Team-BHP > Shifting gears
Register New Topics New Posts Top Thanked Team-BHP FAQ


Reply
  Search this Thread
2,645,931 views
Old 15th January 2022, 19:17   #14881
BHPian
 
searacer932's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2014
Location: Chennai
Posts: 449
Thanked: 935 Times
Re: The Cricket Thread

Absolutely outstanding captaincy record and legacy set by Kohli for the test team.

Quote:
Matches : 68
Won : 40
Lost : 17
Draw : 11
His ODI captaincy record is not bad either and the cultural change he brought to the team from a fitness perspective was a real game changer.

Go well champ!
searacer932 is offline   (3) Thanks
Old 15th January 2022, 19:22   #14882
Senior - BHPian
 
SoumenD's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2013
Location: India
Posts: 1,756
Thanked: 6,318 Times
Re: The Cricket Thread

Was sort of half-expecting the resignation. Good in a way as we so miss Kohli, the batsman since couple of years. Hope he gets back his touch. Rahane should make way for Vihari now. Mayank would probably make way for Rohit. Problem is next series is at home with SL and mostly everyone will perform and somehow this defeat and our glaring shortcoming (middle order batting) will be forgotten.

Kudos to SA the way they played. They didn’t just win the last 2 tests, rather made a statement. Both the tests if you notice they looked in total control in the 4th innings. Looking at the way they batted, I doubt even a target of 300+ wouldn’t have been enough
SoumenD is offline  
Old 15th January 2022, 19:35   #14883
NPV
Distinguished - BHPian
 
NPV's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: Namma Bengaluru
Posts: 7,220
Thanked: 10,262 Times
Re: The Cricket Thread

Quote:
Originally Posted by vibbs View Post
Just shared on Wisden facebook page - Kohli steps down from Test Captaincy!!

For all his follies, I still think he is the best captain for us. KL Rahul is not even a patch.
I think this is good - Kohli can focus on his batting and get back to scoring big runs, it's the need of the hour given we have such a fragile and inconsistent middle order currently.
KL Rahul doesn't seem to be ready for test captaincy as we saw in the second test Vs South Africa. I think it will be Rohit Sharma. And suddenly we may have the situation of one captain across all formats yet again, though KL Rahul will captain the side for the upcoming ODI series in South Africa in Rohit's absence!

Last edited by NPV : 15th January 2022 at 19:36.
NPV is offline   (2) Thanks
Old 15th January 2022, 19:41   #14884
BHPian
 
Join Date: Aug 2010
Location: Gurgaon
Posts: 552
Thanked: 1,544 Times
Re: The Cricket Thread

Virat Kohli - Live by the sword and die by it.

Shame on BCCI for not doing its only job - manage Indian cricket team.

Whether we side with Virat as a captain or not, the absolute shambles of the way in the sequence of events leading to Virat relinquishing captaincy is a serious question on BCCI and the way it is managed.

Hard times for Indian cricket going forward - the core of team is disintegrating fast.
headbanger is offline   (3) Thanks
Old 15th January 2022, 19:51   #14885
Senior - BHPian
 
harry10's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: Faridabad/Delhi
Posts: 2,713
Thanked: 3,624 Times
Re: The Cricket Thread

What!!!

I am shocked.
All controversies aside he is the best test captain we ever had. It's clear there are many issues between him and Ganguly going on, hence his leaving test Captaincy. I feel he may even retire like this anytime because if he doesn't feel wanted and his passion for the game is reduced then what's the point.

Worst part is we don't have a replacement.
Rahul is in pure simple words absolutely rubbish as Captain. Rahane should never play for India again. Pujara is end of his game too. Rohit is only logical choice but he is too injury prone and burden of 3 format Captaincy will kill his fitness and game. That leave only Pant who is guarantee in tests atleast.

Now I am sure selector idiots will make Rahul as Captain. To say I am disappointed and angry with Kohli leaving Captaincy is an understatement. But, if it brings the Kohli of 2016 then we will take it.

Last edited by harry10 : 15th January 2022 at 20:02.
harry10 is offline   (2) Thanks
Old 15th January 2022, 20:19   #14886
BHPian
 
Join Date: Dec 2020
Location: KA-21
Posts: 585
Thanked: 3,270 Times
Re: The Cricket Thread

Kohli is one of the best cricket captains the world has ever seen statistically or otherwise. The influence/impact he has had on cricketing world as a player and a captain is huge. It's really sad to see him relinquish captaincy the way he has. It would have been apt for him to quit on a high, which unfortunately is not the case. The outside noise/pressure probably got better of him. Hope to see 'Kohli the batsman' dominate the way that he is renowned for.

