[PPS]

Originally Posted by PreludeSH

Started raining in my area. Hope we dont lose the match. Here's the drainage system sucking the water away

If this were Kanpur, we would have lost several days & the Test would have been drawn!

Originally Posted by VWAllstar

KL Rahul is NOT in the list of our TOP batters.

More than KL, I feel Siraj is a major concern with the upcoming Australian tour! He has been very inconsistent & with Shami most likely to miss major part of the tour its a wafer thin bowling lineup. You obviously cannot pick 2 spinners there.

We have dropped Pujara, Rahane, Vihari for KL to earn money and spend it on clubbing! There should not be any preferential treatment,

Pujara even towards the fag end of his career gave confidence that he could bat for long duration, his major problem was his poor Strike Rate & he would eventually get a good ball. Team carried Rahane for too long & he always found ways to get out. We have a domestic run machine like Sarfaraz who's warming the bench most occasions than playing. Hopefully KL will be dropped & made to play Ranji like Shreyas Iyer.

[Oxy]

Let's not forget our insipid bowlers. Nobody other than Bumrah deserves a place in the team.

I mean, Ashwin and Siraj are supposed to be our senior bowlers. They were being hit for sixes for fun by Southee of all people.

Kuldeep and Jadeja were looking like net bowlers on a turning day 5 pitch.

From 230 odd for 7, NZ were allowed to score 402. Largely due to the batting heroics of Southee! This is unacceptable.

[VWAllstar]

Originally Posted by PPS

More than KL, I feel Siraj is a major concern with the upcoming Australian tour! He has been very inconsistent & with Shami most likely to miss major part of the tour its a wafer thin bowling lineup. You obviously cannot pick 2 spinners there.

Just like KL, even Siraj is banking on his once a blue moon glory! They never let a true gem Bhuvi, shine for long. Sometimes the selection is so baffling that corporate politics looks lame in front of them.

[PPS]

Originally Posted by Oxy

Nobody other than Bumrah deserves a place in the team.

Now Bumrah will be forced to play the next 2 Tests in view of this defeat!

I mean, Ashwin and Siraj are supposed to be our senior bowlers. They were being hit for sixes for fun by Southee of all people.Kuldeep and Jadeja were looking like net bowlers on a turning day 5 pitch.From 230 odd for 7, NZ were allowed to score 402. Largely due to the batting heroics of Southee! This is unacceptable.

Pitch had eased out by then but certainly wasn't a 400 pitch! The bowlers & the captain should take the blame. Also, Jadeja & Ashwin who usually bail us out in the lower order didn't fire in this Test!

Originally Posted by VWAllstar

Just like KL, even Siraj is banking on his once a blue moon glory! They never let a true gem Bhuvi, shine for long. Sometimes the selection is so baffling that corporate politics looks lame in front of them.

Bhuvi I believe didn't have the fitness to play Tests on a regular basis. He was a beautiful swing bowler. He bowled a few decent spells last IPL.

[Oxy]

I am now hearing that Washington Sundar has been added to the squad. Considering Axar Patel is already in the squad, this is serious bad news.

They appear to have completely lost the plot. The only reason Washington is in the squad is because they have decided to prepare a rank turner in Pune. This has a serious chance of backfiring as we found out in the Hyderabad test against England last year where Ollie Pope scored a 150 and won it for them. Also Australia has beaten us in Pune with mediocre spinners a couple of years ago.

Our batsmen have forgotten to play spin. Imagine if NZ bring Santner and Williamson back, we'd be doomed on such a pitch.

[am1m]

MVP of the match- Chinnaswamy stadium drainage system and staff! A result and whatever play we got was only possible because of the amazing facilities.

I was pretty much stuck at home on most days last week (barring Sunday) because of the rains. So for the match to have that much playing time and a result was pretty amazing!

Old article from when the system was installed:
https://www.espncricinfo.com/story/c...fields-1080043

Now, if they would only improve the spectator facilities/experience to the same level!

[NPV]

Pujara and Rahane were given an endlessly long rope in the Test team and players like Hanuma Vihari and Karun Nair suffered (they definitely deserved more opportunities in terms of playing a continuous block of matches rather than just the odd one here and there).
I hope Sarfaraz doesn’t meet a similar fate because of Rahul being preferred (unfairly).

[Eddy]

Originally Posted by Oxy

hit for sixes for fun by Southee of all people.

Southee is the most prolific six hitter of this generation.

[Vinod_nair]

KL Rahul is that itch which is becoming quite sore, don't forget the chairman of selection committee is Ajit Agarkar, who was always in the team despite his performance.

Just hope and pray for Sarfaraz his place is not sacrificed for some whim and fancy, let's hope for the best.

