[el lobo 6061]

Originally Posted by souravc

Sorry buddy disagree wholeheartedly with you on the following

Safety cannot and should not be a trade-off at any cost , I hope VW withdraws their TL versions and launch a comfortline with ABS, alloys and airbags as standard.

Completely disagree on these parts for, engine oil should never be refilled when the bulb glows, it should always be kept at its maximum for optimum health of the engine. Regarding micro management its absolutely correct that Vento drinks 0.5 lt every 1500 kms. VW/Skodas engine are very well known for their engine oil drinking habit in the initial kilometers. Its ones call how he treats his car.
I can still bet with even the high revs of a petrol engine let it be Vento or City, a 1.6 TDi can smoke these car hollow in a quarter mile in stock condition. Whats the use of high revving engine when there is such low torque. In city driving condition the low end torque of the TDi engine is more easier to use than the high revs of a petrol engine.
Petrol Vento may go 1000 rpm more than the TDi but change the gear at 3000 rpm and slot the next gear in the 1.6 TDi engine and you will get more torque output than a silly high revving petrol engine.

Originally Posted by RavenAvi

Completely agree with your views on the performance of the TDi. But like GTO said in the review - the TL is simply too basic. Safety features are a must in any car these days, even in the city! You never know when some idiot comes charging through a corner/side road and makes you feel sorry. Specially these days when I see school kids (heck even college kids) vroom on their racing bikes at speeds past 70kph+ on crowded, congested roads!!

In Bombays traffic one can hardly cross 20 kmph, leave 70 kmph. Driving from Vashi to Worli early morning at 9 am and while returning at 7:30 pm is a herculean task. The traffic is so much these days a with ABS is of no use in such traffic, leave airbags alone.

[vb-saan]

Originally Posted by RavenAvi

Yes, we cannot be selfish (except maybe when we are single!). My first child is expected in January 2012, and my folks are growing older, so I have to seriously consider the safety aspect as well. Seems like the petrol HL is the way to go, petrol prices be damned.
Looks like I have to put my dream of owning a TDi on the back burner, at least for the next few years.

I guess the decision part is pretty simple here. If the brand is decided on, and you don’t have the budget to stretch for the diesel Vento, go for the HL Petrol. As Sourav, ethanhunt and others mentioned, it is not advisable to go for a car devoid of basic safety features.

With the new member arriving soon, make sure to buy a safe car and good childseat

Originally Posted by el lobo 6061

If someone says I want a car because of safety feature than he is not a good driver and doesn't respect the car itself.

Sorry, but I have to say that these are a bit of flawed arguments. You may be a good driver, but it may not be the case with the other drivers on the road. It’s not necessary that a mishap always happen between two bad drivers. Just one is enough.

[prabhuferrari]

Did a Bangalore chennai jig again today morning. Tried a different route this time instead of the golden quadrilateral. At least thrice, a villager come on wrong side with their two wheelers, and some with kids as well. And in few instances had to avoid the truckers swerving to left or right without indicators, to avoid a pedestrian or dog in the front. Though there was enough gap in the front I felt reassured with the braking of Vento. I was not doing any crazy speeds. Why am I saying all this? Please do not compromise on safety of you and your family if you can go for the highline with ABS and Airbags. As vb-San said, it does not matter if you are a safe driver. You never know what the other person in the road is capable of.

[bala80]

Hello Souravc - Did you make any progress here? I just read on another thread, that Yokohama is giving away a free Jabra bluetooth headset on buying 4 new tyres and thought I can mention it here since you are in the market for one.

By the way, Michelin is giving away a new mobile phone (samsung) free with purchase of 4 new tyres. Another good reason for you to upgrade.

Originally Posted by souravc

I am kind of ditching the 205/55 for 195/60, opting for Yoko's C drive . Read and re-read quite a few reviews of the C drive and they seem to be excellent - got a user review from a BHP-ian too ( khoj - he has been kind enough to pm me his guidance ).
Got a quote of Rs 4900 per tyre from a well known shop - the revision was achieved out of frustration since the shop that I had initially planned to take works only from 10 to 5 ! I had to check out other shops since its tough to match my timing with the lazy schedule

[souravc]

Originally Posted by bala80

Hello Souravc - Did you make any progress here? I just read on another thread, that Yokohama is giving away a free Jabra bluetooth headset on buying 4 new tyres and thought I can mention it here since you are in the market for one.

By the way, Michelin is giving away a new mobile phone (samsung) free with purchase of 4 new tyres. Another good reason for you to upgrade.

