[payeng]

Meanwhile I can almost visualize a particular someone say "See I had warned you..!!"

[Sran]

Originally Posted by sri_tesla

Ola replied to the incident with data. The rider was overspeeding throughout the ride going 100+ kmph and at the time of accident riding at 95 kmph at a speed breaker.

Attachment 2299357

Source:
https://twitter.com/OlaElectric/stat...04pnrHrXA&s=08

OLA should be fined for this. User data should be anonymous and hashed. OLA should not use individual data and all data should be mixed. This is a breach of safety.

[am1m]

Originally Posted by KK_HakunaMatata

Ola responded on this incident alone as the analysis was pro them, isn't it?

Originally Posted by Sran

OLA should not use individual data and all data should be mixed.

Both great points, this is the value of a forum where you get so many useful points of view.

On the data privacy aspect, isn't this kind of acceleration/vehicle behaviour data capture ok? I mean as long as it's not location data (which I'm sure any manufacturer will also have access to these days) that's being published, I'm thinking it's ok. But I could be wrong, haven't really thought it through.

[aim120]

Originally Posted by Sran

OLA should be fined for this. User data should be anonymous and hashed. OLA should not use individual data and all data should be mixed. This is a breach of safety.

So what you expect ola to do. How many instances have we seen of people blaming Tesla and Toyotas claiming they accelerate on their own, only to be proved wrong by data. When you accuse some one they have the right to prove their innocence.

[srivibhu]

Originally Posted by shancz

This is a good reply, kudos to Ola


But also raises a concern over the privacy angle but I guess its going to be the norm with connected tech.

While the reply is good
1. It's Scary the amount of data that's collected. Very liable to misuse with hardly any data privacy laws in India

2. How does Ola publish such data. It should not by normal privacy standards. Even if the user has complained Ola can say that it has the data to justify that the scooter did not malfunction and take it to a court of law. (immediate misuse I can think of is insurance claim rejection saying one is a bad driver for a genuine claim based on past history of driving if there is sharing of this data to user). I even forsee insurance agencies tying up with Ola for data of user and changing premiums based on performance. If I was in the insurance side and if Ola has access to user data and no restrictions or consent requirement to share it, I will work with Ola on commission to screw over users on claims. The easiest will be to have a bad driver clause and claim contributory negligence on part of user in all claims.

3. How about proactively sharing data in cases where the scooter did malfunction.

4. Does Ola take a waiver from owners to own user data and use it as it pleases? This is a genuine question to the current owners. To diagnose even? Or is it implied in some contract?

Too many other related questions arise.

[PreludeSH]

Remember many years ago, manufacturers logging data in the car itself and people having concerns on that. Now its all going to the manufacturer online
Is there a waiver the users sign for them to even access this data ? Its all fine to say they will learn using the data and will help them improve the product.

[shancz]

Originally Posted by srivibhu

Too many other related questions arise.

Ditto and you've raised some absolutely genuine and valid points

Way too many questions arise for this and precisely the reason I didn't mention any, too distracted to sit down and think about it.

As they say, "sky is the limit" for data use and misuse so a very important point to consider before going "connected/app based".

[Rajeevraj]

Originally Posted by srivibhu

4. Does Ola take a waiver from owners to own user data and use it as it pleases? This is a genuine question to the current owners. To diagnose even? Or is it implied in some contract?

Since the whole process is online, I am pretty sure that in some 'click through ' agreement that a customer signed, there is a clause where you grant permission to Ola to use the data as they wish. How many of us really read through all the legal fine print thrown at us as part of any purchase. This is not just for Ola, since most cars come with connected tech today, all of them will be doing this.

I am surprised that Ola published the whole thing in public, that definitely seems a violation of privacy. Unless of course there is a clause that covers that also.

Also as others have mentioned, they quickly published this as the data was on thier side. If they really want to be transparent, then they should have published data analytics of the other reported issues also.

[charanreddy]

Originally Posted by Rajeevraj

I am surprised that Ola published the whole thing in public, that definitely seems a violation of privacy. Unless of course there is a clause that covers that also.

There are various levels of data privacy. The worst of which is sharing personally identifiable information like an address / telephone number / email I’d / Adhar card number etc. Or financial information like bank statement / credit card details etc.

Ola responded to an accusation with data and their analysis and I see nothing wrong in that, especially if the owner accused Ola in the first place of a sub standard product in the media. If the owner had instead filed a court case , then reasonably Ola may be expected to share this data in secret with court and not publicise.

Any party cannot be allowed to take advantage of rules / law if they were the perpetrator in the first place.

