[msdivy]

Originally Posted by handsofsteel

1. our stars haven’t played domestic matches. (Read up on the ongoing Sheffield shield, every single Aussie star right from the Captain to Smith are playing 4 day matches and preparing themselves for the Border Gavaskar Trophy)

A stat I read on X:
Sachin retired in Nov 2013. His last Ranji match was in Oct 2013.
Kohli's last Ranji was in Nov 2012 and Rohit in Nov 2015.

[antz.bin]

Originally Posted by msdivy

A stat I read on X:
Sachin retired in Nov 2013. His last Ranji match was in Oct 2013.
Kohli's last Ranji was in Nov 2012 and Rohit in Nov 2015.

With this situation ongoing, they have the audacity to penalize Ishan Kishan and Shreyas Iyer for doing exactly the same thing.

While there is chatter on how Ashwin and Jadeja failed to take any wickets, Ashwin And Jadeja did outscore Rohit and Virat in both innings.

There are only so many times the lower order cancelled bail you out. And it seems the normal service in terms of lower order runs. The 5 bowlers (45.4% of the team) contributed 44.6% of the runs off the bat.

[hothatchaway]

Originally Posted by msdivy

A stat I read on X:
Sachin retired in Nov 2013. His last Ranji match was in Oct 2013.
Kohli's last Ranji was in Nov 2012 and Rohit in Nov 2015.

Frankly, the quality of cricket in Ranji is abysmal. There are many run machines there who are nowhere near test class, was always the case but the gulf now is astounding. And with so much meaningless international cricket happening, who will force the superstars to go back to Ranji? A Kohli or a Rohit are like mid cap public limited companies with turnovers running into hundreds of crores. It is a business enterprise pure and simple with BCCI having (successfully) created this. Sachin had raised eyebrows when he hired a CA decades back to manage his earnings. I think that will dwarf in comparison to what is going to today.

Back to Ranji, Sarfraz broke down the door into the Indian team with towering hundreds in domestic cricket. While he just scored a 150 in this test, I think his technique is patchy and lacks a solid defense. He is a bit of a Javed Miandad kind of a batsman - please note that this comparison is purely stylistic, Sarfraz still has to prove he belongs to this level, much less start staking his claim on greatness - who improvises a lot and gets many runs behind the wicketkeeper. Will his game stand up to scrutiny in hostile conditions overseas? I really hope so else we will keep crying about king this and hitman that without any real change happening.

Point is, a Kohli and a Rohit are great batsmen who are just past their prime. Its just the law of nature and that is why pro athletes have a short shelf life. It is when monetary considerations take precedence that some of these funny business start happening.

[NPV]

A fast scoring opening batsman in the Test team who plays freely is always an asset to the team (someone like a Sehwag) and we’ve also tried Prithvi Shaw, Mayank and even Shubman Gill in the last few years. I don’t see why we need Rohit and Yashashwi Jaiswal as openers now. To his credit, Jaiswal has played brilliantly and succeeded in most innings and I see a lot of promise in having him continue. When Rohit retires, we can definitely look at getting someone else in. Similarly, we need to start thinking about the other positions in the next generation Test team pretty soon otherwise we will be caught by surprise when the transition happens (When Kohli, Rohit, Ashwin, Jadeja retire). Ideally, our #3, 4, 5 batsmen would have the ability to mix caution (sadly “solid in defence” is a lost art/skill nowadays) with aggression and I hope we identify those players very soon, undoubtedly we have an abundance of talent, but the super stars are not only playing badly but also holding on to their spots in the team which isn’t good for the future.

[harry10]

I won't blame Gambhir much.
Coach can only do a bit at this level.
He can't teach Kohli and Rohit to Bat to save or win a game. He can't teach Rohit to be not a coward Captain and set attacking fields. What he can do is ask bcci to ask these guys to play domestic or be dropped. That is what he can do cos on merit both these guys don't deserve an India test spot right now.

Sarfraz is new. Deserves a long rope. But he needs to understand match situation. 3 times he has gotten out to a lofted shot on off side when team needed someone to stay in middle order. Something a guy like Dravid and Laxman didn't in their whole career. White ball cricket has messed up these guys. Except for Jaiswal no one is interested in leaving the balls outside off stump.

No one is playing a 200 ball 50 like Pujara to play the time and tire out opposition bowlers. Biggest contribution in both BGT wins were by Pujara who refused to get out and frustrated all Aussies bowlers which made guys like Pant play their attacking game.

They didn't play Axar and played Akashdeep who had zilch role on this pitch. Best player who has bailed out team so many times for last 2 years is sitting on the bench. And he isn't even selected for BGT.

Rohit is a defensive captain. He won ipl cos of the GOAT team MI scouts assembled. His pitch reading and toss calls are abysmal. Plus his batting is on a decline.

Anyways, credit to NZ. Played brilliant cricket after SL debacle. I don't care about the whitewash. Changes should be made. Bumrah should be rested. If pitch assists spin then play 4 spinners + Siraj or Akashdeep. Drop Kohli and play Jurel. Can't drop Rohit cos unfortunately he is the captain.

[PPS]

Originally Posted by hothatchaway

Frankly, the quality of cricket in Ranji is abysmal. who will force the superstars to go back to Ranji?

Forget about quality of Cricket in Ranji Trophy, is there any half decent Off-Spinner/Leg Spinner/Left Arm Spinner in domestic who will trouble the likes of Rohit or Virat if they do end up playing domestic cricket? I highly doubt that! There isn't any decent spinner coming through the ranks so how will you improve your game against the spinners.