[deathwalkr]

Meanwhile NZ women won the T20 WC beating SA.

Good for them

[Asish_VK]

Few Reason I can think of which contributed for India's loss

1. Overconfidence & underestimating opponent - Even with the amount of rain the pitch witnessed during the week, they choose to bat under overcast conditions. Rohit can say he erred reading the pitch, but it was Rohit & Gambir who did multiple inspection (as shown on tv) before matchday itself. It's a clear case of overconfidence as far I am concerned.

2. Team selection - 2 pace bowlers and 3 spinners for a test where it was predicted to be affected by rains is a crime. It was proven by the mediocre performances by Ashwin & Kuldeep to some extend. Less said about Rahul is better. No idea why he is being backed so much when young talents are waiting at the door. He may be a great cricketer, but he is not in form or have any confidence. He has to be asked to play Ranji and get his touch back with immediate effect.

3. Lower order batting - India' bowlers don't contribute well now a days, we are depending heavy on the top order. For some short time period, we have seen good contibution from the tail (Especially Shami, Ishant etc), but it's lacking now. In second innings also, India witnessed a collapse of tail with very minimal runs. Every run counts in matches like this.

4. Inability to wrap the tail - It's always been India's Achilles heel. Even if we run through the top and middle order, 90% of time we give more time and runs to the tail.

5. Captaincy error by Rohit - Apart from the team selection and decision to bat first, I think Rohit lost the plot in first innings, when Southee came into match. For any day I would bring Bumrah in for a fresh lower order batter. Why to wait for new ball when we have the world's best seamer who is equally potent with old ball as well. Instead of seamers, Southee was facing our spinners and hammering them at will.

6. Top order vulnerability to moving ball - I always consider Rohit as a free wicket when ball is swinging around. What worrying is Kohli's lean patch in difficult conditions. Hopefully both of them get into good touch before we travel to Australia.

And few positive takes from this match :

1. Intent shown by team India - Even they were shell shocked by the first innings collapse, our team managed to make a match out of it. When Pant and Sarfraz was batting in full flow, there was ray of hope for winning this match too.

2. Result oriented approach - Tests nowadays are more interesting than ODI's to be frank. With draws being very rare (across all the tests globally), I am enjoying tests more than ODI's nowadays.

3. Pant & Sarfaraz - Cant compliment them enough. The courage and fighting spirit shown by this young guys are commendable. Pant for sure is a different beast when it comes to test match, especially under pressure

4. Bumrah continues to impress every match he plays and every ball he bowls. Fantastic player.

5. NZ team - They are here to give a good fight. Love it when test is played between equally powerful teams.

Anyway, a wake up call for India before Australia tour and WTC finals. I hope instead of going to prepare turning pitches, we continue to make pitches which offers something for everyone for rest of the tournament.

[vamsi.kona]

Originally Posted by Asish_VK

3. Lower order batting - India' bowlers don't contribute well now a days, we are depending heavy on the top order. For some short time period, we have seen good contibution from the tail (Especially Shami, Ishant etc), but it's lacking now. In second innings also, India witnessed a collapse of tail with very minimal runs. Every run counts in matches like this.

.

I don't have much to disagree on your other points, but our lower order has been contributing superbly over the last few years. In fact many a times they have saved the team and put India in a winning position. This video from Jarrod Kimber demonstrates that point.

https://youtu.be/8WuqYhKiGCQ?si=y9EgEOqbgEkZMbk9

[antz.bin]

I was watching the game when NZ were around 10-15 runs in the 2nd innings and I saw that NZ batters were doing something that Indian have completely forgotten. When I saw that happening, I immediately lost all hope of the win and turned off the TV.

NZ batters were leaving the moving ball! Not poking, pushing and slashing at it all the time. That is how they managed to evade the Bumrah threat after losing the first wicket for zero. With just the 2 pacers, they knew all they had to do was see off Bumrah and the rest would be easy. That's exactly what they did!

On a spicy pitch like this, the ability to leave the ball has been the difference between the 2 teams. Had Sarfaraz and Pant left the second 2nd new ball, not being too concerned temporarily about their scoring rate, the result could have been different.

This is where Jaiswal actually does a better job. Since he knows he can catch up any time, he does leave the good balls. Even in the first innings, he was the 2nd highest scorer.

KL Rahul needs to leave the team. He needs to play first class cricket and get his mojo back. Doesn't matter if it is Ranji or County. But he needs to leave. For heaven's sake, his Test match batting average is lower than even Jadeja (who also does other things) ! If he is not even keeping wickets when Pant was out injured, AND batting lower than him in the batting order, what exactly is he doing in the team?

