[PratikPatel]

Originally Posted by audioholic

Thanks for the number crunching guys. The only positive aspect of the hybrid is that you feel mentally better with the higher FE, and also might get some brownie points in case NGT or some authority decides to clamp down on ICE cars in the future. The rest, ie wrt economics, performance etc there is not much to gain here.

Even from a FE perspective while it looks good for a petrol engine, with all this sophistication it just about beats a equivalent Diesel engine. The 1000 kms per fuel up is nothing extraordinary for regular diesel car owners. The place where it may make a difference will be in city stop & go traffic. But here too in cities like Mumbai where traffic practically craws during rush hour how much difference it can make remains to be seen.

[StarrySky]

Originally Posted by Flying Shadow

In Kerala an amendment was done on December 2021 on Road Tax rules, ascertaining the fact that Full hybrids does come under tax relaxation.

There was an announcement made last year in January that 50% tax rebate will be provided to full-hybrids for a period of 5 years. Is this what you are referring to? Or does this mean that full-hybrids will be taxed at 5% like EVs? However, I cannot find any reference to hybrids in the tax schedule provided at Kerala MVD website.

[pratikonomics]

Originally Posted by M00M

Assuming that the eHEV variant costs 22 lacs on road. Would that be value for money or appropriate or loose its value ? I personally think it should be not more than 19-20 on road considering that the City ZX CVT is 17.5 on road. Hope they dont price it excessively higher and negate the hard work theyve done, I would like to see Honda succeed in India and bring back the CRV, Accord and introduce the HRV in India.

If you go by the pricing strategy of recents Honda two wheelers, this will be more like 22L ex-showroom.

[volkman10]

Here are the prices expected for Hybrids:

These hybrids may come at a premium of 15-20% over conventional petrol cars, but may also deliver 35-40% higher fuel efficiency.

Link (Hybrids - A transition phase to EVs in India)

[rapid_fire]

This car would have made a lot more sense if it was offered with an optional higher capacity battery (say 7-10 Kwh for additional 1-1.5 lakhs) and plug-in option. Can be driven as pure EV for city commute (40-60km) as well as a high efficiency hybrid in high way trips.

[84.monsoon]

Had been researching a bit on the "paddle shifters" on the City e-HEV. Normally in sporty cars, the most common purpose of the paddle shifters is to drop a gear quickly and achieve faster and more direct acceleration in a situation where one needs to speed the car up. Thus, in these caes, gaining speed quickly is the main purpose, and the variable that is being maximized is speed.

On the other hand, with the City e-HEV, the variable of interest is fuel economy. The paddle shifters are there, to give fuel economy enthusiasts, an additional kick of getting another kpl or two from that litre of petrol. The variable that is being maximized is therefore fuel economy. The paddle shifters are used to control how quickly you slow down, and not how quickly you speed up.

So if you are driving down the road and see the lights turn red at an intersection 100 m away, you would normally take your foot off the gas and start to apply the brake. The more you allow the car to coast and delay the braking, the less the potential to save the kinetic energy and route it to charge the battery. In such a situation, with the eHEV, you tug the - paddle towards you and the car increases the level of regeneration, slowing down the car quickly without applying the brake, and charging the battery aggressively while doing so. Now after you regain speed, you see a toll booth far ahead, say, 500 m away. Now if the car were to slow down aggressively it would be detrimental to fuel economy, as you would have to again step on the accelerator to speed up the car if it slows down too soon. In this case, you would tug the + paddle towards you and the car reduces the aggressiveness of the deceleration and regeneration, allowing the battery to be gently charged as the car slows down gracefully towards to tollbooth, making sure that manual braking as well as additional acceleration, which both waste energy, are minimised.

So a whole new set of auto enthusiasts, the fuel economy enthusiasts, will get the kick and level of control with the eHEV paddle shifters that we speed enthusiasts get with the ones on our BMWs and Audis.

There is also a drive mode down in the gearshift column that is below D, that is called B. This one permanently increases the level of regeneration, thereby reducing the need to use the manual brakes. So in any situation, as soon as the driver's foot is off the accelerator, more aggressive regeneration kicks in, which could make the car feel a bit more sporty, as it slows down rapidly and picks up speed presumably a bit quicker, as the batteries are likely to be at a higher stare of charge due to constant strong recharge cycles.

