[condor]

Another one :

http://www.indiancarsbikes.in/road-t...review-118774/

Summary:
1. The AMT helps to improve the car's practicality for city use. It has not transformed the car itself.

2. The key / major / important point will remain the pricing. If TML thinks & hence just adds the differential 40k or so to the price of the Twist, then this version will meet the same fate as previous iterations.

TML, the ball is in your court. You would have already decided on the pricing. All that's probably left is for us to hear it. Hopefully, the market will approve .. but I'm not taking any bets yet. :-)

[deltheking]

Thanks for the link to the review. Well, it's a disappointment I must say. Noisy engine + poor performance on even a mild slope are deal killers for me. Don't think the K10 does this bad on slopes and also K10 brakes are supposed to be much better.

The status quo continues I guess. The nano will still be an afterthought in this segment. Looks like the K10 amt will be a roaring success .

[Hrishi_111]

Originally Posted by deltheking

Well, the interior looks outdated and cheap compared to the K10. Plus, tata reliability is still shoddy and unknown.

Pictures doesn't speak thousand words always, many a times they do hide millions of them. The interiors could be even worse than they look in pictures or could be much better as well. We shall wait until an official T-BHP review tells us about it or someone amongst us get a chance to feel them.

Many of us are waiting for this car as a 'secondary' car at household which would replace the non-geared scooters used by elderly and better half's, and at the same time we expect it to be maintenance friendly along with hassle free service.

The recent product launches from TML has raised the bar in terms of overall quality (anyone here who have used Indica V1 ?) and we expect nano AMT to live to those expectations, period.

[condor]

Let's wait and see. Best to do our own checks.

The AMT is taking over the gear change mechanism. It is not replacing the manual gear box inside with an Auto gear box. Hence we will still notice a couple of seconds where the gear change happens.

REgarding the noise, I thought the noise even in a Twist was well controlled. I compare that with a pre-Twist version.

Let the TD's begin. I know of one place in BLR where I can check this out well. Will update once I do that.

Let's not forget that the Alto AMT is running on a 1 litre engine. That's 1.5 times the engine displacement of the Nano's.

The two cars are going to be in two different categories, and are not competing against each other: the Alto K10 will be considered for a small car. The Nano for a second car in the house.

[graaja]

Originally Posted by condor

The two cars are going to be in two different categories, and are not competing against each other: the Alto K10 will be considered for a small car. The Nano for a second car in the house.

I am considering Nano GenX as a 2nd car. This will replace the Hero Honda Pleasure in the household and will be mainly used to run short errands like bringing grocery, dropping kids in school etc.

I have paid 5K and have booked the Nano GenX. I also had a couple of test drives with the Nano Twist. The space management is extremely good. At 5'11" I thought the driving position would be too cramped. But I was surprised with the leg room for the driver and passenger, and also the leg room on the rear bench.

The biggest let down for me were the brakes. I felt the brakes were very hard and I had to lean my weight on the brakes to get any braking. Is braking a known weakness of the Nano?

Though I was fine with the NVH levels (for the price point, it definitely is good), my wife was not happy with the engine noise in the cabin. In fact, the first question she asked me was if the Nano had a diesel engine.

I am also planning to do a test drive of the K10 AMT. Will make the final decision once I get to test drive the Nano AMT and also the price difference between the two.

[condor]

graaja : I also had a couple of test drives with the Nano Twist.

The biggest let down for me were the brakes. I felt the brakes were very hard

.. my wife was not happy with the engine noise in the cabin.

Regarding all the 3 points, some extent of these could be due to the car being a TD car. I suggest you take a drive of the new one as soon as it comes in to get a better idea. I would also suggest that you hold off the TD of the Alto for the moment, but do a back-to-back TD's to get a better comparative view of the two cars.

We too are looking for a second car, and hoping the pricing will be right. Agree with you on the space management. The NVH was fine in the Nano Twist we tested at the dealership.

[GrammarNazi]

... The engine runs out of breath even when subjected to a mild slope.

IMHO This part of the 'India CarsBikes' review is grossly misleading.

Originally Posted by deltheking

Thanks for the link to the review. Well, it's a disappointment I must say. Noisy engine + poor performance on even a mild slope are deal killers for me. Don't think the K10 does this bad on slopes...

When driving to Yercaud, my '10 Nano (with 4 healthy adult occupants + light luggage) drove up the hill without me having to shift to 1st gear even once. This was when I was, comparatively, an amateur at driving.

Engine noise is very well controlled from what I noticed after driving the Nano Twist. With the reduced engine note, I guess I barely noticed the sound.

Also what helped could include :
1) The regular traffic around me was not really silent.

2) In open city stretches, the mid-range seems rather well tuned for low engine noise (while they've retained the peppy-ness).