Originally Posted by harry10

No one is playing a 200 ball 50 like Pujara to play the time and tire out opposition bowlers. Biggest contribution in both BGT wins were by Pujara who refused to get out and frustrated all Aussies bowlers which made guys like Pant play their attacking game.

Thats's precisely the reason why Pujara was dropped, for consuming too many deliveries & scoring little runs! In January we'll value Pujara's BGT contributions more once Team India receives a royal pasting.

They didn't play Axar and played Akashdeep who had zilch role on this pitch. Best player who has bailed out team so many times for last 2 years is sitting on the bench. And he isn't even selected for BGT.

I have my doubts how effective Axar's bowling will be in Australia considering the fact the fact that only 1 spinner will most likely be picked in the XI. Not that Jadeja will be more effective though. I do feel our batsman anyday prefer true Australian pitches anyday than slow Indian pitches.

[Aster2511]

Pakistan showed guts by dropping their star players. It is time for India to do the same, or we will be singing about past glories for the final match.

[PPS]

Originally Posted by Aster2511

Pakistan showed guts by dropping their star players. It is time for India to do the same, or we will be singing about past glories for the final match.

Knowing how Indian Cricket functions & the Superstar culture in the team, doubt that will happen! We have to be content with watching re-runs of King Kohli from Australia a decade back on Star Sports!

[msdivy]

Originally Posted by hothatchaway

Frankly, the quality of cricket in Ranji is abysmal.

A senior player stepping down to play in lower leagues can benefit both the player and the teams in the lower leagues. For instance, the senior player brings experience, knowledge, and refined skills. A senior player’s presence can boost team morale. Being role models, they can inspire teammates to perform at a higher level. Senior players often take on a mentorship role, guiding younger players in their training, mindset, and even off-field behavior.

It is not all one way. Playing in a lower league can help senior players maintain their fitness levels without the intense physical demands of top-tier competition. They can take time to iron out any bad technique that would have crept into their game. That is how the skills of the domestic cricket teams can develop.

[Rahkehs]

Indian Cricket players have a tendency to drag On till they are booted out. Starting from great Kapil Dev who kept on playing just to break Hadlee’s record to Sachin and most recently Dhoni, everyone keeps on playing way past their expiry date.

Like corporates, there should be appraisals for players too. One cannot be selected in the team for what he/she has done 5 years ago.

[PreludeSH]

Rohit's statements
Once a year your decision doesnt work (deciding to bat on Bengaluru pitch)
Once in 12 years you lose home series

He has once in a while statements for everything from now on. But his and top order batting is not once in a while. Its been continuously bad.

[Asish_VK]

Well deserved loss for India. Congratulations to NZ on winning a series in India. They outplayed us in all the departments.

The irony is our inability to play spin! We used to be a powerhouse when comes to playing spin in subcontinent pitches and we used to win all the matches where the pitch was supporting spin (except very rare matches).

I hope NZ do a clean sweep of 3-0 or 2-0. Hear me out before throwing bricks at me, If India wins the last match and Rohit/Kohli performs well, this series loss and their out of form will be forgotten for good. Let this series be an eye opener and kick start the cleansing of current team, team selection etc.

Originally Posted by PPS

Forget about quality of Cricket in Ranji Trophy, is there any half decent Off-Spinner/Leg Spinner/Left Arm Spinner in domestic who will trouble the likes of Rohit or Virat if they do end up playing domestic cricket? I highly doubt that! There isn't any decent spinner coming through the ranks so how will you improve your game against the spinners.

Given their current form and mind set, I think even Rishabh Pant will trouble both Rohit and Kohli if he decide to bowl spin.

[hothatchaway]

Originally Posted by Asish_VK

I hope NZ do a clean sweep of 3-0 or 2-0. Hear me out before throwing bricks at me, If India wins the last match and Rohit/Kohli performs well, this series loss and their out of form will be forgotten for good. Let this series be an eye opener and kick start the cleansing of current team, team selection etc.

Absolutely! But do you think that even this will force the prima donnas out? With IPL and franchises involved, the brand value of these people will take a hit if they are dropped. Saving face is now more important than taking decisions based on form and performance. That is why, all that they need is an entertaining knock once in a while and they remain in business.

Forget Rohit and Kohli, even a Gill who is a veritable newcomer plays with so much fear of failure that its evident to someone who has spent time playing the sport. Cricket in India has changed for good, performance isn't judged by what you and I believe it to be.

[PreludeSH]

Wish there was some kind of performance linked payment for the players including only top 15 make it to the team

Also, I think the issue is with how Ranji trophy is organized. Is there someone looking at pitch conditions ? Dont think our top order would perform against most of our spinners or pacers given the conditions of pitches we had so far for the 2 tests.

I dont think exonerating Jadeja/Ashwin in bowling because they have batted well is right. They need to perform their primary role. No body will criticize them if they didnt bat well. Bumrah also is no where close to his limited overs capabilities.

Wonder how many of our batsmen have done what Ravindra did by practicing on dust bowl pitches in Chennai in hot/humid conditions before series started.

[PPS]

Originally Posted by Asish_VK

I hope NZ do a clean sweep of 3-0 or 2-0. Hear me out before throwing bricks at me, If India wins the last match and Rohit/Kohli performs well, this series loss and their out of form will be forgotten for good. Let this series be an eye opener and kick start the cleansing of current team, team selection etc

Even if India lose 4-0 to Australia, this cleansing won't happen! Because the next Test Series will be in June 6 months later. There will be other distractions like IPL & Champions Trophy (if it happens) in between. The Selection Committee & Gambhir will have to sit together & figure out this transition phase which should have started a few years ago. Virat is struggling on these surfaces but rest assured he'll come good in Australia though he is nowhere near his peak but on the decline.