Last edited by Emvi : 15th January 2022 at 20:21.
Emvi is offline  
Old 15th January 2022, 20:25   #14887
PPS
Senior - BHPian
 
PPS's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2010
Location: mumbai
Posts: 2,468
Thanked: 3,719 Times
Re: The Cricket Thread

Credit where its due, SA completely out-batted & even out-bowled Team India in the series! This was supposed to be SA's most weakest & inexperienced team in the last 3 decades & India was supposed to win comfortably but exactly the opposite happened! Yes, luck wasn't on our side but this loss would hurt bad & is a touch embarrassing. Everyone has summed up the reasons for the series loss so no point repeating the same thing again but its now essential that the transition phase happens & new players like Vihari, Shreyas Iyer & Gill are blooded in.

Just read about Virat Kohli stepping down as Test Captain. This couldn't have come at a worse time! There is no successor in sight. KL Rahul is too raw & doesn't seem to enjoy captaincy in IPL. Rohit can be appointed but off late he's been injury prone. Rahane would have been ideal but he has no batting form. Only positive I can possibly see is more 100s from Virat Kohli's bat. Virat now has to score big to survive. He has no choice! Someone wants to put Virat in his place!
PPS is offline  
Old 15th January 2022, 20:30   #14888
BHPian
 
Join Date: Apr 2010
Location: Bengaluru
Posts: 79
Thanked: 49 Times
Re: The Cricket Thread

I came across this piece a couple of weeks back, which kind of sums up brilliantly: The world has changed, and Kohli must scrap for his place in it - https://www.espncricinfo.com/story/s...-in-it-1294327
Time to move on and put the focus on batting.
Weathered is offline   (1) Thanks
Old 15th January 2022, 20:44   #14889
Senior - BHPian
 
Venkatesh's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2020
Location: Hyderabad
Posts: 8,287
Thanked: 43,790 Times
Re: The Cricket Thread

Virat Kohli as Test Captain

The Cricket Thread-20220115_203923.jpg

Virat Kohli finishes as one of the most successful captains to play Test cricket.

The Cricket Thread-20220115_203930.jpg

So much has happened in matter of months

The Cricket Thread-smartselect_20220115204307_twitter.jpg

Just 60 losses in 213 games, Virat Kohli steps down as India captain.

The Cricket Thread-20220115_203946.jpg

Test captains with 5,000 runs and 52-plus batting average

The Cricket Thread-20220115_203954.jpg

Thank You Captain, Will cherish all those unbelievable victories under his Captaincy.

The Cricket Thread-20220115_204014.jpg

Source : ESPNcricinfo

Last edited by Venkatesh : 15th January 2022 at 21:00.
Venkatesh is offline   (7) Thanks
Old 15th January 2022, 21:47   #14890
BHPian
 
Join Date: Feb 2016
Location: Hyderabad
Posts: 181
Thanked: 558 Times
Re: The Cricket Thread

Quote:
Originally Posted by vibbs View Post
Just shared on Wisden facebook page - Kohli steps down from Test Captaincy!!

For all his follies, I still think he is the best captain for us. KL Rahul is not even a patch

Source: ESPNcricinfo Facebook page
Kohli was ear marked to be the player who will break all the batting records (mostly held by one of the GOAT - Sachin). They way he was scoring runs it seemed as if he will shatter every batting record Sachin, Ponting, Lara or the other greats of the game hold (except the Don - I believe this record will stay on till eternity). He was almost machine like in precision and focus. As an individual contributor he was someone who one could idolize just his commitment towards the game. Last few years have been hard for mankind in general and as well proved that he too is a mortal. Captaincy pressures, bio bubbles and failures when it mattered the most has somehow reduced him from the one of the best in business to a mortal who fails. He has shown flashes of his old self intermittently and with the pressure of captaincy gone he will soon be back to doing what he does best - back to being the best in business

He was fast tracked to the most powerful position in world cricket . He was made the captain of the team of the world's most powerful and rich sports body. The single minded pursuit that propelled him towards becoming one of the GOATs of the game is what has stopped him from becoming the best captain India ever had. Ganguly and Dhoni will remain the two best captains India ever had. For me Kohli as a captain is nothing more than mediocre. There were a lot of other captains who I would rate much higher than Kohli inspite of Kohli having the best record as a captain (best in India and comparable with some of the all time best captains in the history of game).

