ARTICLE: Synthetic oil vs Mineral oil

[R2D2]

Originally Posted by Leoshashi

What was the cost per litre??

Shashi, the oil costs Rs 1900/L. Pretty steep (Aarsons, the seller is known for higher prices but genuine stuff) but then this is one oil I wouldn't have to change again even if I retained this car for another decade. So decided to go for it. Mobil 1 tranny oil was available (import) but was marked for limited slip differentials.

I haven't used the LM transmission oil, but have used their additive along with Shell Spirax 75W90, and the result was awesome.

It is your feedback on Liqui Moly products that got me considering their products seriously. Sadly the recommended Shell Spirax GB oil for my car (Spirax S6 AXRME 75W-90) was not available. Hence decided on LM. This synth lube has boosted hopes of smoother shifts.

Maybe you could try a synthetic lube the next time you change your car's GB oil.

[Leoshashi]

Originally Posted by R2D2

Shashi, the oil costs Rs 1900/L. Pretty steep (Aarsons, the seller is known for higher prices but genuine stuff)

IIRC, the MRP of the oil was around Rs. 1900/L.

I have contact details of Liqui Moly distributor(representative of Anand group), and now I prefer to source stuff directly from them. Do let me know if you need their contact.

Maybe you could try a synthetic lube the next time you change your car's GB oil.

Would love to, but according to a discussion here, I shouldn't be using GL5 transmission oil, since MSIL recommends 75W90 GL4 for my car.

Regards,
Shashi

[R2D2]

Originally Posted by Leoshashi

IIRC, the MRP of the oil was around Rs. 1900/L. I have contact details of Liqui Moly distributor(representative of Anand group), and now I prefer to source stuff directly from them. Do let me know if you need their contact.

Thanks! Very kind of you. I'll certainly let you know if I am planning to buy more LM stuff.

Would love to, but according to a discussion I shouldn't be using GL5 transmission oil, since MSIL recommends 75W90 GL4 for my car.

This is the oil LM Synthetic GB Lube It is GL4 and GL5 rated. So should suit GG as well.

[black12rr]

Originally Posted by Wheel Spin

The Honda Oil that I use in my city is SM 0W30.

Hello Wheel Spin, can you post a full picture of oil can , which brand is it . Details please.

[gpa]

Originally Posted by sumeethaldankar

Hi buddy, been a long time quoting you :-). How is the performance of the new oil ?

Yup, it has been a long time mate. I'll post a detailed update on the Brio & Alto shortly. To answer your query - since the shift to this oil and the gearbox additive, the gears slot in even more smoothly. The smoothness is especially evident when cold. Just got back to Bangalore after a round trip of ~1,700 kms and the difference is great.

[vsrivatsa]

I was trying to understand as to what is a good time to move to synthetic oil based on the first page of this thread and the date seems 10+ years old. So, I wanted to validate if the recommendation made on the first page still holds true

I am referring to the below recommendation:

No synthetics during the running-in period: Wear and tear is actually good for a new engine. Synthetic oil, with its superior lubricating properties, hinders the running-in process and is best used only after 10,000 – 15,000 km.

Is this still a good rule to follow? Or has this changed now and we can use synthetic oil even in new cars?

[sgiitk]

Originally Posted by vsrivatsa

I was trying to understand as to what is a good time to move to synthetic oil based on the first page of this thread and the date seems 10+ years old. So, I wanted to validate if the recommendation made on the first page still holds true

I am referring to the below recommendation:
...

Is this still a good rule to follow? Or has this changed now and we can use synthetic oil even in new cars?

I guess it may have. Since the original fill on my Civic was Synth. I remember the ASS questioning when the oil change was delayed as per company reco. We had gone to Gwalior and both the SA and SM had to be informed, since they both queried - why no lube replacement.

I do not think my Brio came with synth as original fill.

When I questioned a knowledgable friend in the UK, he said modern engines have come a long way.

[Vikram Arya]

Originally Posted by vsrivatsa

I was trying to understand as to what is a good time to move to synthetic oil based on the first page of this thread and the date seems 10+ years old. So, I wanted to validate if the recommendation made on the first page still holds true

I am referring to the below recommendation:



Is this still a good rule to follow? Or has this changed now and we can use synthetic oil even in new cars?

Metallurgy has come a long way in last 20 years.

A large number of cars nowadays come factory filled with either a semi synthetic or fully synthetic engine oils (this is true for most of the Japanese and almost all of the German vehicles, even GM has transitioned to DEXOS which is a synthetic blend ).

I’m not sure about India but out here all the Hondas (I presume you’re driving one) come factory filled with a 0W-20 oil which has to be either a full or a partial synthetic oil (irrespective of whatever the service advisor may tell you, a 0W-20 cannot be blended using mineral base stocks).

As a matter of practice, I have been purging the oil within the first five hundred kilometers (for the cars bought in India) and replacing it with Synthetic engine oil (that includes a 2001 Honda City, a 2004 Wagon R & a 2016 Maruti Gypsy King).

[R2D2]

Originally Posted by vsrivatsa

Is this still a good rule to follow? Or has this changed now and we can use synthetic oil even in new cars?