I got the Yokos C drive today , Jabra headset was not on offer - Did around 100 km today and I am elated ! I can at last hear the engine and not the tyre, I can also appreciate your earlier comments about Apollos grip, given your earlier experience with Michelins.
I found a fab tyre workshop in Thane too (Premji's ) - the owner is a self confessed fan of Michelin but still had enough professionalism to advise me that the Yokos are as good as the Michelins. The Michelin Primacy tyres cost around 700 per tyre more than the Yokos ( so 4 tyres is an extra 2800/- , one get a samsung mobile with the dosh )
I opted for the 195/60 , the extra rubber and height helps

[RavenAvi]

Originally Posted by el lobo 6061

In Bombays traffic one can hardly cross 20 kmph, leave 70 kmph. Driving from Vashi to Worli early morning at 9 am and while returning at 7:30 pm is a herculean task. The traffic is so much these days a with ABS is of no use in such traffic, leave airbags alone.

The city in which I live should be termed as "semi-rural". Even if the population is nearing 10 lakhs, it has a long way to go before it promotes itself to even "semi-urban" status. Traffic is pretty limited (we rarely get traffic jams here, except for festival days), and there's always an idiot or a kid without a valid driving license vrooming on his Pulsar/Apache/Karizma like there's no tomorrow.

Also, there are too many narrow-road junctions connected to each other. You never know when someone comes roaring out of a side road without even a horn honked.

Like sourav said, better safe than sorry.

Originally Posted by vb-san

I guess the decision part is pretty simple here. If the brand is decided on, and you don’t have the budget to stretch for the diesel Vento, go for the HL Petrol. As Sourav, ethanhunt and others mentioned, it is not advisable to go for a car devoid of basic safety features.

With the new member arriving soon, make sure to buy a safe car and good childseat

What I have decided these past couple days, vb. You read my thoughts to the T. I need a good recommendation for a child seat manufacturer. Will PM you.

Originally Posted by vb-san

Sorry, but I have to say that these are a bit of flawed arguments. You may be a good driver, but it may not be the case with the other drivers on the road. It’s not necessary that a mishap always happen between two bad drivers. Just one is enough.

Believe me, I have seen many instances when you are driving correctly and someone bashes into you, then starts an argument saying you were wrong!

And there's another type of typical accidents which happen around these parts - someone comes and crashes into you from behind! It has happened to many bikers who lost their lives or got seriously injured till now, because the main cause of such accidents happen to be trucks!

Originally Posted by prabhuferrari

Did a Bangalore chennai jig again today morning. Tried a different route this time instead of the golden quadrilateral. At least thrice, a villager come on wrong side with their two wheelers, and some with kids as well. And in few instances had to avoid the truckers swerving to left or right without indicators, to avoid a pedestrian or dog in the front. Though there was enough gap in the front I felt reassured with the braking of Vento. I was not doing any crazy speeds. Why am I saying all this? Please do not compromise on safety of you and your family if you can go for the highline with ABS and Airbags. As vb-San said, it does not matter if you are a safe driver. You never know what the other person in the road is capable of.

Thanks, prabhu.

Originally Posted by souravc

I got the Yokos C drive today, Jabra headset was not on offer - Did around 100 km today and I am elated ! I can at last hear the engine and not the tyre, I can also appreciate your earlier comments about Apollos grip, given your earlier experience with Michelins.
I found a fab tyre workshop in Thane too (Premji's ) - the owner is a self confessed fan of Michelin but still had enough professionalism to advise me that the Yokos are as good as the Michelins. The Michelin Primacy tyres cost around 700 per tyre more than the Yokos ( so 4 tyres is an extra 2800/- , one get a samsung mobile with the dosh)
I opted for the 195/60 , the extra rubber and height helps

Near-perfect upgrade. Increase of about 6 mm. But what about the warranty, Sourav? I thought VW voided it if you changed it from the stock 185/60 size itself!

I have been doing a bit of research into tyre sizes myself (http://www.tyrestore.in/upsizing.htm). Read about the 205/55 tyres and they sound like a good option as well. The only worry is the warranty getting void. Has VW retracted this yet, or does this clause still stand for the Vento?

[ninjatalli]

Originally Posted by RavenAvi

...

@RavenAvi - I'm assuming you are also keeping the Rapid option as a choice, considering it'll be definitely priced below the Vento, plus the midrange option has ABS & driver airbag which makes it a vfm option. But do keep in mind skoda's A$$ issues.

[souravc]

Originally Posted by RavenAvi

Near-perfect upgrade. Increase of about 6 mm. But what about the warranty, Sourav? I thought VW voided it if you changed it from the stock 185/60 size itself!