3) In the highways, (btw even my old Nano isn't exactly a slow-poke), the sound somehow barely seemed to be existent, it could be due to the Nano being rear engined.

(maybe our Team-BHP reviewers could use the Bosch Decibel app this time to compare it to the other cars at varied speeds in varied traffic conditions)

I'm not trying to convince you/anyone. But the truth, it seems to me, is VERY different from what you've been informed about the Nano.

..and also K10 brakes are supposed to be much better.

You're quite surely under-estimating the drum brakes (with brake boosters). Anyway, most people IMO could easily get used to it within 15-20kms / 1-2days of driving the Nano. This could be subjective though.

The status quo continues I guess. The nano will still be an afterthought in this segment. Looks like the K10 amt will be a roaring success.

No offence, but going from post #224, #226, #240 & the above post, the tenor of your comments seem rather dismissive & almost condescending.

Although I'm more passionate about travelling than about cars, I respect them for what they are and I guess all members here share such a sentiment.

So, as such I don't see any great harm if you instead considered keeping yourself well informed rather than uncaringly making insensitive statements based on unfounded facts collected from 'not-as-credible' websites/forums.

[deepakv]

Originally Posted by graaja

...
I am also planning to do a test drive of the K10 AMT. Will make the final decision once I get to test drive the Nano AMT and also the price difference between the two.

Do let us know your comparitive thoughts!

[deltheking]

Originally Posted by GrammarNazi

IMHO This part of the 'India CarsBikes' review is grossly misleading.

No offence, but going from post #224, #226, #240 & the above post, the tenor of your comments seem rather dismissive & almost condescending.

Although I'm more passionate about travelling than about cars, I respect them for what they are and I guess all members here share such a sentiment.

So, as such I don't see any great harm if you instead considered keeping yourself well informed rather than uncaringly making insensitive statements based on unfounded facts collected from 'not-as-credible' websites/forums.

Hi Grammar,

I take no offense whatsoever to your comments. Infact, I appreciate it. Because as you said, my opinions are based on what I read on the reviews here and the links that are provided here. I have no real world experience on driving the Nano.

The tenor of my posts was based on the reviews provided here. Infact, I am asking these questions because I am planning to buy an AMT this June/July when I visit India. Am used to automatics here in the US & haven't driven a manual in 20 years or so. So, I was debating between the K10 AMT & Nano AMT.

As I said - it was a big deal for me when the review said that the Nano struggles even on mild slopes. I did not see that comment on K10. So, if it is true - then the Nano would practically be of no use even within the city. I can only go by the reviews listed here.

If the Nano AMT is good - I would have no hesitation in buying it. Another factor would be tata service. Also, as I mentioned - Nano interiors look cheap & outdated - I would certainly expect it because it is almost close to Rs.1lakh cheaper than K10. So, they have to cut costs somewhere.

You said your Nano was fine on slopes - I dont know if the struggle on slopes as the review mentions is specific for the AMT version or even the manual version. Hope this clears everything up ! I am still on the fence between Nano AMT & K10 AMT ! And it seems tata service centers have to improve a lot compared to Maruti. Hope Tata improves this aspect.

I am all for competition among car makers - as this will not make them stagnant , force them to improvise and for us as buyers its a win win situation. You certainly want competition - or else you will go bankrupt - just ask the Detroit automakers GM & Chrysler !!

[condor]

deltheking : As I said - it was a big deal for me when the review said that the Nano struggles even on mild slopes. I did not see that comment on K10.

Also, as I mentioned - Nano interiors look cheap & outdated -

I believe that a person should be happy with his purchase. Looking at your comments earlier, I feel you may not be happy with the Nano. And suggest you drop this car from your shortlist. The K10 definitely has better specs like a bigger engine, a bigger boot etc. One should be a happy owner and not a disgruntled one .. purchase is a one-time activity, but ownership will go on for some time. And the unhappiness will be there even beyond that ownership period.

[gauravdgr8]

Originally Posted by deltheking

Well, the interior looks outdated and cheap compared to the K10. Plus, tata reliability is still shoddy and unknown. Don't know if this will make a dent in K10 sales. The Nano has to be a much better product at a lower price to even compete.

The interiors of the K10 do look better, but the car itself is no better than a tin box. Recently test drove the K10 AMT and Twist back to back. The build quality of Nano is way better than the K10.

What makes you say that Tata reliability is shoddy and unknown. Many of Zest/Bolts/Manza's/Vista's are running problem free. It's just a perception and we indians love to live with one formed years and years ago. Indica is history. Let's forget it. Tata is the most VFM car that you can buy today.

[deltheking]

Originally Posted by gauravdgr8

The interiors of the K10 do look better, but the car itself is no better than a tin box. Recently test drove the K10 AMT and Twist back to back. The build quality of Nano is way better than the K10.