The reason for it is not what all he achieved but rather the legacy he left behind. Ganguly made a team out of a bunch of individual performers and instilled a sense of not giving up at all even when facing the best. Besides he inherited a team in complete shambles and turned things around miraculously. Backed youngsters along with keeping a team full of superstars and still got results as a team. He had a way of getting under the skin of the opponents and beating them at their own game.

Dhoni inherited a team which had belief in its abilities but had lot of aging superstars and bunch of next gen players with a complete different thought process. He was still able to navigate through this period and get the desired results. He would be remembered as one of the best captains of all time not just in India but the world due to his tactical nous. He was mostly able to get the best out of whatever he ever had at his disposal which makes him a better captain than he was a player. He had results to show for all his effort be it ICC tournaments, number one ranking in tests or IPL trophies. Just as a captain he would be up there at the top of the heap along with Steve Waugh, Mark Taylor, Mike Brearley, Clive Lloyd, Imran Khan, Wasim Akram, Kapil Dev. Ganguly, Stephen Fleming, Kane Williamson, Arjuna Ranatunga etc. A common traits among all these captains are all of these were inspirational, resourceful, empathetic and left a legacy that will define them for the rest of the lives. The teams these greats led always were greater than the sum of individual parts or rather these greats had a way to achieve the same with whatever resources they had.

As far as stats are concerned Kohli too would be sitting right on top along with all these greats. But stats sometimes hide a lot more than they reveal.

Inspirational - Yes - As an individual performer he is so driven and demanding that it almost impossible to match up to him. Sachin was another individual who was similar and the less said about his captaincy the better it is. Sachin doesn't even have the results to show unlike Kohli though. But the problem is similar. Both expect similar levels of performance which the lesser mortals could never match up to. Besides Kohli expects everyone to do what he believes in. Fitness and aggression are few examples. Other than Rohit no one else has been able to succeed like Kohli following his own thing. Though the fitness culture and aggressiveness has helped the team more often than not but (especially unwanted aggressiveness) has failed the team when it was needed most. Failures in matches which mattered the most has mostly been a result of too much aggression, stubbornness, tactical mistakes and last but not the least being not being empathetic to his players when most needed.

Ashwin, Jadeja, Rahane and Pujara are the best examples of players who have not fulfilled their potential. They could never be all that they could have been because of the way team management handled them. Kohli's handling of these players had been pathetic to say the least. Rahane burst into the scene as a player who could soak in all the pressure and perform when needed the most. Some where down the line he was chucked out of the white ball teams, bought back again and then again got thrown out. He has now become someone who neither prospered as a white ball player and is reduced to a mediocre test batsman now. An average of below 40 in tests will be his legacy. Looks to be end of road for him and age isn't on his side. He may still make a comeback, but he still wont be able to achieve what he could have as a batsman.

Pujara was born to be a test batsman and Kohli somewhere confused aggressiveness with quick scoring. Pujara wasn't the same post that. There cannot be a better example of aggressive batting than the 50 odd runs Pujara scored taking all the blows on his body in Australia. Aggressiveness isn't all about slam bang all the time. Not taking a step back in face of hostility is equally aggressive. Ganguly never asked Dravid to bat like Sehwag else we would never have had "The Wall". Pujara is now half the batsman he was when he started and I don't see him finding his mojo back ever. He will be remembered as good test batsman. He had all the talent to be "Wall 2". Potential unfulfilled. As a white ball cricketer he always was a non starter but had the potential to one of top batsman in test cricket. Somewhere down the line the team management clouded his thought process so much that he became what he looks now a days on the pitch - a completely confused batsman.

Ashwin - He could have been the next great bowler at the top of heap along with Warne and Murali. Kohli's handling of one of his premier spin bowler be it in red ball or white ball cricket is downright heart breaking. This guy has all the skills and tools to reach 1000 international wickets but shame that he wont achieve half of what he could have. He would have missed more than 25% of total test matches and most matches abroad where only one spinner was used even though he was fit. He was dropped from white ball cricket in favor of wrist spinners. I would not have questioned this if we had something to show for in white ball cricket. All wrist spinners too are now out of favor, not a single piece of silverware with any of the teams he captained. The best that we had never played enough to become a great that he could have had just because of our captain's stubbornness. Look at his record in tests with whatever opportunities he had. He would mostly have overtaken Warne had he got all the opportunities abroad and would have been number 1 bowler as far as total number of international wickets are concerned had he not been chucked out of the white ball teams. He is still at the top of his game and I hope the new management treats him better and he can still achieve enough to be counted as a great.

