Team-BHP > Shifting gears

View Poll Results: Have you / are you going to install the Aarogya Setu app?
Yes, I already have or I will shortly 293 49.00%
No, I do not plan to 305 51.00%
Voters: 598. You may not vote on this poll

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Old 5th May 2020, 11:59   #61
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Default Re: The Aarogya Setu App : Yes or No?

I have voluntarily installed the app but not sure how useful/ effective it will be for its intended use. I do not see any issue in sharing my location etc. data with the government for this limited amount of time. These are extraordinary circumstances and some extraordinary measures are being taken by all.
Rather than crying data privacy, I tend to look at it as me doing my small bit, while a lot of people are happily risking their life working with patients and general public.
A lot of times we expect a lot and criticize the government, but back off when some sort of responsibility is bestowed upon us apart from paying taxes.
I sure may disagree on a lot of decisions/ methods of the government, but if a democratically elected PM is asking just to install an app to help the country in any way, I don't see an issue doing so. After all we install so many apps all the time being fully aware of the data privacy issues.
Also, we are not sharing anything really personal like PAN, ADHAAR, Passport number, Account details etc, so I do not see any reason not to install the app

Last edited by ishan12 : 5th May 2020 at 12:02.
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Old 5th May 2020, 12:01   #62
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Default Re: The Aarogya Setu App : Yes or No?

I voted yes. Like asking members who are worried about privacy, please list an app starting with their mobile OS that does not collect personal data.

The Arogya Setu app mentions the data is stored on a mobile device. Except in cases where an individual is Covid-19 infection is detected then his data is stored on government servers for 45 days.

What other app lists their use of personal data with such clarity?
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Old 5th May 2020, 12:04   #63
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Default Re: The Aarogya Setu App : Yes or No?

I have not voted till now. If I need to go to office I have to install this app. Until then I will not install.
On the matter of functionality, In addition to all mentioned here, this app will also backtrack person who has come in contact with potential covid patient.
Privacy ? what are we actually losing. Can any members let me know what is that we are losing by installing this app?
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Old 5th May 2020, 12:10   #64
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Default Re: The Aarogya Setu App : Yes or No?

Leave aside not having a compatible phone or being physically unable to use the app, it seems people need to think before stepping out of their house to get milk & supplies if they have a broken phone:
Don’t have Aarogya Setu? You may be booked: Noida police

Originally Posted by amitk26 View Post
1. All the information which app collects is already with operator and thus government while I filled KYC of my SIM card. That is basic T&C of using mobile phone in India except may be from initial days from 1999 to 2002 it has always been like that.
Privacy shouldn't be an all or nothing approach. In some cases its about risk vs reward (e.g. TikTok) but the decision should lie with the user.

Originally Posted by amitk26 View Post
If someone is really worried about privacy he/shes should first turn off "Off Facebook Activity" setting in FB app and preferably stop using FB , Zoom , WhatsApp , Google etc.
So by extension if a person is opting to not use these services and forgoing their advantages, they should have an option not to use this app as well don't they?

Originally Posted by GeeTee TSI View Post
While the app is not perfect, I would like to know what are the alternatives (than doing nothing)
There are less intrusive ways of achieving the contact tracing goals. The Singapore version of the app did it before others so its' not a question of an urgency to get it ready(the technology is already available) and more recently, Apple and Google have joined hands to build a scalable alternative:
Privacy-Preserving Contact Tracing

They have even made some design decisions from the very start to ensure these seemingly "abstract" concepts of privacy/choice are respected but its' up-to the respective authorities of each country on which road to take:
India's Aarogya Setu Will Live On, Despite Apple-Google's GPS Ban On Contact Tracing Apps

Originally Posted by Aqua View Post
Shall unistall it after COVID.
Watch from 1:30.

Use Aarogya Setu for online ticketing in public transport: CRRI guidelines

Covid- 19 latest: Aarogya Setu upgraded for online medical consultation even as data privacy debate rages

There's a big gulf between asking and ordering but it seems we have already made the jump.

Last edited by theMandarin : 5th May 2020 at 12:26. Reason: Typos
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Old 5th May 2020, 12:21   #65
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Default Re: The Aarogya Setu App : Yes or No?

Voted: YES

I had downloaded the App in 2nd week of April thinking I'd be notified of Positive Cases around me which was started "working" to an extent only a week back for me.

In my opinion, the Logic of the App has it's own flaws. Here's my experience:

I had a Positive Case in our area (Mid-April) which was NOT reflecting on the App and that's when I figured the Patient Data is not updated by the Govt. It depends solely on an Individual to Take/Update their Self-Test Status as:
1 - Healthy, No Symptoms
2 - Symptomatic - Test Initiated
3 - Tested Positive

If an individual chooses not to update the App or to leave the mobile at home or turn it off, we'd not be notified of the current status.

So it's an Individual's choice to Install/Update the App with accurate data.

Also for it to work effectively, you need to keep your Bluetooth and Location Enabled at all times (Can't say for sure if it'd still work).

Yet again, 100% effectiveness is something which can't be expected anywhere in the world.

Privacy & Technology are inversely proportionate and that applies in all parts of the world.

Besides, although I'm working from home currently, it seems this App will be required when I rejoin office.
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Old 5th May 2020, 12:38   #66
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Default Re: The Aarogya Setu App : Yes or No?

Voted - No.
This app has not been audited by third party security firms. We have to take Govt's word for its security.
Its privacy policies are a little shady, it says the data is deleted after 30 days from the device but is mum about the data collected and stored on its server.
The Govt says, it will not share the data with any third party but it can share it any govt agency as it sees it fit.
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Old 5th May 2020, 12:46   #67
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Default Re: The Aarogya Setu App : Yes or No?