I have been doing a bit of research into tyre sizes myself (Tyre Upsizing, Tyre Upsizing Calculator, Tyre Upgrade, Upgrading tyres, Michelin Tyre dealer in chennai, Authorised Michelin Tyre dealer in chennai, Michelin India, Michelin Tyres, tyrestore chennai). Read about the 205/55 tyres and they sound like a good option as well. The only worry is the warranty getting void. Has VW retracted this yet, or does this clause still stand for the Vento?

Raven unfortunately R15 seriously limits the choices available , if it was R16 it would have been so much better . With R15 , 205/55 option is unavailable ( Bala says that its there in continental , Yokos and Michelins do not allow that option).
Well , the upgrade to 195/60 does void the warranty if VW plays hard ball - I delayed making changes till 15K km to understand my car and take an 'educated' hunch about how fragile the car is ( if there is anything like it) .
At the risk of voiding warranty, I opted for better comfort, lower noise and also something that fills the wheel wells better - IMO the Vento has too huge a gap between the rim of the tyre and the body.

Given that I have upgraded the headlights to 90/100 and changed the engine oil to Mobile 1 ( fully synthetic) 0W/40 which all qualifies for warranty void - the tyre upgrade is one more added to this list. The changes are not fancy stuff but can be justified as ones that make my ride more comfy / safe and pampers my car .
No wonder skipping the extended warranty package is a no brainer for me

[bala80]

Congratulations and glad to note your feedback. You'd start appreciating these even more the next time you take your car out on highways or drive through winding ghat sections. The apollo's lose traction very easily, especially when driving through ghat's due to the torque on offer.

And yes, continental has CPC2 in 205/55 and Yoko's have S-Drives in this size. I couldn't find anything else, period. S-Drives are the sporty types and not the one I was looking for and feedback about CPC2 is very mixed on this forum. CPC2's cost a whopping 6100-6400 Rs/tyre and I'm very apprehensive of putting my money on it. 195/60 seems to be the best compromise and you have wide variety of choices under this including Michelin primacy LC and Yoko C Drives amongst others.

I hate this when the manufacturer quote some stupid warranty terms and conditions which is devoid of any common sense. Technially the deviation is within the tolerance of 2% and no warranty can be voided, but then so called technicians in the service station doesnt understand all this. As long as you have good relation with the service center you shouldnt have an issue. Even otherwise, it is only the suspension and related components for which the warranty can be voided. I'd say its worth taking this risk and I would be surprised if VW (or any manufacturer) can void the warranty just for a tyre upgrade.

Originally Posted by souravc

Raven unfortunately R15 seriously limits the choices available , if it was R16 it would have been so much better . With R15 , 205/55 option is unavailable ( Bala says that its there in continental , Yokos and Michelins do not allow that option).

[anToNIcHeN]

Originally Posted by el lobo 6061

I would suggest you to refill it for the better of your engine. After crossing 5000 mark your car needs 1.75 lt of engine oil. Vento drinks 0.5 lt every 1500 kms according to the manual. You wouldn't want a quite a hot engine during a weekend trip.

0.5l every 1500km
Does this mean that we have to 'top up' for every 7000 odd kms?
souravc has posted that TDi engines would 'drink' some oil during the initial days (15k)
http://www.team-bhp.com/forum/offici...ml#post2435344
Anyone in the forum reached 22K kms? Did you guys had to top up at around 22k too?

[el lobo 6061]

Originally Posted by anToNIcHeN

0.5l every 1500km
Does this mean that we have to 'top up' for every 7000 odd kms?
souravc has posted that TDi engines would 'drink' some oil during the initial days (15k)
http://www.team-bhp.com/forum/offici...ml#post2435344
Anyone in the forum reached 22K kms? Did you guys had to top up at around 22k too?

Yes. If you own a Vento TDi, just check the oil dip stick. You would come to know the oil level in your car. At 7000 kms Vento TDi would easily drink 2 lt of engine oil, without any problems.
Its just micro management, to keep the engine oil at its optimum/max level. One can continue using the car without refilling but its advisable to keep the engine oil at its maximum level.

Sourav, when is your first service due? Do you plan to get it done from Andheri or Nerul workshop? Any plans of changing the tires when going to the workshop for any warranty void problems. How is the engine after the change to Mobil Delvac 1? Has the engine sound reduced because of synthetic oil? Quite a few question.