Jadeja is another one who was meted a similar treatment but has been able to improve enough to be always in the mix. His skill set including being among the best fielders in the game is what has held him in good stead all through his international career. He too has missed quite some white ball cricket but at least in his case his exclusion helped him become the best that he could be. He mostly will end up as someone who achieved more than the sum of all his skills put together. For Jadeja it was his mental strength which helped him sail through the rough times.

Resourceful - Even with the best individuals he would find a way to lose when it mattered most. Most of the losses abroad in tests has been due to incorrect team selections or tactical mistakes. For someone who is mentally so strong not even winning a single piece of silverware in any form of white ball cricket is surprising. He has been unlucky as far as tosses are concerned but a lot of time it has been his stubbornness and not being receptive to accommodate changes even after failing are reason behind continuous failures to win something worth while.

Empathetic - Somehow he has not been able to strike the right balance. He has backed players who have gone on to do well and similarly has not been able to get the best out of quite many to name. The way he handled media has been downright dimwit. Ambati Rayudu being left in lurch is one fine example. Kuldeep and Chahal from being touted as the next superstars or his handling of Gabbar. Along with the 4 I already mentioned earlier Kohli's handling of individuals in some cases has really had a very negative effect on some of these players along with overall team culture. His relationship with Rohit who is another player in the same league as him is well documented. I believe that Kohli always had the best interests of Indian cricket in his heart and mind but is one of those greats who was never meant to be leader of men. He is brash, impulsive and still has a long way to go mature as a leader. I don't think he ever will be one. Remember he had Dhoni to guide him for quite a good part of his leadership tenure. At least in white ball cricket some of the achievements he had as a captain can be attributed to the support from Dhoni and Rohit.

Legacy - His legacy as a captain would be the culture of nurturing fast bowlers. At least he has given us a template as to how we can win on foreign soil in red ball cricket. Commitment towards fitness and the fighting spirit (single minded focus and belief to go for a win) that he brings on to the ground is equivalent of Nadal's bull headedness. Can't really think of another apt example. But he leaves behind a team which has one of the best bowling attacks (both skill and result wise) and group of supremely talented batsman playing at less than 50% of their capability. Somewhere he had a role to play where his most experienced lieutenants are pale shadows of their own old self and full of self doubts. The next generation though ear marked for greatness are just starting and we don't know how they would fare. Rohit would most probably take over but age not being on his side he may lead the team for couple of years in white ball cricket and may be 3-4 years in red ball cricket. Rohit somehow has found a second life in his test career and keen to prove his detractors that he is one of those who will fall short of greatness in red ball not because of lack of talent, temperament or skills but for things sometimes beyond his control.

Kohli inherited a team full of supremely talented individuals who just needed that little push to work together to become world beaters. The team proved it time and again but failed when it mattered all the times. He leaves behind a team who know how to beat and win anywhere but have picked up some traits which doesn't make a great team - Aggressiveness not through action but words, being cry babies when things are not going your way, not taking collective responsibility when chips are down ( we always have a scape goat when chips are down). A man with so much of commitment, focus and talent - but falling short of being a idol. His legacy as a great of the game will strengthen with time is what I expect. He will up his game by a couple of notches for sure and will again become the best for next 3-4 years. But his legacy as idol is questionable. How he supports the new captain as a player who has been an ex-captain and whether he chooses to become someone who kids can idolize will define his legacy as a great of the game when he hangs his bat in future.

I wish him all the best and hope that he achieves all that he can as the best in the world. But he will never be a great captain for me. He can though become a great leader of men if he chooses to in the next few years.
nibedk is offline   (8) Thanks
Old 15th January 2022, 21:49   #14891
BHPian
 
Join Date: Aug 2018
Location: Mumbai
Posts: 963
Thanked: 2,461 Times
Re: The Cricket Thread

We need Virat the batter more than the captain!

