[Enigma]

Originally Posted by autoenthusiast

Guys, instead of pitying the driver who was part of the crime, imagine what could have happened if some innocent family was in a car behind this truck. they would have paid the price for no fault of theirs !

I dont think the driver is to be blamed as much as the person he works for.
He is just a worker who doesn even own the truck.
The main culprit is his boss(seth) who must have made him overload the truck to maximise his profits!!




@aloksriva-i think you did just the right thing !
Specially considering the fact that your family was with you which also included infants and if the boulder had landed on the top of your car it could have even proved to be fatal.

[prince_pervez]

Originally Posted by autoenthusiast

imagine what could have happened if some innocent family was in a car behind this truck. they would have paid the price for no fault of theirs !

Well nothing happened! So no point in discussing it. It would have been mighty sad if that would have had happened.

Originally Posted by Thad E Ginathom

Yet another reason never to drive close to the vehicle in front, especially if it is a truck and especially if the truck is loaded with stones, sand, grit, pebbles etc. It only takes one stone to smash your car and maybe your head!

Tell me about it! While coming from HYD it took only pebble to rikoshet on the windscreen from under some truck tyre to create a small flake kind of a formation on the screen.

Originally Posted by Enigma

I dont think the driver is to be blamed as much as the person he works for.
He is just a worker who doesn even own the truck.
The main culprit is his boss(seth) who must have made him overload the truck to maximise his profits!!

Absolutely.

[anjan_c2007]

Originally Posted by LongDrive

Saw this today morning on MahaMaya flyover, noida. The truck was so overloaded that it could not climb the flyover. Just imagine the driver condition when this might have happend. Please excuse for the low resolution pic (Phone Cam)

Sorry to see the tipper's pitiable plight.Surely its a victim of overloading under ideal Indian conditions.
Actually feel tippers should have a heavy duty locking device that prevents the rear loaded or unloaded trailer from going wild and toppling like that.Even the hydraulic system that operates it must be in control. Or else its very unsafe.

[aaggoswami]

Originally Posted by AlokSriva

Probably he thought that the local accent coupled with a high decibel level will shoo me off. However it did piss me off even more (I was already peeved with something hitting my car for no fault of mine) and it culminated in a tight slap on driver's face with a warning to tone down else he would spend a week in lock up, to be beaten black n blue with little or no chances of bail and that the dumper would be impounded till the court gives a decision. Somewhat on the lines of 'jaanta hai mai kaun hoon'.

Immediately this joker, who was roaring a few moments ago, had his tails between his legs, and started pleading giving a different story that he is poor driver and that he would be in trouble from all sides (from his employer as well for not following proper safety instructions)!


Now before I am branded as rash in my attitude for slapping this idiot, there are a few things - '
1) I was in car with mine and my sister's family which included my 3 year old niece and 8 month old son; thank God for small mercies that the stone probably hit the underbody, what if it had fallen in a manner so as to cause an accident causing injury?
2) My observation of Gurgaon's road/drivers/traffic in last one year of my stay has taught me either to turn a blind eye to what's happening on the road or if you take it up, don't be cowed down with the local accent.
3) I would have moved on without slapping him, had this driver not started bullying around..

Not the best of things to do, but when its your family being threatened, I guess it tends to bring out the beast in oneself.

1) Many things are not in driver's hand. I witnessed one incident like this near Fatehgunj circle in my city. Something fell off the truck on a Zen while Zen was trying to overtake the truck. The object was a small bag containing papers ( probably being taken for recycling ).
The Zen driver was very angry, got ahead of truck, braked hard. The truck too braked hard, resulting in a Sierra almost rear ending truck. The Zen driver and Sierra driver came out for truck driver.

As usual, the driver was beaten down till traffic police came and after around 30 mins traffic was cleared. I was returning after having my lunch at Kalyan ( located in fatehgunj area ), and was observing all this.

2) The person is really just a driver. He was not owner of truck, neither was he responsible for anything wrong.

3) Resources given out to truck drivers are :
-> Never maintained trucks.
-> Ropes that are well worn
-> Poor pay.
-> Too much work stress. Asked to drive bad trucks for days after days.

4) The biggest question :
Why cant the Zen owner file a legal complaint against the truck owner/transport company ?
This way, may be in future, the truck owner/transport company will show adherence towards safety rules. Again less lives at risk, probably.

5) Why did the Zen driver and Sierra driver not trace down the owner and beat him ? That should be real stuff and will help the society as the owner will be taught a lesson.

