[vishnurp99]

I lived in the US(Manhattan) for around 4 years as a bachelor and then returned to India for better long term career prospects and higher studies.

In my experience, most of the well paying jobs are provided by companies which are headquartered outside and/or serve clients from other geographies. This automatically means the following if you are working in India.

1. Greater Distance from key people/clients/decision makers who run the business. You miss out on all the key decision making things just because you are not co-located with key leaders/clients. it's difficult to signal how hungry and eager you are for success when you are a few thousand kms away in a different time zone.

2. Living conditions (Living expenses, traffic, general hygiene, education expenses) suck in Bangalore and Chennai unless you are filthy rich and can throw money to make these problems go away. I have studied and lived in these places for fairly long durations. I hear that these cities are relatively better off than a Mumbai or Delhi. I can only imagine how bad the situation in Delhi or Mumbai would be. In comparison Tier 2 cities like Trivandrum, Kochi or Hyderabad provide much better facilities. I have lived at these places too for significant durations.

3. There are huge barriers to entry if you are a person trying to make inroads into a traditional business. Trust, Family baggage, Muscle power, connections are all key to succeed here.

4. Lastly the tax system is extremely unfriendly to highly paid salaried professionals. If you are an enterpreneur or a consultant, there are millions of avenues to save tax legally but nothing for the salaried.

5. In India if you have to make money, you have to be a business owner. There are only very few people who will be able to take the plunge to start a new business.

So why am i still in India? I strongly believe that India is a huge market and I will be able to piggy back on the opportunities that will arise here. I aim to be a job provider rather than a job seeker in the medium term. I also hope that the metros will become livable over the longer term but that's just a hope.

[sairamboko]

So i am now seriously considering moving to Canada and going to start my process. However I still have some questions:

1. I am planning to for my family of 3 - myself, wife and kid. Does my Wife also needs to take IELTS?

2. Documentation - Do we need to get letters from HR or any other people from my past jobs for documentation? I am still not clear about this part.

3. Express Entry via Provincial nomination - how to go about this? I am in IT right now and from what I have checked, Toronto ( Ontario province ) seems to be my best bet for getting jobs.

4. Funds - What are some acceptable ways to show proof of funds?

5. IELTS preparation - I am going to give the IELTS next month. Any suggestions for books or resources that will help me in acing the IELTS?

6. Any other general pointers or resources.

7. Is this entire process so tricky that I need to take help of consultancies or agents?

Thanks in advance!

[pulsar56]

Originally Posted by sairamboko

However I still have some questions:

1. I am planning to for my family of 3 - myself, wife and kid. Does my Wife also needs to take IELTS?
IELTS for your spouse will add additional points to your CRS Score which helps in getting an invitation to apply. You can check your current CRS based on your inputs on the CIC website.

2. Documentation - Do we need to get letters from HR or any other people from my past jobs for documentation? I am still not clear about this part.
Yes. You need to get the letters from HR. In case you are not able to get the letters in the required format, you can get them from ex-managers and get them notarized.


4. Funds - What are some acceptable ways to show proof of funds?
Link


6. Any other general pointers or resources.

1. Getting all the required documents for employment will take some time and I suggest you to start contacting your ex-employers. It took me almost 4 months to get the referral letters from my ex-employers

1. Get your education certificates validated (ECA) by WES or similar organization. The transcripts/certificate copy has to be sent to WES directly by the university.

7. Is this entire process so tricky that I need to take help of consultancies or agents?
No. As long as you can follow the instructions in the CIC website and get all the documents as required, you don't really need an agent.

Thanks in advance!

I have added some inputs in the quote above.
PS: I currently have ITA for PR from both Australia and Canada.

[C300]

Originally Posted by HKap

A piece of advice to people looking for "quick money" in the western world. It's a myth. No such thing exists. India is awesome for a career and to make money. You start at a very low salary and it can be tough for those initial years.

+1. Cost of living in some of the Aus cities is very high. Its a tough ride in Sydney for low income families.

We lived in Aus for 10 yrs and returned back in 2015. It was a conscious decision and working well for the family.

Aus cities offer excellent quality of life in terms of Education, Healthcare, Public Infra, Safety. My advise to those planning to migrate - its a great place to live but make sure you do thorough research on your income/costs etc.

[vb-saan]

Originally Posted by selfdrive

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Edit: At the current stage of my career, the money part is not that much higher in some other countries than what I get here. It is higher, but not high enough to completely base a move around that. It only makes sense if added topics like long term benefits/ infrastructure come into play. In short, it is not lucrative enough to move only for the money. Especially considering the possible growth opportunities here.

