Go Back   Team-BHP > Around the Corner > Shifting gears > Gadgets, Computers & Software


Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Old 18th August 2010, 00:26   #1321
BHPian
 
sourav9385's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: London, U.K
Posts: 430
Thanked: 718 Times
Default

^^ Thanks for the reply Thad .

I usually clean the indoor unit air filters once a week. Even though my apartment/locality is not at all dusty, I have read lots of posts in this thread that have suggested cleaning the filters regularly. Anyways, the AC isn't dripping water as of now, but it will receive a thorough checkup as of tomorrow. I sincerely hope nothing else is wrong.
sourav9385 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 18th August 2010, 01:30   #1322
Senior - BHPian
 
khoj's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: Dilli
Posts: 2,722
Thanked: 1,250 Times
Default

Refer to the link below for probable causes.

http://www.team-bhp.com/forum/1770962-post737.html


Quote:
Originally Posted by sourav9385 View Post
Hello all!

Back in April this year, I had purchased a Voltas Vertis Premium 1.5 Ton Split AC. So far it has been working without any faults or complaints. I had also got 2 free service coupons at the time of purchase. I used one of them last month.

Just a few moments ago, the indoor unit started spewing water from the vent. I got scared and immediately turned off the AC and pulled out the plug. Got in touch with Customer Care and reported this issue. They said it will be looked into by tomorrow morning.

Now, is there something wrong with the AC? Some kind of a blockage or drainage issue?
I don't know much about AC's in general. I tried reading through this thread but couldn't find anything particular like this.

Can someone please shed some light on this issue?

Thanks in advance
khoj is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 28th August 2010, 11:35   #1323
Senior - BHPian
 
frankmehta's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: Mumbai
Posts: 3,865
Thanked: 2,221 Times
Default

Daikin Inverter Split AC's.

AC's installed:
2 * 1.5 tons
1 * 2.2 tons
1 * 0.8 tons


We wired the AC's on Thursday evening and actually started using them yesterday.
Had the Ac's on for over 12 hours yesterday.
Have NO words to describe the silence with which they operate. They have ZERO noise in the room. Seriously. Daikins are known to be silent, but I never knew AC's can be so efficient at cutting decibels. It's pretty hard to believe. OF SPECIAL NOTE is the fact that outdoor units are SO silent that you wouldn't even know that they are on. Really!! Hard to believe that Daikin over-engineered their ACs that even their outdoor units (for whom it's ok to be little noisy, since they are actually outside) to be SO silent. Wish I had a Decibel meter to measure the noise they produce. Really commendable.
About their cooling. I have 2 words: Monster. And Monster!!

The speed with which it cools the room IS COMMENDABLE. It's powerful mode takes 2 - 3 minutes to cool a 150 sq ft room and make it pretty chilled within 5 minutes.
Super efficacy, VERY VERY fast. The sensor in the AC senses the no. of people in the room and adjust the vane angles of the up-down and side-side louvers (both of which are power operated and operate in tandem to give a 3D airflow) to point the flow where the people are. It works. The sensor also senses the no. of people in the room and ups the airconditioning if there are more people. Leave the room and when you come back you sense a slight drop in the cooling, since it drops the cooling when it senses that no one is inside. Good energy saving technique, but not helpful when you expect a CHILLED room when you come back. For that you can always keep the sensor off when you leave the room. Then it will operate at full potential and keep the room as chilled as you want it to be, but at the cost of power savings.

Also, a characteristic about Inverter ACs. The compressor NEVER cuts off. It just varies it's speed according the amount of cooling required. Hence, there are times when a 2.2 ton AC will operate EVEN AT 0.8 ton load if the sensor detects that no one is in the room, or cooling has been established. This ALWAYS ON nature of the compressor might lead someone to think it consumes more power, but in reality, it does consume considerably less power than conventional AC's that either operate at 2.2 ton load or just operate in fan only mode once cooling is established. Also, the amount of current drawn is considerably reduced, since the compressor cut-off and switch-on regime of conventional ac's is not present. So is the reduction of load and stress on electrical components which is a large factor when the compressor turns on and pulls a huge amount of current. This, in turn, reduces stress and increases life of components.
It's a win-win situation, Inverter ACs. Just the upfront cost is a little exorbitant. But factor in power savings and lesser maintenance cost due to less wear and tear of components due to absence of the stop-start cycles and it all starts making sense.
I am happy with the Daikin Inverter AC's and recommend them to everyone who wants to spend upfront but makes savings over the years.
Let's say I give them a 5* rating and thank everyone who suggested them to me. Really good decision made.
frankmehta is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 29th August 2010, 21:53   #1324
BHPian
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: Pune
Posts: 135
Thanked: 182 Times
Default 4 bedrooms ac

Hi All,

I need to buy 4 ACs for a new service apartment we are starting up. We have two MSEB meters installed.

What configuration would be best from long term point of view?
1. One split ac (inverter) for each bedroom (1.5 ton each)
Welcome to Daikin India
2. A single outside compressor powering 4 inside units (maybe 5 tons)
:: Welcome to the OGENERAL AIR CONDITIONERS :::
3. Single compressor supporting two indoor units. Will need to buy 2 such units.
Atom Square : Hitachi Home & Life Solutions (India) Ltd.