What makes you say that Tata reliability is shoddy and unknown. Many of Zest/Bolts/Manza's/Vista's are running problem free. It's just a perception and we indians love to live with one formed years and years ago. Indica is history. Let's forget it. Tata is the most VFM car that you can buy today.

Thanks. This is what I need. Real world info. As I have always mentioned- my perception is from the media & online info - and my perception may not be the reality. Thats why I want unbiased views from actual owners.

I am surprised when you say the nano build quality is better than the K10. You are probably the first one on this forum to say that. If it is , then absolutely it is the most VFM car. Problem with Tatas - is the universally acknowledged poor after sales and service network - and not the reliability per se as it is too early to tell for both cars.

A few more test drive reviews on the Nano AMT would be good and informative !

Originally Posted by condor

I believe that a person should be happy with his purchase. Looking at your comments earlier, I feel you may not be happy with the Nano. And suggest you drop this car from your shortlist. The K10 definitely has better specs like a bigger engine, a bigger boot etc. One should be a happy owner and not a disgruntled one .. purchase is a one-time activity, but ownership will go on for some time. And the unhappiness will be there even beyond that ownership period.

I am not biased or anything like that. Just want a proper discussion on the pros and cons of the Nano AMT. After all, that's what the forum is all about. The common man unlike us auto enthusiasts - i can assure you - would have absolutely no idea about the specs and info on these AMT cars. Infact, so many people still think that AMT's are less fuel efficient and are very costly and expensive to repair !


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[saket77]

Originally Posted by gauravdgr8

The interiors of the K10 do look better, but the car itself is no better than a tin box. Recently test drove the K10 AMT and Twist back to back. The build quality of Nano is way better than the K10.

What makes you say that Tata reliability is shoddy and unknown. Many of Zest/Bolts/Manza's/Vista's are running problem free. It's just a perception and we indians love to live with one formed years and years ago. Indica is history. Let's forget it. Tata is the most VFM car that you can buy today.

Dear Gaurav,

The Alto is surely a tin-box and Maruti has earned that title quite rightfully when I look into their cars particularly post 2005-06. However, the official TBHP review of the 2012 Nano, which we can rely & appreciate as the most trusted and unbiased one does states that 'the metal feels flimsy enough for you to bend with your hands' and 'the car struggles on steep slopes'. The build quality is not something to speak about as well. Hence, lets not go overboard in appreciating the car. The strengths of the car lie somewhere else like ease of parking & driving, smaller footprint, spacious for passengers, erect seating, etc.

Link: http://www.team-bhp.com/forum/offici...ve-review.html

Also, would like to share my views about the VFM aspect of Tata cars. The only car I see as VFM from Tata stable at the moment is the Zest. Good interiors, nice engine & build quality at par with competition. The Bolt seems to be overpriced (if not overpriced; definitely not a VFM product either) and for 3 lacs on road, I do not find the Nano cheap as well, esp with a 2 cylinder engine and some unconventional aspects of the car and a non-existent boot. Certainly not VFM in my view.

Regards,
Saket

[sachinayak]

Perceptions are hard to change. If you want to be really convinced if you should buy a Nano or not, drive it yourself. If you want to be convinced if the Tata Service is up to the mark, speak to existing owners. Online reviews will help but ownership logs are best.

There are 2 Nano Owners in my team and both swear by it and are already considering the AMT upgrade. Speaks a lot about "Tata's Service". It may vary from place to place, hence best try speaking to guys in your neighborhood. Both owners are amazed with the post-service follow up by Tata to ensure service satisfaction.

Further, Nano comes with a 4 year warranty against a 2 year warranty on the Alto K10 (you can of course buy extended warranty). Tata also offers AMC which will even cover consumables. Warranty plus AMC should ensure peaceful ownership.

I know people who would never want to even consider the Nano and who have changed their perception after a single drive. Speaks a lot about a highly-underrated car, IMHO.

Originally Posted by saket77

The Bolt seems to be overpriced (if not overpriced; definitely not a VFM product either)

The Bolt seems overpriced relative to the Zest, but consider Bolt as a product by itself in the category it is sold vis-a-vis its competition. Compare it on what it offers at the price and it is not too bad. Just that Zest was priced at incredibly moutwatering prices, that the Bolt pricing didnt make sense anymore.

[condor]

deltheking : The common man unlike us auto enthusiasts - i can assure you - would have absolutely no idea about the specs and info on these AMT cars.

True that ! NOt just AMT cars - but even cars itself. The common man will likely compare entry level models of Tata (Nano), Maruti (Alto 800) or Alto K10, with Hyundai's Eon, or Ford Figo, or ..
All are respective entry level models. Difference in specs not make a difference to him - 625cc vs 800 cc vs 1 litre vs 800 cc vs 1.2 litre ..