Originally Posted by V.Narayan

Dear Folks, label this the rant of a soon to be old man but permit me to voice it. This thread has a lot of very useful information on migrating to western countries. It is a mine of data and perspectives for folks who are inclined to migrate for a short while or permanently. The sheer volume of posts is an indication of how important it is to some.
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Originally Posted by Samurai

You could as well ask the clouds to stop moving.
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Originally Posted by V.Narayan

The negative attitude varies. If you migrate to California or Sydney or Boston you live in a very cosmopolitan and liberal world where your skin colour matters less and those worlds can be very enjoyable. Just like South Bombay or Lutyens Delhi is different from say Bilaspur (no disrespect to folks from there) same way the west too is not monolithic. But yes if you migrate to Leeds or Minnesota then the environment will need a lot more adjusting.
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Great points there! Thank you for sharing

In my opinion, moving or rather migrating abroad for financial reasons alone is a thing of the past. I have been living in SE Asia for the past 16-17 years, and for me it’s more of a lifestyle choice than financial. Being outside India for almost half of my life, my preferences for a place/city is more by the connect I feel with that place, and whether that place meet my criteria for comfortable living. Within India or outside India, my advice will be to choose a place which offers you the lifestyle you want, and day-to-day life doesn’t feel like a compromise. I chose Singapore as my base because of the convenience the place, safety, living standards, and more importantly proximity to home. It takes 10-15 mins to airport, and Kochi airport is just 4 hours away.

For me, migrating to an unknown brand new place is like a gamble. I personally won't do that. My sister and family moved to Sydney after going through the PR process¸ and they recently got converted as AU citizens. When my BIL mentioned about the citizenship, I could feel from his voice that he is just going with the flow rather than a decision from the heart.

[V.Narayan]

This thread is too interesting to resist and poke into again.

A lot of us educated upper middle class+ Indians grumble and complain about our system, our lack of amenities, bad behavior etc. All of these are true. We complain about, "the authorities should do this or that". And of course use one horrific example to paint a country with a population greater than North and South America put together; paint with a single brush a country recognized by the UN and WHO as having greater ethnic-religious-racial-linguistic diversity than any other country and any other continent apart from Asia and Africa.

How many of us drawing room critics have written to the PM on the email link provided for any citizen to write up on any subject. So long as you are writing half sense you will usually get a reply in a few days. How many of us write to the local MP of our constituency or the local IPS officer or IAS officer and then see what happens or does not happen. I can bet my last rupee less than 1% of the members of this forum would have done any one of these. We are a nation of grumblers. How many of us actively lead local efforts or projects to improve our environment - the record here may be somewhat better.

A country as complex to govern as India which has emerged 3 generations ago from 150 years of violent economic exploitation will quite naturally not be as well organized or posses the municipal support systems as the West. Bad fortune if we got born into the India of 1975 and not the India of 2095.

Migrate if that is your choice - just be gracious and recognize that this country gave you the market value, the education, the reputation for values & work ethics because of which the West to find you an attractive asset. Do immigrants from India ever say thanks to their ex-country for giving them the wherewithal to have taken off? Being from India gave them an advantage versus a hundred other nationalities. Please don't rationalize it by saying India sucks. 1.3 billion may disagree despite the crowded roads and creaky municipal services and poor government offices.

I have seen this country change painfully in the 49 years I've been reading newspapers. The change sometimes lurches two steps forward and one and a half back, then looses its way and then stumbles ahead again. And this will continue for hopefully another 3 generations. The hope for India are not just our educated upper classes. More than that it is the class aspiring to join the lower middle class. They work hardest to pick themselves up.

[ritz3645]

Originally Posted by V.Narayan

T.

As always, person having first hand experience can guide the best, or like the father, but son will have own mind. I do not disagree on immigration for the members here as their language skills or English will sail them through. I also do not want to get into the citizenship thing, as we cannot change ourselves or our biological features, which stand out before us uttering even a word. So citizenship is just a passport otherwise irreverent. The crux of the matter is gelling or acclimatising in the system to become one. And it takes hell lot of time and experience to reach that stage.

I have had heated discussions on this very thread before.
Once I told that a handyman can earn more in developed world that a white collar job holder, on this thread.

[redcruiser]

My Friend in US drives Camaro ZL1. He earns over 100k$, therefore, he was able to afford it. Not many people in India can afford to drive a car of one's dream that too within 30yrs of age.
Sometimes I feel why not to give a try to go abroad for 3 to 5 years time.
But then I have not given a serious thought about going abroad.

[revhappy]

I am living in Singapore for the past 8.5 years. It has been extremely fruitful financially. The only drawback has been, we had to do without a car all these years as it is very expensive. We stay in a rented house, developed by the housing board, which feels cheap, although we pay significant amount in rent. Our daughter didn't start primary yet, so it was cheap. Next year she will start primary school and foreigners don't get local school admission (it is like a lottery) so we will have to send her to an Indian school, it will cost us quite a bit. Other than that Singapore has been awesome. My networth would have never reached this level even after 10 more years in India.