The truck in question was from Gujarat only. The Zen was registered in Vadodara ( GJ-6 ).

6) A few queries :
Did you note down the Truck's number ? Are you planning to take any action against the truck owner/transport company ?

My main point is that beating the driver is not going to help. Mostly even the driver is under pressure to reach his destination on time. The real culprits are others. Getting tough with them will help.

PS : To this day, I have the Zen's number stored. The Zen was bluish grey in color and Sierra was Greyish in color.

[AvonA7]

Originally Posted by aaggoswami

5) Why did the Zen driver and Sierra driver not trace down the owner and beat him ? That should be real stuff and will help the society as the owner will be taught a lesson.

My main point is that beating the driver is not going to help. Mostly even the driver is under pressure to reach his destination on time. The real culprits are others. Getting tough with them will help.

Well, this is an accident and agree that it was not driver`s fault (truck).
But how the owner of the truck is responsible for this accident? He is not even in the spot, not driving the truck, may not be present while the truck was loaded.

I think the truck driver should have filed complaint against the car owner/drivers who beat him up.

Just imagine, if a govt. bus or vehicle would have scratched the cars also, the guys beating the truck driver couldn't have dared to touch the govt. vehicle driver, because in that case they would have cases filed against them for manhandling a govt. employee on-duty!

Agreed with the the resources part - poor condition vehicle, low pay etc.

We all have seen, numerous times that trucks loaded with twice its capacity plying on city roads, highways. The owner is responsible, the driver also is responsible and mostly the authorities who allow these vehicles on-road (we all know how!) are more responsible and there are many cases of accident.

Sharing one more example, not sure how many of you are aware - In Calcutta (I am sure this practice is present in other cities also) where most of the public transport (buses) are run by private owners, reports of the owner selling off the brand new tires and get the local manufactured tires (6+1) - straight way recovering a part of the investment in purchasing the bus. These local tires are off poor quality, tire may bust at high speed causing accidents and has happened also.

Now every year public buses goes to motor vehicles for checking. Those who have used the minibus would know, the 2X2 seats are very much less than the actual size with knees hitting the front seats - why? to increase space for standing passengers! so that more passengers can get into the bus. The question is what are the authorities doing while giving the vehicle fit certificate?

In many cities across India, passengers (you and me) sits in the front left seat of the bus (left side of the driver) clearly obstructing the drivers view on the left side of the vehicle. More awareness of traffic rules and common sense in these cases would help us.

I already made it a long post, but lastly, would like to mention this point - how many of us have seen nuts n bolts being used to repair truck tires? I am sure almost all of us. The most dangerous thing, a tire bust and the nuts n bolts can kill a person if he/she gets hit.

More awareness of traffic rules amongst us (common people) and authorities to help implement these rules can reduce accidents and save many lives.

[anjan_c2007]

Originally Posted by AlokSriva

Not the best of things to do, but when its your family being threatened, I guess it tends to bring out the beast in oneself.

Read the whole incident but believe you should avoid assaulting these dirty guys.Some have criminal antecedents.It was dark and you never know. The chap could have taken out some weapon, attacked you and said he did it for self defence. More so because you had family members in the car including kids.
Its better to give these chaps a verbal piece of your mind. In daylight there are other doses that can be given by calling some bystanders to collectively give the erring chap a good thrashing and so on.

[AlokSriva]

Originally Posted by Enigma

@aloksriva-i think you did just the right thing !
Specially considering the fact that your family was with you which also included infants and if the boulder had landed on the top of your car it could have even proved to be fatal.

I still am not sure whether what I did was right or wrong - the only thing that mattered to me at that instant was the safety of my family and the way driver was bullying around, I deemed it best to make him shut up and listen sense.

Originally Posted by aaggoswami

2) The person is really just a driver. He was not owner of truck, neither was he responsible for anything wrong.

After a tight slap, which brought him to ground reality, our johnny was pleading to be left alone as the truck owner would have made his life miserable for him for not following instructions while ferrying stones.
Please re-read my post

Originally Posted by aaggoswami

4) The biggest question :
Why cant the Zen owner file a legal complaint against the truck owner/transport company ?
This way, may be in future, the truck owner/transport company will show adherence towards safety rules. Again less lives at risk, probably.