I am not a stickler for online privacy, so have no qualms in downloading the app because it is mandatory.

However, battery drain may be an issue once I am mobile. At home, extra battery drain is still manageable.

Last edited by Aditya : 5th May 2020 at 23:18. Reason: Typo
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Old 5th May 2020, 13:05   #68
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Default Re: The Aarogya Setu App : Yes or No?

One of the biggest arguments I see popping up in all discussions about privacy and govt apps is this - Facebook and google are collecting your data so why can't you allow the govt to?

This is just like someone saying , hey one of windows is open and my neighbour can see my drawing room and what I see on tv, so let's open all the windows permanently so that the colony security(a good guy) and all the neighbours(nosy and bad at keeping secrets,but isn't a threat to my life) can see into our bedroom and
and know precisely know where I keep all my keys and documents.

One can choose to not use facebook or even google to an extent.(yes I can use a feature phone for critical activities).
But I'm not for any govt. forcing people to use its app (unless it has a clear expiration date and legal bounds limiting its area of operation) especially when it deals with personal information like health.

And one thing, I have observed especially with the Indian govt. Is that whatever is temporary quickly becomes permanent and then mandatory not long after.

Next they add more and more "capabilities" to the "service"which quickly ties in multiple "personal" and "critical" information from different facets of life.

In the current times, DATA and Information is a addictive Drug especially for those in Power and for anyone who wants to make a BIG/IMPORTANT/EXPENSIVE decision. And with more information about what people are doing and power over how they can do it(read mandatory Installation of certain apps), comes more control.

But with all this also comes bad actors who suddenly have a goldmine, of information about a billion people , to dig and sell to the highest bidder or people/countries with malicious intent.

With the way our current government works, with a callous attitude towards people's privacy and our politicians' willingness to put money,power and control over people's personal information and identity, And the very fact that this app was developed within a few days or weeks, with testing probably limited to whether it shares information with the server, I just don't trust the app though I understand the government's current well intentioned attempt.

Precisely speaking, I'd be ok with installing this app for limited period time,(including sharing location) if it has/had a legal framework limiting its capability and what can be done with the information collected.
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Old 5th May 2020, 13:15   #69
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Default Re: The Aarogya Setu App : Yes or No?

I installed in due to company policy. So did my wife who is a teacher and being asked to do so if they want their salaries credited.

Not sure what purpose will it serve as I don't take my mobile out with me always (i follow a switch-off regime to make time for life).
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Old 5th May 2020, 13:55   #70
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Default Re: The Aarogya Setu App : Yes or No?

As soon as the Aarogya Setu app was launched, a friend spoke to me for half an hour about how useful the app is and that our Government is always forward-thinking as far as technology is concerned.

What surprised me is that my friend hadn't installed it back then. And hasn't installed it today as well. So, it got me thinking - if my friend who is so supportive of Governmental measures stays clear of it, then there must be something amiss.

Personally, I am not worried about this app from a data security perspective. My company hasn't stressed on it either. So, I won't install it at the moment. I may install it later if the Government makes it mandatory.
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Old 5th May 2020, 14:02   #71
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Default Re: The Aarogya Setu App : Yes or No?

I voted 'Yes' because I cannot get into Technopark campus, where I work without it. Personally, I would not have opted for it.
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Old 5th May 2020, 14:05   #72
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Default Re: The Aarogya Setu App : Yes or No?

Votes Yes.

If you are ready to update every sneeze, cough and burp in FB while also tagging location; Post selfies of self, friends and their dog on Instagram or for that matter, happily fill out your life information when applying for a FOREN visa (E.g: DS160 for a US), then I don't see any reason for not sharing location and basic health information with a democratically elected government.

Also, the biggest spy currently in the room is Google, Amazon and FB. The amount of personal data they collect is mind-boggling (how else can they provide a service for FREE). If you are an Android user, then you can kiss goodbye to the concept of privacy. And not all of the information being leaked is through consent (lot of services that share your info with google servers needs to be specifically turned off).

However, I agree that apart from marketing carried out to just install the app, the govt. should have clearly educated masses on the tangible benefits (like how we benefit from the Google Maps service). This would increase penetration to a great extent.

Last edited by racer_ash : 5th May 2020 at 14:19.
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Old 5th May 2020, 14:13   #73
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Default Re: The Aarogya Setu App : Yes or No?

Originally Posted by SJQIL87 View Post
I voted 'Yes' because I cannot get into Technopark campus, where I work without it. Personally, I would not have opted for it.
Hi. Have offices and regular office hours resumed in Technopark? I was under the impression that Technopark is still out of bounds during the 3rd lockdown phase and all companies are work from home.
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Old 5th May 2020, 14:17   #74
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Default Re: The Aarogya Setu App : Yes or No?

Looks like they are taking the choice out of our hands.

In the order extending the restrictions under Section 144 of the CrPC till May 17, additional DCP (Law and Order) Ashutosh Dwiwedi said - “If smartphone users don’t have the Aarogya Setu app on their phones, it would amount to lockdown violation. Hence, it will be punishable.”
Looking at how this government functions I am pretty sure they will make it mandatory soon.

'Power corrupts; absolute power corrupts absolutely'

Last edited by JithinR : 5th May 2020 at 14:21.
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Old 5th May 2020, 14:42   #75
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Default Re: The Aarogya Setu App : Yes or No?

Risk stems from unknowingly meeting asymptomatic patients. In a scenario that we go out, we shall hardly meet a known case. So how does this app solve the issue?
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