Rather than initial cost, my worry is more about electricity consumption.
abeerbagul is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 30th August 2010, 09:54   #1325
Distinguished - BHPian
 
sgiitk's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: Kanpur
Posts: 7,082
Thanked: 3,640 Times
Default

Multiunit systems tend to be costlier then individual systems. Also, the warranty is one year and not five!
sgiitk is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 30th August 2010, 10:13   #1326
Senior - BHPian
 
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: New Delhi
Posts: 3,079
Thanked: 251 Times
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by abeerbagul View Post
....
Rather than initial cost, my worry is more about electricity consumption.
I would worry more about the single outdoor unit developing a fault and rendering all the rooms useless!
And, it could happen during peak season!
anupmathur is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 30th August 2010, 10:37   #1327
Awaiting Email Confirmation
 
Join Date: Feb 2009
Location: Bangalore
Posts: 31
Thanked: 0 Times
Default

Anyone bought or knows better about the portable 1 Ton AC from Croma. Its comes with 1 year warranty and 5 years on the compressor. Cost 17990.

12000 BTU.
BaldOwl is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 30th August 2010, 12:15   #1328
Senior - BHPian
 
khoj's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: Dilli
Posts: 2,722
Thanked: 1,250 Times
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by anupmathur View Post
I would worry more about the single outdoor unit developing a fault and rendering all the rooms useless!
And, it could happen during peak season!
^^ +1 Mathurji, you took the words right out of my mouth.


Quote:
Originally Posted by abeerbagul View Post
Hi All,

1. One split ac (inverter) for each bedroom (1.5 ton each)
Welcome to Daikin India
2. A single outside compressor powering 4 inside units (maybe 5 tons)
:: Welcome to the OGENERAL AIR CONDITIONERS :::
3. Single compressor supporting two indoor units. Will need to buy 2 such units.
Atom Square : Hitachi Home & Life Solutions (India) Ltd.
The units shown on the link are more for residential usage.There would be a restriction on the cumulative pipe length that can be installed from the IDUs to the compressor.

Further for such a set up in commercial applications (which see usage heavier than residential applications) it is better to have at least a scroll type compressor rather than the rotary or reciprocatory to handle multiple 18000+ btu (1.5 tons) units. You get more reliability, efficiency, better electronics on the control module and the piping flexibility increases. The same companies do offer commercial systems too with single ODU & multiple IDUs and the starting price points are only slightly higher than the unit on the link.
khoj is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 30th August 2010, 12:33   #1329
Senior - BHPian
 
Join Date: Aug 2010
Location: Delhi
Posts: 2,105
Thanked: 983 Times
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by abeerbagul View Post
Hi All,

I need to buy 4 ACs for a new service apartment we are starting up. We have two MSEB meters installed.

What configuration would be best from long term point of view?
1. One split ac (inverter) for each bedroom (1.5 ton each)
Welcome to Daikin India
2. A single outside compressor powering 4 inside units (maybe 5 tons)
:: Welcome to the OGENERAL AIR CONDITIONERS :::
3. Single compressor supporting two indoor units. Will need to buy 2 such units.
Atom Square : Hitachi Home & Life Solutions (India) Ltd.

Rather than initial cost, my worry is more about electricity consumption.
From commercial point of view commercial AC will always score over a domestic unit. Single high efficiency VRF out door unit with, 4x1.5 indoor units is an expensive proposition. These units are always dealt with by a different set of persons. In my experience the charges for each indoor unit is at par with cheaper split AC, apart from the out door unit. Further High Tech AC will have expensive controllers and thicker gauge piping.

I had once thought of getting a 6 indoor unit VRF system and was quoted between 3 and 4 lacs. A comparable normal unit would have cost me at the most 6 x 45k = 2.7 lacs. (For Diakin or Panasonic units) and at the rock bottom 6 x 20k = 1.2 lac for lower cost brand.

The upside is that these are designed for commercial loads, maintained much better than domestic AC and have longer life with lower running costs.

VRF units as discussed in previous posts will give more comfort while tailoring the cooling to the requirements. In general VRF units operate efficiently down to 15-10% of the rated capacity. Hence a 8 ton unit would consume only one ton if the situation so demands!
Aroy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 30th August 2010, 17:16   #1330
BHPian
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: Pune
Posts: 135
Thanked: 182 Times
Default

Thanks a lot for the help.

So there are two better choices
1. Scroll type compressor
2. V.R.F unit.

Need to decide between the pros and cons of each. I gather that both these choices will be better in the long run even if compared to 4 individual inverter split ACs.
abeerbagul is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 30th August 2010, 17:49   #1331
Senior - BHPian
 
Join Date: Aug 2010
Location: Delhi
Posts: 2,105
Thanked: 983 Times
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by abeerbagul View Post
Thanks a lot for the help.

So there are two better choices
1. Scroll type compressor
2. V.R.F unit.

Need to decide between the pros and cons of each. I gather that both these choices will be better in the long run even if compared to 4 individual inverter split ACs.
Sorry for the confusion.