[macbeth]

Originally Posted by 84.monsoon

This is to delay starting the gasoline engine for as long as possible. By going easy on the launch, it may be possible to stretch the pure electric mode by a couple of kilometres more.

I wonder how will it perform in the hills - will it struggle considering at low speeds power delivery is unlike that of an EV and neither that of a petrol

[attrip2008]

Originally Posted by 84.monsoon

So a whole new set of auto enthusiasts, the fuel economy enthusiasts, will get the kick and level of control with the eHEV paddle shifters that we speed enthusiasts get with the ones on our BMWs and Audis.

That’s quite well put. I have wondering the use case for these pedals. I can see myself using it often.

However, I feel enthusiasts would look for an overall engagement with the car. While I would like to play that ‘improve the fuel economy’ game, I will also want to dart at that empty corner in traffic or zip out of crossing on green signal. Question is- can city provide that overall engagement? I certainly hope so.

I also wonder- is the B mode the one for bumper to bumper traffic?

[autobahnjpr]

The honda city hybrid has already been launched in Malaysia and Thailand and there are couple of youtube vidoes on the real world performance and review of the car.
Few points I could gather are

• Average - Practically, people should expect about 20 kmpl fuel average and with 40 litre tank, the range would be somewhere between 750 to 800 kms. 20 kmpl is not something which is exclusively offered by City. There are cars which offer in the same range.
  
• Performance - All the reviews have said that the higher torque number is just on paper. It performs just like normal petrol city and there is nothing drastic or different. you will hardly feel any change. In fact top speed is limited to 175 on hybrid compared to 190+ on petrol only version.
  
• Handling etc - The handling has improved primarily due to addition weight of battery below the rear seats and the presence of disc breaks all round. But it is slightly better and nothing very different.

[varghese_p_g]

20kmpl is not unheard of but the difference is that I'm not aware of any petrol cars that offer 20kmpl in the city/normal driving conditions in that category.

[a.bhatt]

So what am I missing?

• The car has better performance than pure petrol version, given a faster 0-100
• The car gives better performance with an even better fuel efficiency. 20+kmpl actual on road is phenomenal compared to actual average delivered by any other car in this class
• The equipment delivered is better than provided by the competition. This one depends a bit on personal preference as well. As the summer roars, my preference for ventilated seats is growing stronger over a panoramic sunroof

So what are the complaints about?

I feel that there is a spectrum of cars from pure ICE to pure EV. The hybrids lie somewhere on this spectrum. Complaining that the car is more bent towards ICE than EV or vice versa, does not make it a bad car.

I believe Honda is giving us a more practical implementation than a pure EV(range anxiety) and a pure ICE (high running cost, pollution). I appreciate them for the attempt.

[84.monsoon]

Originally Posted by autobahnjpr

[list][*]Average - Practically, people should expect about 20 kmpl fuel average and with 40 litre tank, the range would be somewhere between 750 to 800 kms. 20 kmpl is not something which is exclusively offered by City. There are cars which offer in the same range.

The difference is that while the fuel efficiency of a normal petrol car would drop drastically with frequent starts and stops, in the case of this hybrid, it will actually perform better in slow start-stop city traffic. The more congested the roads are and the slower you move, the more are the chances of using the pure electric mode with the gasoline engine turned off.

[corvus corax]

So, how does the air conditioning work? Is the compressor connected to the engine or does it have a seperate electric motor like in the EVs? If the latter is the case, wouldn't the 0.86kw battery drain quickly in our harsh weather and city traffic conditions, prompting the engine to kick start and thereby affecting the fuel economy considerably?

[Shreyans_Jain]

Dealer tells me they will get the car this coming week, and I can expect a test drive during the weekend.

[subhasis]

Originally Posted by sunikkat

Top speed of 176 kmph sounds very less for a sedan.

As mentioned previously this is more about efficiency and high tech than performance. Not mentioning 0 to 100 timing also indicates that. So definitely going to be a good city car, and even if one get 20 kmpl in the city, it is great numbers.

Guess they want to see the market response first and then decide the premium over regular city, at which they need to price.

Can you please help me understand from where you got this information of 176 kmph top speed?
In the commercials by Honda, I see 220 kmph on the TFT meter console.