Oh really! You seriously believe that? Seems Mr. Goswami, you are living in a utopic world out of which you now need to step out and face the harsh realities of life - at least in India.. To illustrate -

A couple of months ago, there was a Santro which banged into my wife's stationary car at a traffic signal and sped away. I went to the police station to lodge an FIR. The ASI refused to register one stating there are umpteen rear ending cases and they can not register an FIR for each of them - this despite the fact that my wife had noted down the registration number of the offending Santro! Finally we had to be content with submitting a written complaint, an acknowledged copy of which was given to us as a big favour!

Originally Posted by aaggoswami

6) A few queries :
Did you note down the Truck's number ? Are you planning to take any action against the truck owner/transport company ?

No, I did not. The sole reason being - I plan to move on rather than being hung up with a jerk who posed a big safety threat to me and my family. Also, if my experience regarding registering an FIR is anything to go by, I would not waste my energy in pursuing it via the legal route - because there ain't any legal route in such a situation.

Originally Posted by aaggoswami

My main point is that beating the driver is not going to help. Mostly even the driver is under pressure to reach his destination on time. The real culprits are others. Getting tough with them will help.

Boss, please don't have a holier than thou attitude for god's sake. Put yourself in my shoes, have a look at my past experiences, and you would know that only thing that works in India is instant justice.
BTW, why do I feel reading one of your very old posts where you mentioned slapping someone while on your way to college on a bike? Or is my memory failing me?

Originally Posted by anjan_c2007

Read the whole incident but believe you should avoid assaulting these dirty guys.Some have criminal antecedents.It was dark and you never know. The chap could have taken out some weapon, attacked you and said he did it for self defence. More so because you had family members in the car including kids.
Its better to give these chaps a verbal piece of your mind. In daylight there are other doses that can be given by calling some bystanders to collectively give the erring chap a good thrashing and so on.

I understand mate, but as I mentioned earlier, it was a spur of the moment thingie.. because I felt that if I don't make him shut up, he was trying to dominate despite being on the wrong. Who knows what he would have done, in case I had backed out.. At least this way he changed the colors in a flash.
Yes, I usually avoid such altercations on road.. but this was just a bit too much for me to turn a blind eye to..

[sbraj]

Originally Posted by aaggoswami

1) Many things are not in driver's hand.
...
2) The person is really just a driver. He was not owner of truck, neither was he responsible for anything wrong.

Truck driver is holding a commercial vehicle license.

Isn't it his responsibility to make sure that the vehicle he is going to drive is loaded as per rules? If it is not, doesn't that amount to violation of his license conditions?

When a commercial vehicle is involved in accident due to overloading, I don't think it is right to say that the driver has not done any wrong.

[Amartya]

Originally Posted by AlokSriva

I understand mate, but as I mentioned earlier, it was a spur of the moment thingie.. because I felt that if I don't make him shut up, he was trying to dominate despite being on the wrong. Who knows what he would have done, in case I had backed out.. At least this way he changed the colors in a flash.
Yes, I usually avoid such altercations on road.. but this was just a bit too much for me to turn a blind eye to..

Please don't mind my saying this, but I think Anjan is absolutely right on his point (I think you agree partially too, hence you mentioned the spur of the moment thing). While what has been done is done, it's a safer policy to not turn anything into a physical exchange. These days people might carry guns or knives or anything else, no point risking it for a moment of one upmanship.

Originally Posted by sbraj

Truck driver is holding a commercial vehicle license.

Isn't it his responsibility to make sure that the vehicle he is going to drive is loaded as per rules? If it is not, doesn't that amount to violation of his license conditions?

When a commercial vehicle is involved in accident due to overloading, I don't think it is right to say that the driver has not done any wrong.

Are you serious? Do you truly believe that the truck driver has any authority in India? While I understand your point from a legal point of view, it cannot and does not work in India.

Note from the Team-BHP Support Team : Please use "Multi Quote" option for quoting Multiple posts, instead of creating another back-to-back post.

[khoj]

Originally Posted by AlokSriva

Tell me about this.. A couple of weeks ago, had gone out for a family dinner and while returning, there was this dumper loaded with stones driving recklessly driving in the same direction ahead of me.

Guys read the opening lines, the driver was 'RECKLESS'

This episode is so very familiar and is played out every night in NCR, even in the middle of DELHI thanks to the CWG. In fact if any one of you were to have the unnerving experience of driving behind a huge oversized dumper with a mountain of small rocks you would really give it a wide berth. I have personally seen stones yes plural stones nearly the size of footballs rolling off these dumpers as they go up flyovers at some speed and then brake in order to avoid a slow moving vehicle up ahead. So before flaming Alok please come to Delhi and I myself or Alok would gladly take you through the experience. Of course all the fluids required to soothen our nerves thereafter are on your account.