[lapis_lazuli]

Just to understand, does the Ola scooter need a constant internet connection to be operational? Does it have a SIM or an eSIM inside? Or is it always connected to the users Mobile over Bluetooth and uses the users data connection to upload the data? I have not followed the Ola scooter discussion at all.

Somewhere I read the scooter was handed over to Ola post the accident. Opens another angle, if someone wants, to claim data manipulation since this wasn't done in a third-party lab. Just thinking aloud.

Realtime monitoring of tech data is no big deal, though. But 115kmph in city roads, disastrous either way.

[sri_tesla]

Originally Posted by lapis_lazuli

Just to understand, does the Ola scooter need a constant internet connection to be operational? Does it have a SIM or an eSIM inside? Or is it always connected to the users Mobile over Bluetooth and uses the users data connection to upload the data? I have not followed the Ola scooter discussion at all.

Ola scooter has JIO 4G eSIM. It has WiFi also. It can also be connected to mobile over Bluetooth.

[niteshsharmab]

While everyone is cheering ola for their response. I'm still not convinced at all

1. Even though the kid was speeding. The incident still happened due to issues in the vehicle. Why does a scooter go to a halt from 80 to 0 in 2 seconds? Why is there a need for such high and regressive regenerative brakes? In telsa and any other cars it is fine. But can one go from 80 to 0 so swiftly on 2 wheels and not fall off and die???

2. The data point others are making is very valid

3. Why don't they recall all their vehicles? They must have sold 30000 scooters. Effectively 30000 bombs and defective pieces are plying roads

[veyron_head]

My 2 cents on Ola’s reply
a.) Would an activa(or any other petrol scooter) catch fire or give up on brakes or suspension if it is put through such fluctuations in speed or such high speeds? If there is an inherent risk for EVs, Ola should prominently issue repeated advisory on how the scooter needs to be ridden or, even better don’t allow those speeds.

b.) agree with everyone here. The way these guys putting the customers data in public domain is scary.

[neil.jericho]

Hundreds of owners who are waiting for their scooters : "Hey Bhavish, where is my scooter?! My insurance has started but there is no sign of the scooter!"
Ola : {Radio silence}

Ola owners worried that their scooter goes backwards when you accelerate : Here is a clip on Twitter to prove it.
Ola : {Radio silence}

Autocar India video with the scooter going backwards when you accelerate : 600,000 + views.
Ola : {Radio silence}

One person has an accident : The Ola scooter was faulty ...
Ola : Here is a 100 page PhD report (including irrelevant details on how someone was speeding on the same scooter in the recent past) that proves it was the riders fault!

[ambandla]

Originally Posted by niteshsharmab

While everyone is cheering ola for their response. I'm still not convinced at all

1. Even though the kid was speeding. The incident still happened due to issues in the vehicle. Why does a scooter go to a halt from 80 to 0 in 2 seconds? Why is there a need for such high and regressive regenerative brakes? In telsa and any other cars it is fine. But can one go from 80 to 0 so swiftly on 2 wheels and not fall off and die???

2. The data point others are making is very valid

3. Why don't they recall all their vehicles? They must have sold 30000 scooters. Effectively 30000 bombs and defective pieces are plying roads

One thing that is very suspicious is that one just cannot get that much of injuries from a fall when scooter jumps over a speed breaker (if the person had slowed down to required speed of, say, 10kmph). That kind of injuries and fractures happen only when one jumped over a hump at high speed and fell at high speed.

Btw, as per Ola's data, 80 to 0 was in 3 seconds and it may also include slowing down drastically after scooter had skid. Many 200cc bikes can stop from 80 to 0 on sharp braking in under 4 seconds.

I have Ather 450X and the brakes on the 450X are very very sharp, unlike those on my Pulsar NS 200. When I went for a test ride, this was the first thing the sales person said. Be careful with brakes, they are very sharp. As a result of these sharp brakes and really low center of gravity, it stops lot faster than a normal scooter. Due to these super sharp brakes, one thing i would never do on my 450X is 'push it to the limit' on slippery and city roads. Reason is simple. It may be fast, it may have sharp brakes but it still is a scooter with tiny tiny wheels and light body. I just cannot go beyond 50 in city roads. Can push on an open highway without obstructions/speed breakers.

If Ola's data is correct, I blame the person doing MotoGP on city roads. Can we call this guy a squid?

This brings another concern for me. I have seen so many college and school students on scooters doing all kinds of dangerous stunts. God save us if more of them buy such electric scooters. With the way these electric scooters can twist and cut through small spaces, expect lot of such accidents on roads.