As Vikram Arya said things have changed in the past 1-2 decades. Many modern engines use synthetic straight from the factory.

My 10G Corolla Altis came with factory filled 15W-40 mineral oil, it was treated to 5W-40 synthetic when the mileage was <5K kms (oil change for new Toyotas is at 10K kms) and it has had zero detrimental effect.

In my humble opinion, good lubrication is even more critical when the engine is new and being run in. And synthetic oil has way better performance. You will notice the difference immediately.

If your new car came with mineral oil (this is unlikely, factory fill is probably already synthetic or semi synthetic) you can change to synthetic after running it on mineral oil for a few thousand kms.

[Wheel Spin]

Originally Posted by black12rr

Hello Wheel Spin, can you post a full picture of oil can , which brand is it . Details please.

It is Honda VTECLEV branded fully synthetic oil of SM 0W30 grade manufactured by Idemitsu Lube India Pvt. Ltd. available with Honda service centers.

[amalji]

An excellent video from "Engineering Explained" explaining why synthetic oil is much better than a conventional mineral oil -

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tYkg0oDUXs8

Some of the important points that are covered.

• The basics on how to read the oil specs.
• The fundamental theoretical reason why synthetic oil is better
• The real life experiment which shows the effect of viscosity on both these oils when it ages.

The take away is that the synthetic oil and mineral oil might behave very similarly when they are new. But, with age, their behavior becomes very different and synthetics have a huge advantage over the mineral oil here.

PS: I have first tasted the quality of a fully synthetic oil 7.5 years back on my Esteem with Mobil 1. Ever since, I have always used synthetic oil on my vehicles. The only difference now is that I use Toyota Synthetic oil on my Etios. I can vouch for what he says in that video. The engine feels almost the same before and after an engine oil change when you use fully synthetic oil.

[Rama Naveen]

Hi Guys,
Just curious to know.
When switching from mineral to ful synthetic oil , is it a simple drain old oil and pour the new one in or does engine needs engine flush treatment definitely and then add full synthetic oil.
My car has clocked 26000 with mineral stuff.
Can one drive car for 15000 with full synthetic once switched?

[amalji]

Originally Posted by Rama Naveen

Hi Guys,
Just curious to know.
When switching from mineral to ful synthetic oil , is it a simple drain old oil and pour the new one in or does engine needs engine flush treatment definitely and then add full synthetic oil.
My car has clocked 26000 with mineral stuff.

It doesn't need any flush. In fact, flush can cause harm for some very old engines as well. Just drain your old oil and pour the synthetic oil.
I would recommend that you try out the Mobil 1.

Originally Posted by Rama Naveen

Can one drive car for 15000 with full synthetic once switched?

Replace your oil once every year. You can theoretically use it for 15,000 kms if it is within that one year. But, replace it every 10000 kms or 1 year ( whichever comes first ) to be on the safer side.

[R2D2]

Originally Posted by Rama Naveen

Just curious to know. When switching from mineral to ful synthetic oil, is it a simple drain old oil and pour the new one in or does engine needs engine flush treatment definitely and then add full synthetic oil. My car has clocked 26000 with mineral stuff. Can one drive car for 15000 with full synthetic once switched?

Firstly, flushes are only for those high mileage engines that have suffered infrequent or irregular oil changes and where large quantities of sludge is suspected to have formed. DO NOT use a flush (that's pure bunkum promoted by some mechanics and garages to sell the stuff) UNLESS your vehicle falls into this high sludge category. Just take drain the old oil, replace the filter and pour the correct quantity of synthetic into the engine. That's it. No fuss at all.

For drain intervals follow your manufacturer's guidelines that specify time and mileage. If it says 10K kms and 1 year then you change it at 10K kms OR 1 year, whichever is earlier. You could extend the drain by 1 or 2K kms or a month or two as an exception, not the rule. So, please don't try to offset the additional cost of synthetic by extending the drain interval to 15 or, horror of horrors, 25K kms. Engine oil sellers will say anything to sell their stocks. Remember, they have nothing to lose. If you plan to do this then synthetic oil is not for you. Just stick to recommended mineral oil which is perfectly good enough.

The sole exception is if you buy extended drain synthetic oil which AFAIK is not available in this country.

In a nutshell - don't use a flush unless absolutely necessary & stick to manufacturers drain interval guidelines.

[Leoshashi]

Originally Posted by R2D2

The sole exception is if you buy extended drain synthetic oil which AFAIK is not available in this country.
.

Thanks for the valuable insight.

One doubt: The Liqui Moly engine oil which I have in my 800, is certified as BMW and Mercedes Long Life oil. Does it come under extended drain category??

I have run 10,885 kms on that oil to be precise, but it still hasn't lost its color, texture or smoothness. I am changing it soon just because it has run 10k kms and you had recommended to follow manufacturer's drain interval, irrespective of the type of oil. So, should I change immediately or should I extend it till 15k kms, given that they are certified as Long Life oil for cars like BMW. Using such an oil in a Japanese car like 800, is like subjecting the oil to a relaxing government job.

Regards,
Shashi