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Old 14th January 2022, 20:50   #556
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Default Re: Force Gurkha Review

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Originally Posted by Manuuj View Post

My FE remains a cause for concern. Have not crossed 9 kmpl within the city so far.
Your honest observations and ownership experience are great source of info for current/future Gurkha owners, Manuuj. Kudos!

As far as the fuel efficiency is concerned, I do believe it's a trade-off for the wheel upsizing that you have done. Speaking with personal experience as I did an upsize (tyre width by 10 mm) on my Tata Tigor within the allowed 2% difference, but found that the mileage dropped by 1.5 -2 Kmpl within city driving.
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Old 15th January 2022, 01:35   #557
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Default Re: Force Gurkha Review

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Originally Posted by mav3r1ckblu3 View Post
As far as the fuel efficiency is concerned, I do believe it's a trade-off for the wheel upsizing that you have done. Speaking with personal experience as I did an upsize (tyre width by 10 mm) on my Tata Tigor within the allowed 2% difference, but found that the mileage dropped by 1.5 -2 Kmpl within city driving.
What was the MID reading of FE in the TD car? Did you notice?

Single digit FE figures would give us a heart attack, specially to the present MSIL car owners. I am used to a 700 km+ drive for a tankful (37~38 litre).
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Old 15th January 2022, 08:09   #558
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@RijuC most small cars (upto 1.5 liter diesels & 1.2 petrols) would run 600-700 kms those days. My Aspire diesel is running almost 800 kms on 36 liters for Faridabad-Noida route. The i20 petrol was running 17 kmpl on lockdown days with AC. Santro was returning similar numbers & 22 kmpkg on CNG.

However, big car has it's tradeoffs. The brawn means the aerodynamic are tossed out of pictures, weight & wider/ bigger tyres another detriment. In fact, the moment you upsize by one size your overall fuel economy goes down by 1 kmpl imo.

Just wondering, pencil thin tyres is the reason why most Japanese cars are more efficient over counterparts....
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Old 15th January 2022, 09:43   #559
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Default Re: Force Gurkha Review

@Manuuj, The fuel efficiency figure is very good for a vehicle of this size.
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Old 15th January 2022, 11:00   #560
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Originally Posted by Manuuj View Post

Many of the first batches of Gurkhas have had some gear oil leak issue. : A change has now been made to the inner design of the breather box that is situated high in the engine bay on the firewall. This change should prevent the problem from reoccurring.

Some even had Oil leakage from the differentials seals.

The second issue i faced was steering fluid leakage.

The TPMS sensors not working are a recurring issue with most Gurkhas i know of.

My FE remains a cause for concern. Have not crossed 9 kmpl within the city so far.

So far the issues we have faced are not very serious but still it made me pull out of the Gurkha Spiti Drive currently underway, since i want to test the vehicle for a few thousand kilometers before undertaking any extensive trips in it.

I guess not everyone can be a Toyota.

Very sad to hear this bro, I also did contact FM to understand more on the gear oil leakage issue, they did share with me that this seems to be coming in from the design change. After the fix on your vehicle are you still facing any leakage? But I totally agree, it certainly dampens the ownership experience and should have been identified during testing and not passed the quality check.

That TPMS sensor is an irritant for sure, it did not work well during our test drives and was one of the items on the feedback which we had shared, I would have hoped this to be rectified.

We get a consistent 10kmpl, I was more inclined to think that the BS6 was more tuned for efficiency.

Regarding the issues reported on the YouTube channel, there is a planned investigation & analysis scheduled on Sunday at the dealership. I sincerely hope all the issues get rectified and immediate corrective actions are taken by the company to reach out to all current BS6 owners on a proactive basis to fix them without waiting for a complain to come through.
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Old 15th January 2022, 11:42   #561
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Default Re: Force Gurkha Review

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Originally Posted by CARDEEP View Post
However, big car has it's tradeoffs. The brawn means the aerodynamic are tossed out of pictures, weight & wider/ bigger tyres another detriment. In fact, the moment you upsize by one size your overall fuel economy goes down by 1 kmpl imo.
Yes, absolutely. The Gurkha is never meant to be a high FE vehicle. The engine and it's performance characteristics, transmission type and ratios, vehicle aerodynamic profile, tyre type and size, Vehicle weight and dimensions are entirely different than a tiny hatchback. Hence Gurkha FE cannot be at all comparable to those of Jap OEM cars. Gurkha is performance oriented car in most challenging terrains and situations whereas the MSIL cars are FE oriented It would be kind of apple to pineapple comparison and hence not correct.