VRF is the type of operation - Variable Refrigerant Flow, that is the compressor delivers variable quantum of refrigerant (hence cooling) into the system

Scroll is the type of compressor. It is the latest to enter the medium size sector and offers better economy compared to the other rotary technology.

I am attaching a link to the Hitachi VRF syste. Set Free R41OA : Hitachi Home & Life Solutions (India)Ltd.

You can go to the sites of other manufacturers - Voltas, General, Panasonic amongst others and get similar data. What I would suggest that once you have short listed two or three manufacturers, set up an appointment with them, and have a round of talk. Let them offer a solution they think will best serve you. Please note that in my experience you have to increase the capacity arrived at by them by at least 50% if you want excellent cooling in the peak of summer. This holds true if there are more than four or five persons in a room. As thumb rule add one ton extra for every 4/5 persons.

One advantage of a VRF system is that if there are say, 20 persons in one room and none in the others all the cooling is concentrated in that room and not in the others.
Aroy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 30th August 2010, 19:38   #1332
Senior - BHPian
 
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: New Delhi
Posts: 3,079
Thanked: 251 Times
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Aroy View Post
....
One advantage of a VRF system is that if there are say, 20 persons in one room and none in the others all the cooling is concentrated in that room and not in the others.
This seems to be factually incorrect!
Each IDU has a maximum capacity that it can handle; it cannot take all the refrigerant that the common compressor can supply.
VRF is a capacity control built into the compressor to enable it to consume less power when the load is low.
anupmathur is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 30th August 2010, 21:46   #1333
Distinguished - BHPian
 
Thad E Ginathom's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: Chennai
Posts: 7,692
Thanked: 6,863 Times
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Aroy View Post
I am attaching a link to the Hitachi VRF syste. Set Free R41OA : Hitachi Home & Life Solutions (India)Ltd.
It's interesting to see the brochure (downloadable from that page) for a pro system and how works. It all feeds my when I get my mansion daydreams

It's also interesting to read the not-quite-English that it is written in, although the hilarity wears off after the first page.
Quote:
Poetic Residence

We awe the living environment, and never do harm to the fresh air and warm breeze. What we do is to balance chilliness and fervidity and offer you a poetic territory mediated with technology

.

Last edited by Thad E Ginathom : 30th August 2010 at 21:49.
Thad E Ginathom is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 30th August 2010, 22:21   #1334
BHPian
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: Pune
Posts: 135
Thanked: 182 Times
Default

Called up the Daikin dealer in Kothrud, have sent him the architectural drawings of the bunglow by email. He will send a quotation on email. Incidentally he is the dealer for Hitachi also, so asked him to send product details of both brands.

He said the Daikin VRV system will cost approx 6 lacs to support 4 indoor units of 1.5 ton each, he was suggesting that I buy 4 split acs instead.

But will get the final details from him in a couple of days. Will share the quotation here so that anyone else coming later will get a rough idea. Anyways, price of tech decreases in the future.

Again, thanks all for the awesome suggestions.
abeerbagul is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 31st August 2010, 09:59   #1335
Senior - BHPian
 
Join Date: Aug 2010
Location: Delhi
Posts: 2,105
Thanked: 983 Times
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by anupmathur View Post
This seems to be factually incorrect!
Each IDU has a maximum capacity that it can handle; it cannot take all the refrigerant that the common compressor can supply.
VRF is a capacity control built into the compressor to enable it to consume less power when the load is low.
OK Let explain,

http://www.hitachi-hli.com/pdfs/Hitachi-PDF/setfree.pdf describes the system.

The out door unit has 10 tons capacity.
The Indoor units for 3 rooms are 1.5 tons each
The Indoor units for drawing room are 3 x 3 tons

So you have 3x1.5 + 3x3 = 13.5 tons capacity for the indoor units while the out door is only 10.

When you have 3, 1.5 ton units going full blast the drawing room has capacity for 5.5 tons only. But if you want the full 9 tons you have only 1 1.5 ton unit working at lower capacity (page 7 of the pdf). The Hitachi Engineer confirmed it.

Secondly the VRF unit can cool efficiently down to 10% of its capacity. So even 1 1.5 unit can be used with the 10 ton unit efficiently. Of course if you normally use less capacity you are incurring unnecessary capital costs.

In fact when I started investigating the concept, I always thought that a chilled water system with Vapour Absorption Chiller (especially as I could use heat and not electricity for cooling) would be ideal for a large home set up (15-20 tons), but VRF concept change my perception.
Aroy is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply


Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Automotive air conditioner servicing & maintenance vebmetal Technical Stuff 163 11th September 2017 19:10
Fitting an Air-conditioner in the Maruti 800 navdeep Technical Stuff 95 24th March 2012 17:07
Correct refrigerant level of a automobile air conditioner Sang Technical Stuff 6 15th May 2009 10:26
Best ROOM Air conditioner Max Shifting gears 2 3rd April 2006 09:52


All times are GMT +5.5. The time now is 05:34.

Copyright 2000 - 2017, Team-BHP.com
Proudly powered by E2E Networks