to use the front portion of the foot (for me) which leads to ankle ache. I guess this must have carried over to the Storme. It's just matter of getting used to it I guess. Shouldn't be a deal breaker definitely.

[jkdas]

Originally Posted by tsk1979

I hated the storme steering position initially. Whenever I review a vehicle, I take notes. My initial note was.
"Uncomfortable seating, no longer a comfortable long distance cruiser"

However, after 300kms, I realized that the fatigue on my back was actually less, and the vehicle seating was better. Of course under thigh support is lacking, not just in the storme, but also in the old safari.
but eventually, I crossed that out.

Over long distance driving, the storme seats have excellent support. Its just a matter of getting used to the different seating position.

Speaking of clutch pedal shoe issue.
I never faced it, not any other safari owners. Its similar to old safari. However, I have seen that people coming from sedans are facing difficulty.
I wear size 11 shoes, and I use the front part of my foot to press the clutch. If you are suing middle part, I guess there will be issues

Just to check, I tried pressing clutch of the liva with middle of the foot, guess what, my foot got stuck. I guess its just a matter of which part of the foot you use to press the clutch.

The safari clutch is pretty high, so using the front of the foot is actually more convenient, and you do not get issues like the shoe hitting the center console area.

Was gonna ask the same. Guess people are trying to 'ride' a Safari ( heel and toe gear change ) .


I forgot to add this during my TD. The Safari had come from other part of the city with 4 onboard. 3 of them got off when I took it for a ride with my friends. I found that the cabin was cooler than mine would be on a similar day with just the front unit on on speed 2 ( it was an LX model).

[NST440]

Originally Posted by tsk1979

Over long distance driving, the storme seats have excellent support. Its just a matter of getting used to the different seating position.

Speaking of clutch pedal shoe issue.
I never faced it, not any other safari owners. Its similar to old safari. However, I have seen that people coming from sedans are facing difficulty.

I just came back from a 500 Km. round trip, my observations on the already going on discussions are:

1. My shoe size is 10 , its been a month since i am driving her, never faced a problem regarding wrong clutch ergonomics.

2. I used to drive an innova V and quite frankly it took me sometime to adapt myself to stormes seating as pointed out by tsk, it may take some time but its surely comfortable.

3. The company is surely trying to take care of the stormes customers as i ve visited them twice & quite delightfully i was treated on priority.

4. Issues faced till date:
a) A loose central locking relay switch - fixed in 20 mins.

b) Updation of back door hinges (mine is a 2013 model but still i got it replaced).

[supersom]

Finally, after pushing all the dealers in Bangalore for a 2013 black LX, I have decided to go ahead with a white one. There just isn't going to be a 2013 black available before another 45 days approx, judging by the number of 2012s carried forward.

The white vehicle being as popular as it is, there is one in every dealer's stockyard. I went to inspect a Feb 2013 vehicle yesterday and found that the driver's side door stays ajar (in a locked but not completely flush state) when given a light push. The push is however enough to close the passenger side door. The driver's door also locks fine if given a slightly hard push. Pointed this out to the yard manager; he acknowledged the issue and assured that it is completely fixable. The door seals look intact.

Today, I went to have a look at another one, and found the same problem with the passenger side door. It could be an issue with the lock (seems unlikely), something to do the with metal loop on the body that it locks into, or the door beading being too thick in some cases (most likely). I don't think it's an airlock problem as I reproduced this with one of the rear doors open too.

Looking forward to your views - has anyone seen such a problem with any of the front doors? I will be visiting the yard once again to find out how the issue has been resolved. Maybe it is a common problem fixed by the dealer during PDI; just that I have not heard anyone speak of this.

Originally Posted by tsk1979

Speaking of clutch pedal shoe issue.
I never faced it, not any other safari owners. Its similar to old safari. However, I have seen that people coming from sedans are facing difficulty.
I wear size 11 shoes, and I use the front part of my foot to press the clutch. If you are suing middle part, I guess there will be issues

I faced the same problem with the clutch during TDs - 2 drives of ~60 Kms, but my wife did not. My slippers were getting pinched between the clutch pedal stalk and the edge of the dashboard. I was ascribing it to a size 11 foot. Now I see what the problem is - I was using the middle of my foot, while my wife was using the top of hers. I found the clutch travel a bit much to be doing a heel-toe, but I guess that should be the norm. Might need a bit of conscious correction to get over.