[selfdrive]

Originally Posted by V.Narayan

Migrate if that is your choice - just be gracious and recognize that this country gave you the market value, the education, the reputation for values & work ethics because of which the West to find you an attractive asset. Do immigrants from India ever say thanks to their ex-country for giving them the wherewithal to have taken off? Being from India gave them an advantage versus a hundred other nationalities. Please don't rationalize it by saying India sucks. 1.3 billion may disagree despite the crowded roads and creaky municipal services and poor government offices.

While I don't dispute your statement that people should be grateful to their roots, we also need to look inward why we have an ongoing talent drain (as opposed to brain drain; everybody has a brain though only some use it). Also, what is anyone going to do with their thanks? It is not as if it can be converted to something substantial. In any case there is a huge amount of remittances that helps us in one way or the other. And as for cribbing about India, many people living here do that too.

If we are nurturing this talent, we should also allow enough opportunities for this talent to repay this land; not another. A lot of people move out for the infrastructure or standard of living; some others move out for better prospects/ more money. But a common thread that exists in the talent drain is the lack of meritocracy and lack of accountability. I would not judge anyone; as their reasons would matter most to them and they take a decision for their own good and their own future.

I read recently that 1.6% of people paid income tax in India last year. And then we expect this 1.6% to also improve the country? I do see a lot of communication by electoral candidates with the general populace; why can't they take some responsibilities? It is not as if freeloaders don't exist in other countries. For example, people living off social security is snowballing further in the UK. But the sheer numbers that we have here overpower everything else. And if we continue with lack of meritocracy, the less deserving candidates continue to move into posts that require great vision and better decision making. Of which they would have neither talent nor experience. Then the downward spiral is not far away.

[Samurai]

Has anyone here taken up this offer?

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/wo...-a8066846.html

[joe1980]

Originally Posted by Samurai

Has anyone here taken up this offer?

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/wo...-a8066846.html

Sounds like an offer attached with a lot of strings! I doubt if there will be any takers for this.

[Dry Ice]

Originally Posted by V.Narayan

A lot of us educated upper middle class+ Indians grumble and complain about our system, our lack of amenities, bad behavior etc. All of these are true. We complain about, "the authorities should do this or that".

Dear Sir, if you have followed this wonderful forum over the years, you would know, how many threads are there about getting things done the right way. Getting road tax refunds after rigorous follow ups, writing to civic authorities to patch up roads, litigation against NHAI/contractor to fix the design flaws of a highway, writing to I&B ministry to get a simple phone connection ported, writing to local Police/Municipality to stop a daily circus of marriage parties in ones locality, fighting a case in the courts and getting the state govt. orders reversed or deemed illegal, being nice to accident victims and then being framed as the perpetrator, working with the bureaucracy to promote tourism in far flung areas - I can go on, the list is endless - all from just this one forum of 1.2 lakh members.

Most of these things are done by the same 2% population which happily contributes more than half their earnings in taxes (direct/indirect combined). Pardon my language, but if, for every damn thing you need to write to your local MLA, or need to file an RTI is it really worth the hassle? If as a nation, you feel more proud about a religious building coming up than a hospital or school being built in your locality, are we really progressing? Doesn't it throw light on our skewed thinking? When someone stands up against the system, how many come forward to help him? A lone biker against a Thar gets bashed up while people simply move past, clicking photos. A kid gets bashed up just because he wrote something on the internet about someone else's property. That's not something writing to your MLA can fix.

Whoever cribs, has his/her reasons. They are free to voice it, just as we are free to disagree with them, right? Why do we need so much of this censorship? We can't be imposing our thoughts on someone else, nor is it the right thing to ask people to shut up if they immigrate.

Peace!

[jacobvarughese]

Appreciate it if someone could shed insights into how to convert my Indian DL palatable to Canadian driving authorities- Hear a DL extract or particulars are needed for this.

[Turbanator]

how to convert my Indian DL palatable to Canadian driving authorities-

Will depend on the place where you plan to take a Test. If you are holding Indian DL for a while, you can appear for an Advanced driving test in some provinces like Ontario but you will get only one chance. If you pass, you will get a regular G else you will have to first get a learners license G1 and then G2 and finally, G. Written test is mandatory and they will retain/destroy your Indian license. You get 60 days or so to drive on the Indian license, use this time to get acquainted with rules and it will be a good idea to take some classes. This is from my memory and things may be different now, best will to visit Registry who handles these tests.

https://drivetest.ca/licences/licences-overview.html