FE figure of 10-12 in City+Highway mix would probably be the expected real life scenario. And nobody thinks about FE when it is in 4x4 mode, it is not meant to be either.

I just mentioned it because the FE figure comparison popped up in my mind as an average guy. Then I explained to myself it has a Jerry can arrangement already. One person undertaking the route where fuel stations/ fuel source won't be available for 300-600 km must carry the extra fuel reserve in those extreme terrains, irrespective of whatever car he is driving.

I wanted to know whether anybody noticed the FE figure appearing on MID of the test drive car. It could be an indicative worst FE figure in city+ highway+bad urban road/ village road conditions.
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Old 15th January 2022, 17:32   #562
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Originally Posted by procrj View Post
IMO looks like the owner has landed himself a lemon. What surprises me is his decision to take delivery even after he has observed rusting on various parts and oil leakage at multiple points. I am even more surprised that he decided to risk a multi state journey across india with his family. Hope Force motors can fix many if not most of these issues.
I just got my access to Team BHP, so could not clear this or respond to this before.
Yes, there was rusting observed before, and I accepted delivery only when I took it in writing on email those parts will be replaced with new ones. I can share the screenshot of the email if required for reference.
And regarding oil leakage, I was not aware of this problem then and felt it normal for a new vehicle. But only when I am facing this issue now each day, and lock back at old delivery video noticed it.
I am not into automobiles deeply. I generally trust the manufacturer and the dealer to have their PDI done. But yet, when the dealer said multiple times it is not needed, I did check from my perspective before delivery and pointed out issues I noticed.

And regarding the inter-state trip, for your awareness, I did take the vehicle to the workshop before it, got it checked throuroughly by the technical from both dealer and force motors. Only when I assured of its fine and can go for 8000+kms I went on a trip. Only during the trip I got into multiple issues and kept reporting them. I was ready to return back anytime if I was asked by their technical team after hearing my symptoms.

Hope this clears the things. Do let me know for anything specific.


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Originally Posted by Kosfactor View Post
That is a budding Youtuber trying to get maximum attention to his channel through prospective Gurkha customers. Nevertheless it does not matter if the vehicle is fixed or not, as far there is enough content for new videos, this is likely to continue.
Please note, I was the one who share the complete video of release-ready Force Gurkha 10-11 months before it was actually released. I am sure you or everyone agree, no one waits for 10+ months after being the first to spot the vehicle and continuously follows up for Force Sales Team for 2 months to get a Test Drive. Takes multiple test drives, gets all the assurances, and spends 17L (including bank loan) and another 2L for internal/external modifications for just some views. We have life much larger than Youtube views.

Even before getting social, we have been following up via official channels multiple times, and only when there is no responsibility taken to own the issues, made it social. But we still trust them to fix them, and ultimately they have to.

Hi, there was a little delay to have our account active.
We are the ones who recently made our problems social for New force Gurkha only after touching all official channels multiple times and going to the workshop for the inspection. The intention was good, though sometimes it depends on how we take it.

Have another re-investigation tomorrow, and would definitely share the outcome. Thanks.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Trojan View Post
Regarding the issues reported on the YouTube channel, there is a planned investigation & analysis scheduled on Sunday at the dealership. I sincerely hope all the issues get rectified and immediate corrective actions are taken by the company to reach out to all current BS6 owners on a proactive basis to fix them without waiting for a complain to come through.
Please note the investigation was already done on Tuesday and almost all the issues mentioned in the list are observed and confirmed. And we are going again tomorrow for re-investigation. And we continuously do follow-up for investigation summary or update from Tuesday with no luck, and hope someone takes responsibility tomorrow and gives a clear response to fix them if it can be or share it with the customer honestly the action plan.