The Grade A/A+ contract multi format batters (Rohit, Virat, KL) in the Indian team have totally forgotten how to score daddy hundreds. All they do is score quick 30s-40s-70s and they are happy with that score. These scores may be enough for T20s and ODIs, they are not sufficient for Test Cricket! I was watching when Sarfaraz got out at 150 and I was actually a bit disappointed that he got out at that time, the double was his for the taking. But someone like a Rohit or Virat don't even look like they will cross 115 after they reach 100.

Rohit last scored a 150+ score in February 2021.
Virat has scored 1 150+ innings in the last 5 years.
KL Rahul last scored a 150+ score in 2016, 2 months after Rahane's last.
Gill has zero 150s till date.

Whereas,
Sarfaraz scored a 150 2 days ago
All 3 of Yashasvi's hundreds are 150+. 2 of them are 200+
Even Mayank Agrawal has 2 150s in the last 5 years and his last match was over 2.5 yrs ago.
Even Jadeja has a 175 now.

Only 3 out of the 10 150+ scores in the past 5 years have been from either Rohit/Virat/Rahul/Rahane/Gill/Pujara, i.e. the most preferred batters in this era.

As the great Sunil Gavaskar (who has 12 150s) famously says, once you are in, you have to make it count! What is it that the newcomers have been doing that Rohit, Virat, KL, Rahane, Gill seemingly just can't?

[Asish_VK]

Originally Posted by vamsi.kona

I don't have much to disagree on your other points, but our lower order has been contributing superbly over the last few years. In fact many a times they have saved the team and put India in a winning position. This video from Jarrod Kimber demonstrates that point.

https://Youtu.be/8WuqYhKiGCQ?si=y9EgEOqbgEkZMbk9

Agreed to your point & Video is great. Thanks

When I said lower order, I meant the real tail, the genuine bowlers. I am considering Ashwin and Jadeja (with 6 and 4 centuries each and ~35 batting average) as proper middle order (in India) / Lower middle order (in overseas) batters/all rounders.

Yes, our tail was doing good for sometime (Shami, Ishanth etc to name a few, scoring quick 20-30 runs or defending 40-50 balls). But lately we are loosing that touch I guess. These tail end contributions matters most when we are operating on a difficult & small leads on tricky surfaces.

Originally Posted by antz.bin

I was watching the game when NZ were around 10-15 runs in the 2nd innings and I saw that NZ batters were doing something that Indian have completely forgotten. When I saw that happening, I immediately lost all hope of the win and turned off the TV.

NZ batters were leaving the moving ball! Not poking, pushing and slashing at it all the time. That is how they managed to evade the Bumrah threat after losing the first wicket for zero. With just the 2 pacers, they knew all they had to do was see off Bumrah and the rest would be easy. That's exactly what they did!

On a spicy pitch like this, the ability to leave the ball has been the difference between the 2 teams. Had Sarfaraz and Pant left the second 2nd new ball, not being too concerned temporarily about their scoring rate, the result could have been different.

[Shumi_21]

Originally Posted by antz.bin

On a spicy pitch like this, the ability to leave the ball has been the difference between the 2 teams.

To be fair, NZ had a lot of luck going their way too. Conway and Young alone played 27 false shots before Conway fell to Bumrah in the second innings. India played 43 false shots in the first innings and lost 10 wickets. India suffering two batting collapses; 46/10 & 54/7 in the same game that was the difference.

Originally Posted by antz.bin

What is it that the newcomers have been doing that Rohit, Virat, KL, Rahane, Gill seemingly just can't?

We have had square turners for a few years that made mediocre spinners like Tom Hartley, Shoaib Bashir, Todd Murphy, Matt Kuhnemann, Ajaz Patel, Steve o Keefe & even Joe Root look like world class bowlers. The pitches changed to be a little batting friendly since the England series last year.

The newcomers have had the benefits of this change. Even Gill for example has scored 50+ in almost every test he's played since the Breaking Bazball series. So has Jaiswal. So has Sarfaraz. Rohit & Kohli will catch up soon. Not so sure about KL though.

So the Pune test begins tomorrow and the absence of rain means the pitch is likely to assist spin more than it did in Bangalore. Gill is set to return and hopefully it's not at Sarfaraz's expense.

It's a headache really. Sarf XL is great against spin and has the game to play a long innings too. We need him as Kohli is a walking wicket nowadays on even slightly turning pitches. On the other hand we have KL whose timid mentality is inversely proportional to the batting talent he has. Sarfaraz inspiring very little confidence against pace bowling means KL will be needed in the BGT next month. Do we dent an already insipid KL's confidence or rob Sarfaraz of his very, very well deserved place in the XI?

My solution? Drop Kohli to dent his ego and unleash him against the Australians