Originally Posted by AlokSriva

Not the best of things to do, but when its your family being threatened, I guess it tends to bring out the beast in oneself.

Correct and that is the way nature intended us to be.
As I posted else where on a road rage thread
Provoked : YES
Easily : NO
I believe the genteel terminology is 'Controlled Aggression'.

[aaggoswami]

Originally Posted by AlokSriva

1) Oh really! You seriously believe that? Seems Mr. Goswami, you are living in a utopic world out of which you now need to step out and face the harsh realities of life - at least in India.. To illustrate -

A couple of months ago, there was a Santro which banged into my wife's stationary car at a traffic signal and sped away. I went to the police station to lodge an FIR. The ASI refused to register one stating there are umpteen rear ending cases and they can not register an FIR for each of them - this despite the fact that my wife had noted down the registration number of the offending Santro! Finally we had to be content with submitting a written complaint, an acknowledged copy of which was given to us as a big favour!


2) Boss, please don't have a holier than thou attitude for god's sake. Put yourself in my shoes, have a look at my past experiences, and you would know that only thing that works in India is instant justice.
BTW, why do I feel reading one of your very old posts where you mentioned slapping someone while on your way to college on a bike? Or is my memory failing me?

Originally Posted by sbraj

3) Truck driver is holding a commercial vehicle license.

Isn't it his responsibility to make sure that the vehicle he is going to drive is loaded as per rules? If it is not, doesn't that amount to violation of his license conditions?

When a commercial vehicle is involved in accident due to overloading, I don't think it is right to say that the driver has not done any wrong.

1) Our M800 was rear ended and nobody even cared to listen.
A two wheeler would ram into our stationary M800, break the bumper and demand money.

This is common, but one more reality is that there are people who can get real low. They will go down to any level for winning or satisfying ego.
Getting physical with any person when family is around in the car is something best avoided.


2) Yes, that is true ( and your memory is very healthy ), I am still short tempered person. But eventually I realized about the people whom I used to fight with. They will not improve with a beating, but for sure will get worse.
In your case, the driver actually bowed down, but it could have gone otherwise. I believe they are in general not real culprits, but if offended can get low to fight.
The root cause of the issue is not driver, but the people who own transport companies.

I used to fight with auto drivers. Later on realized that they are just drivers, most of the auto in my city are owned by police officers/personals.
The driver is scolded if earning is less, is asked to follow rules ( in very rare cases ), will be held responsible for almost anything wrong.
If the auto is damaged by somebody who is not having good contacts, is not government employee, then he will be harassed to pay money. But if some influential person hit auto, the driver will be in trouble.

After this I realized that I am wasting my time hitting others, they are not going to improve. In worst case, I would be in trouble due to gangs.

About your statement in the bold : There will be anarchy and chaos then.

PS : this is my last post on this topic. One has to step in shoes of the truck drivers in the first place to understand what I wanted to say.

3) As mentioned above, one has to step into truck driver's shoes to understand the real issue and where it originates from.
May be even sitting in typical Indian truck cabin for 5-6 hours will be enough to realize what is core problem.

Its not in truck driver's hand not to overload the truck. Most of the times, truck drivers dont even understand units like KG, ton, bhp, nm, kgm. We all know how the license are offered to all including people who are rich and pay bribe to get license for their family members.

If there was awareness among truck drivers, auto drivers, and drivers who use Indian roads, there wont be more than 1,00,000 deaths on the road.

[nbr]

This accident happened in Manipal near Mangalore. They say ,it survived a crash only because it was a Nano and its lightweight and was hanging on the wire. No information,how it happened. But it did have a narrow escape!!!

[anjan_c2007]

A rear engined Tata city bus' engine cover ripped through the front end of an Alto yesterday at Nagpur like the knife cuts a fruit! The TOI report:

[pgsagar]

First incident of Nano accident shown on Teambhp I presume. I feel more saddened to see a crashed Nano than a crashed BMW. May be because nine out of ten BMWs come out of easy money whereas nine out of ten Nanos come out of hard earned money. No offence to BMW though, it is my favorite car too.

[SirAlec]

i think the Hydraulic system of the dumper failed. taking all the load to the back.

Normally these tipper are 6x6.