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Old 15th January 2022, 20:03   #563
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Default Re: Force Gurkha Review

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Originally Posted by Aditya View Post
Vivek Malik drops in a query via this Team-BHP share page.
The query-
Quote:
Hi Team-BHP,

Hope all is going well with you.

I just bought the new Gurkha, after selling my 2007 Pajero due to the completion of its road life in NCR.

I took the Pajero to my village many times and did proper sand dune safaris very comfortably. With the same enthusiasm, I took the Gurkha on the same terrain expecting better results and fun, but it disappointed me. It couldn't climb any of the dunes that the Pajero did comfortably. I tried it in both low ratio and high ratio options.

Also the ground clearance between the front tyres is damn less. Not feeling as confident as I did with with Pajero. Either I am not used to it, or it's underpowered, or I am not using the 4x4 controls properly.

Kindly suggest.

Regards,

Vivek Malik
Actually the information provided by the owner is very limited. He has mentioned that, he tried in both 4H and 4L, but he has not mentioned about the gears in which he tried both the cars.

I have never drive a Gurkha nor a Pajero. So I was just comparing the specs of both the cars. From my limited knowledge, what I made out is Pajero has a taller gear than the Gurkha, plus the peak torque and peak Bhp in Pajero comes at a higher RPM compared to the Gurkha.

Am not sure, whether the owner has tried this or not. The dune which he climbed in a particular gear in the Gurkha, he can try it with an upper gear.
For example what the Pajero used to do in 2nd or 3rd, in the same scenario he can try the Gurkha in 3rd or 4th gear in 4L. I prefer 3rd in 4L than 1st in 4H. The mechanical diff locks wont help him much on the loose sand, but it may help him to come out if stuck. Things will depend more on the right gear, right momentum and lowered tyre pressure.

Last edited by Samba : 15th January 2022 at 20:25.
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Old 15th January 2022, 20:11   #564
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Default Re: Force Gurkha Review

Hello Folks,

Yesterday, I got a chance to test drive the new Force Gurkha. I must appreciate Force Motors for bringing this vehicle to my place for test drive even though their showroom is ~27 kms away from my home. They called me one day prior to check my availability and arrived right on time the next day. Full marks to Force Motors here. I drove this car for almost 20 mins and for ~10 kms. Below are my observations

Size- This car is simply HUMONGOUS. This car is an absolute looker. Other vehicles on the road give you way when they see Force Gurkha coming!! I experienced this firsthand during my test drive yesterday.

Engine- The engine is quite refined. The engine noise is also well contained. You will feel a slight jerk after cranking the engine, but after that apart from that mild diesel grunt, you will not feel any vibrations. Low end torque is nice, and you donít have to frequently change gears in city traffic. On the highway, you can easily cruise between 90-100 kmph.

Steering- This was a big disappointment for me. There was a noticeable kickback from the steering when the car went through any rough patch on the road. I asked the company executive, if this was a glitch with the vehicle in general or there was some issue with this particular vehicle; but he said that there was no issue with this test vehicle as such. If this is the case, then I personally feel that Force Motors should really address this issue on priority.

Gearbox- I found this to be a bit notchy and was having difficulty in slotting the 3rd gear. But I assume this was an issue with that test drive vehicle. Also, I felt that the gear shifter was bit short, and I had to stretch my self for changing gears.

Seating- You really sit quite high in this vehicle - the sitting position is definitely very commanding! There were hardly any blind spots. However, Force Motors should have given height adjusted driver seat in this car. As this functionality was not there, the steering was rubbing against my thighs even after adjusting it to its maximum limit. Due to this issue, I had to push my seat backward which again created a problem while changing gears as mentioned above.

Suspension- I really liked the suspension set up of this car- very comfortable and much better than the rivals.

Space- This car is huge and very spacious. It can easily accommodate 4 passengers along with their luggage. Also, rear passengers can easily get in and out from the rear door.

Infotainment system- Nothing specific to mention here. It does its jobs well. But sound quality is strictly average.

I also observed one weird thing. This vehicle has four reverse parking sensors, but surprisingly there is no visual display available in this car to see the distance between the vehicle and the rear object. It only beeps while reversing the car - this was a real let down. Force Motors should have ideally provided a visual display for the reverse parking sensors, which would have aided the driver while reversing this giant vehicle.