[souravc]

Originally Posted by anToNIcHeN

0.5l every 1500km
Does this mean that we have to 'top up' for every 7000 odd kms?
souravc has posted that TDi engines would 'drink' some oil during the initial days (15k)
http://www.team-bhp.com/forum/offici...ml#post2435344
Anyone in the forum reached 22K kms? Did you guys had to top up at around 22k too?

evilshantanu has reached 22K km so you may want to check with him . As el lobo mentioned check with the dipstick and when its below the min level you should top up - either that or you wait for the warning light to glow on dash . I am not a big fan of micro management and believe that its not required - prefer the dipstick visual . for my TDi, I changed the oil from the recommended Castrol Magnatec professional to Mobil 1 (details below ) which is fully synthetic - my experience has been that while magnatec needed a top up at 5-6K region , Mobil 1 has lasted 9-10K

Originally Posted by el lobo 6061

Sourav, when is your first service due? Do you plan to get it done from Andheri or Nerul workshop? Any plans of changing the tires when going to the workshop for any warranty void problems. How is the engine after the change to Mobil Delvac 1? Has the engine sound reduced because of synthetic oil? Quite a few question.

Rohaan , I booked myself in the Nerul workshop for tomorrow. I am not changing the tyres, its too much of an hassle - jo hoga dekha jayega . On the matter of engine oil - the one that I am using is Mobil 1 0W/40 Mobil 1 0W-40 ( since Mobil does not have 5W/40 ) and not delvac (its for heavy duty truck engines ) , I am pretty satisfied with the switch . The oil maintains consistency/stickiness for a much longer period as compared magnatec which is good for the engine ! IMO, the Mobil 1 needs top ups after a longer duration as compared to the magnatec ( can't say for sure though as it might have been that when VW handed over the car to me , the engine oil was not upto the brim )

[amit_mechengg]

Originally Posted by el lobo 6061

Yes. If you own a Vento TDi, just check the oil dip stick. You would come to know the oil level in your car. At 7000 kms Vento TDi would easily drink 2 lt of engine oil, without any problems.
Its just micro management, to keep the engine oil at its optimum/max level. One can continue using the car without refilling but its advisable to keep the engine oil at its maximum level.

Sourav, when is your first service due? Do you plan to get it done from Andheri or Nerul workshop? Any plans of changing the tires when going to the workshop for any warranty void problems. How is the engine after the change to Mobil Delvac 1? Has the engine sound reduced because of synthetic oil? Quite a few question.

this is crazy. there is nothing such as micro management to make the car or tune the car to eat up oil.
the tolerances on the napear piston ring if perfect in design and manufacturing retains oil just perfectly.

the oil retaining piston rings are enough for proper lubrication of moving pistons.

0.5 lts per 1500 kms is just not tolerable limits. i wonder if this really happens and yet vento passes the euro IV norms.

i will ask the Service advisors too, if such is the case with every vento TDI.

bad german engineering.

[el lobo 6061]

Originally Posted by souravc

Rohaan , I booked myself in the Nerul workshop for tomorrow. I am not changing the tyres, its too much of an hassle - jo hoga dekha jayega . On the matter of engine oil - the one that I am using is Mobil 1 0W/40 Mobil 1 0W-40 Can't say for sure though as it might have been that when VW handed over the car to me , the engine oil was not upto the brim )

Sourav, do post the total cost incurred and your experience. Do tell them all the do's and don't in advance. Like no changing of headlamp bulb's, no wheel alignment(as you have just got new ones), no changing air pressure, etc.

Can do me a favor, can you ask what is the cost of a alloy wheel rim as there have been news of drastic reduction in cost of alloy wheel rim. Do you plan to get the wiper fluid which a divine smell when used? Please ask workshop guys what the cost of it, if someone wants to purchase it separately. I quite like the smell.

Originally Posted by amit_mechengg

this is crazy. there is nothing such as micro management to make the car or tune the car to eat up oil.
the tolerances on the napear piston ring if perfect in design and manufacturing retains oil just perfectly. I will ask the Service advisors too, if such is the case with every vento TDI.

bad german engineering.

Its actually mentioned in the manual regarding Vento TDi habbit of drinking 0.5 lt every 1500 kms. I have actually observed it. When my car crossed 1750 kms, the dip stick went to 'B' level. Which meant car needed 0.5 lt of engine oil and it actually gulped it up and dip stick was again at 'A' level.

[bala80]

As far as I know, this is true for every VW, Skoda and (may be) audi cars. Even with them, this phenomenon is more observed only during the initial 15k kms with the TDI engines.

Have seen this being reported for a civic in the forum and nothing much otherwise. One possible reason is the service interval for the other cars are either 5k/10k Km's and this doesnt really matter.

If I recollect the new fiat's (Linea/Punto) have a 15k interval, would be interesting to check if there has been any reports of MJD's consuming oil?

Originally Posted by amit_mechengg

i will ask the Service advisors too, if such is the case with every vento TDI.

bad german engineering.