My Playing XI (Test Match) vs SL

R Sharma
KL Rahul
S Gill
V Kohli
S Iyer (C)
R Pant (wk)
R Jadeja
R Ashwin
A Patel
M Shami
J Bhumrah

BCCI should not shy away from handing over the captaincy to a newer player just like how SA did with G Smith.
VWAllstar is offline   (2) Thanks
Old 15th January 2022, 22:02   #14892
Distinguished - BHPian
 
AtheK's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2014
Location: Bangalore
Posts: 2,040
Thanked: 8,426 Times
Re: The Cricket Thread

Kohli team selection might be questionable, but his test captaincy wasn’t. Phenomenal captain, though used to go overboard sometimes, last test as captain he would want to forget both for the result and his behaviour.

Hope he gets back to scoring big as our batting looks fragile, no worthy replacement for captaincy in sight. I would like to go opposite to tide and how about making Jadeja the red ball captain, his place is sure, and he has always played with full commitment, Rahul is still not ready, forget captaincy, not even for opening.
AtheK is online now   (2) Thanks
Old 15th January 2022, 22:26   #14893
NPV
Distinguished - BHPian
 
NPV's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: Namma Bengaluru
Posts: 7,220
Thanked: 10,262 Times
Re: The Cricket Thread

Quote:
Originally Posted by VWAllstar View Post
BCCI should not shy away from handing over the captaincy to a newer player just like how SA did with G Smith.
All I can say is that it's wishful thinking - I don't see Shreyas being handed over captaincy when he doesn't find a place in the playing XI - not his fault but team management/selection committee doesn't have the courage to axe players who have repeatedly failed and are out of form.

We currently have a problem of plenty and this is the right time to harvest new, young talent waiting in the wings. It would be a shame if we lost Shreyas Iyer like Karun Nair

Last edited by NPV : 15th January 2022 at 22:27.
NPV is offline   (1) Thanks
Old 16th January 2022, 00:02   #14894
Senior - BHPian
 
Join Date: Jun 2015
Location: Chicagoland
Posts: 2,986
Thanked: 6,859 Times
Re: The Cricket Thread

I wish Shreyas Iyer or Shubman Gill is our new captain, but knowing BBCI, it'll mostly be Rohit Sharma. I hope VK can bat well now.

What I like under Virat Kohli is:
1. Fitness levels of BCCI contracted players has improved
2. We've got a good set of fast bowlers
3. India is not afraid of playing 5 bowlers (hardly ever remember that under MSD, Kumble, or Dravid)
landcruiser123 is offline  
Old 16th January 2022, 00:16   #14895
Distinguished - BHPian
 
ABHI_1512's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2020
Location: Calcutta
Posts: 943
Thanked: 11,172 Times
Re: The Cricket Thread

Quote:
Originally Posted by nibedk View Post
I wish him all the best and hope that he achieves all that he can as the best in the world. But he will never be a great captain for me. He can though become a great leader of men if he chooses to in the next few years.
Wonderful assessment nibedk, you have actually meticulously put out your thoughts. Although, I agree with most of what you have written, I will still say that Virat Kohli was a much better red ball Captain compared to the white ball.

Virat, much like Dhoni inherited a wonderful set of players. But it’s the handling of players where almost both of them faltered. Just as many senior and competent players were systematically sidelined/ juggled during Dhoni’s tenure, the same thing happened in Kohli’s tenure. Your assessment of Ashwin, Pujara and Rahane is spot on. I have mentioned the same about Pujara and Rahane in one of my previous posts in this thread.

But one thing I must say here, the captaincy issue was poorly handled by the board for sure and after Rohit was appointed the white ball Captain, there was no way left but to resign for Virat Kohli. It’s not a nice way to go for the premier batsman of the world.

Virat Kohli, in my book is even better batsman than Sachin Tendulkar and he will certainly go past all his records sooner or later. I consider him the greatest white ball player for India and that’s because of his ability to win matches for the team while batting second. For an identical reason almost, in test matches, I consider Rahul Dravid as the better batsman than Sachin because of his ability to score runs in the second innings and in difficult conditions. Most of the centuries that Sachin scored have been scored while batting first- be it one dayers or the tests.

I sincerely hope that Virat Kohli gets over this chapter and be the champion batsman that he is, again. He is an exceptional batsman and India needs him now more than ever. Wish him all the best, we should again start counting the number of centuries
ABHI_1512 is offline   (1) Thanks
Reply

Most Viewed


Copyright ©2000 - 2024, Team-BHP.com
Proudly powered by E2E Networks