Conclusion - This is really a nice vehicle and a leap beyond its predecessor - Force Motors is not leaving any stone unturned in giving a pleasant driving experience to their customers. I will give them full marks for this. However, few things like height adjusted driver seat, steering kickback, notchy gears, visual display for reverse parking, etc., should be addressed by Force Motors. Also, they should quickly come up with a 5 door version with TC gear box. If they do so, we could see a steep rise in the number of Gurkha vehicles on the road in the future.
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Old 16th January 2022, 11:42   #565
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Default Re: Force Gurkha Review

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Originally Posted by Cool-Shine View Post
Steering- This was a big disappointment for me. There was a noticeable kickback from the steering when the car went through any rough patch on the road. I asked the company executive, if this was a glitch with the vehicle in general or there was some issue with this particular vehicle; but he said that there was no issue with this test vehicle as such. If this is the case, then I personally feel that Force Motors should really address this issue on priority.
Not a glitch as such. It is the expected behaviour due to the alloy wheels of that particular offset. In stock steel wheels it will be a bit less however when you are driving on rough terrain, you keep a loose grip over the steering wheel.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Samba View Post
I have never drive a Gurkha nor a Pajero. So I was just comparing the specs of both the cars. From my limited knowledge, what I made out is Pajero has a taller gear than the Gurkha, plus the peak torque and peak Bhp in Pajero comes at a higher RPM compared to the Gurkha.
In most off-road conditions you pick up one gear and you stick with it, so a relatively light body , proper gearing and an engine that can hold the revvs would help.
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Old 16th January 2022, 12:01   #566
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@Manuuj, The fuel efficiency figure is very good for a vehicle of this size.
My 3 liter Fortuner returned 11 kmpl in city and 13 to 14 was usual for highways. My 3.2 liter Endeavour returns similar figures. Except on the highway it returns around 12 to 13 kmpl. FM claims 10 to 12 kmpl but i haven't seen those kind of figures in 1800 kms of use. Have spoken to many 2021 Gurkha owners and they have a similar story.
We have all been told that the FE will improve after 1st Service. I don't quite understand the logic behind that but will wait and see.



Quote:
Originally Posted by Trojan View Post
Very sad to hear After the fix on your vehicle are you still facing any leakage? But I totally agree, it certainly dampens the ownership experience and should have been identified during testing and not passed the quality check.....That TPMS sensor is an irritant for sure, it did not work.....We get a consistent 10kmpl, I was more inclined to think that the BS6 was more tuned for efficiency.
Yes bro i too feel that extensive testing should have highlighted these issues.
As far as TPMS goes it is absolutely worthless. I have TPMS on my Endeavour as well. Works perfect from day one and incredibly accurate. I honestly do not know of even ONE Gurkha owner whose TPMS is working correctly.

I would have been happy with 10 kmpl in the city and 12 on the highway. My drive from Mandi to Delhi had me driving downhill from for 30% of my journey and the FE was 9.8 kmpl then. Post that its never crossed 9 kmpl. I am actually being a bit generous when i said its average is 9 kmpl.

Will be checking this today as well when i do a refill.

My concern is that FM worked so hard on this product, invested so much in it and yet launched without proper testing? The same issues are coming up in many early models.
I am in touch with owners from Pune, Chennai, Bangalore, Jodhpur and Delhi. All have had these same issues within a month of ownership.

Should all this not have been diagnosed and rectified during the testing process?
The company is ofcourse being very helpful and provides assistance very quickly. Infact changes have been already affected in the later 2021 models to prevent these issues from cropping up.

So far i haven't noticed the gear oil seal leak reoccurring. Hope it stays that way.
The Gurkha is a really great vehicle but is being let down by these niggles. I guess in time all these will get rectified or we will just learn to live with them.

Last edited by Manuuj : 16th January 2022 at 12:02.
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Old 16th January 2022, 13:14   #567
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My 3 liter Fortuner returned 11 kmpl in city and 13 to 14 was usual for highways. .
It should be around 10 to 11 for a Gurkha on stock tires within city limits , fortuner especially that model was a bit lighter.
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Old 16th January 2022, 14:46   #568
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Just came across this video and like a couple of others have pointed out, looks like this is a R&D disaster.

Take a look at the video, it's a lengthy one but summarized in the last 5 minutes as well.

The company has replaced his vehicle, but sadly the second vehicle is also a problematic one. He also accuses the company of manipulating things and lying, not sure how far this will go. Hope they are able to sort this out soon.

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Old 16th January 2022, 16:49   #569
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I went to the showroom today for another re-investigation for our New Force Gurkha.

There are multiple senior folks (hope they may not like mentioning names in public forum) in the showroom and also some technical people to check the defects along with them.

They changed the process drastically. They want to discuss everything under closed doors now and would not check any issues before customer. (I can understand this). There were also posters put out for the same everywhere today. But I still believe they can only improve when they actually understand the problems reported by customer, and it can only happen when customer explains and shows them the problems. And cannot be fixed based on assumptions.

Had a meaningful very long discussion with their senior folks and they assured of knowing the issues root causes and guaranteed to fix them all.

I have given them all the trust and any amount of time they need.

One long discussion we had was on the topic of warranty. Force Gurkha advertises it as 1.5Lakh kms or 3 years warranty. But you would be surprised if you actually get into all details. They are sub categories in the warranty and almost all the issues or most of the issues I reported comes under 6 months warranty.

So I asked for a assurance they take the responsibility if they reoccur again and do not pass on the costs on to me if they reoccur after 6 months due to manufacturing defects.

I would share once I get my vehicle back and drive it thoroughly.
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Old 16th January 2022, 19:27   #570
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Originally Posted by thepilgrim1424 View Post
Just came across this video and like a couple of others have pointed out, looks like this is a R&D disaster.

Take a look at the video, it's a lengthy one but summarized in the last 5 minutes as well.

The company has replaced his vehicle, but sadly the second vehicle is also a problematic one. He also accuses the company of manipulating things and lying, not sure how far this will go. Hope they are able to sort this out soon.

https://Youtu.be/J59wmSGa71s


- Went through the video, he mentions about bolts for the alloy being different from the "stock" steel ones, please correct me if I'm wrong, but did he mean that the bolts from regular steel wheels were used in alloy which shouldn't be used which would cause the alloys to break? I didn't get that part clearly, kindly someone educate me on that.
- Also, I've observed from many users and can conclude that the vehicle wheel balancing isn't done at factory. OR its that the driving from the factory to the showroom isn't right and something is happening somewhere. such instances are making me think twice before picking up the vehicle.
I can't imagine running a vehicle with unbalanced wheels and out of alignment for over 1000 KMS at highway speeds, its surely something frightening for me about the longevity of the vehicle if treated such way for the first 1000 odd KMs.
- It would be great if someone can actually put up the detailed "warranty" list. The video states that the 1.5L or 3Y warranty isn't for end to end vehicle, I can understand 11 months or 1Y warranty for electricals but different warranty period (6 months?!) for different parts hidden is something I believe isn't acceptable. I've read that previously in Mohammed's gurkha ownership review here and actually went and checked at showroom and the sales guy told me that there's nothing like that and its all covered now.

My dad was right about not being a guinea pig. Didn't think that would be the case. FM took more time than M&M to launch and these issues would've been identified in their "extensive testing" and I believed them. As a vehicle, its a great one. also happy to hear from users that FM is cooperating with customers, one odd lemon is understandable, but a pattern isn't acceptable. Will wait and watch. Kudos to the first owners for helping with our purchase decision.

Honestly, when my dad picked up his Santro 20 years ago, the vehicle never ever gave any issue whatsoever for the 20 years and is still going strong after 20 years. "touchwood". OR even my first bike, the KTM RC 200, we were one of the first buyers then, but seeing the trend of the initial buyers being "guinea pigs" is becoming a trend these days. Rushed launches, inadequate testing etc, that too in this day and age where its much more easy for owners to share the issues with a vehicle, which WILL impact the sales,I think Ill wait till the dust is settled. Guess we got lucky back then.
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