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Old 27th January 2012, 14:29   #2776
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Default re: Honda Civic : Maintenance, Service Costs and Must dos

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Originally Posted by sandeep108 View Post
No, normal mode. I am fine with these points.
Yeah, I get those numbers in S mode using paddles, where the tranny can be shifted. In normal mode it will probably shift a little later, taking advantage of the torque curve. Your 3-4 and 4-5 numbers are same as what I experience.

My car is Mar 07, so it does not display gear numbers in D mode. I think that feature was added later in 07 or in 08 models.

Last edited by dot : 27th January 2012 at 14:31.
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Old 27th January 2012, 14:51   #2777
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Default re: Honda Civic : Maintenance, Service Costs and Must dos

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No, normal mode. I am fine with these points. Remember there is also some speedo error. 16 kmph actually feels more like 12-13 to me. 2nd to 3rd could be around 26 kmph also, not too sure/remember.
In tune with what my GPS tells me. Starting at about 3kph it rises to 5 kph at about 100kph. Not very surprising since may countries allow something like +0 -5% on the calibration.
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Old 27th January 2012, 15:05   #2778
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Default re: Honda Civic : Maintenance, Service Costs and Must dos

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Originally Posted by sgiitk View Post
In tune with what my GPS tells me. Starting at about 3kph it rises to 5 kph at about 100kph. Not very surprising since may countries allow something like +0 -5% on the calibration.
I get a feeling that speedo error has very little to do with shift change. The TCU is using the speedo and RPM (among other parameters) to make its calculations, it will hardly uplink with a satellite feed
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Old 27th January 2012, 15:18   #2779
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Default re: Honda Civic : Maintenance, Service Costs and Must dos

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I get a feeling that speedo error has very little to do with shift change. The TCU is using the speedo and RPM (among other parameters) to make its calculations, it will hardly uplink with a satellite feed
Speedo error should not matter. One major parameter is the throttle (accelerator) position. If you stamp on it you can easily get one or two (even three) downshifts.

To improve consumption I often ease on the pedal momentarily to get an additional shift and then drive gently. Is the same on my Santro as well.
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Old 27th January 2012, 15:23   #2780
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Thats the engine bay treatment job. They clean up / polish the components in the engine bay. If you check, the bay should be all shiny now.
And I was thinking that they do it at every service. Anyways is it actually required? The SA said that they have put some sprays on the electrical points and sensors.

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Considering Pune traffic it is a bit low. Lets meet sometime and see why your car is giving so low FE.
This is actually irritating and I was actually thinking about resetting the ECU and head over to E-Way / Lavasa and give it the good 'ol Italian Tune-up.

I stay at Wakdewadi (And see a TBHP stickered Silver Laura in my Society) and in fact I hardly go into the thick traffic areas apart from getting stuck at Shoppers' Stop(shivajinagar) traffic Jam 1-2 times a week. The rest is smooth running in 'relatively' sparse traffic. Most drives are either to Pimpri(Old Mumbai Highway) / Khadkee / Viman-Nagar(Sangamwadi Road) so its not as congested as say Satara / JM / FC road. Anyways, I am PMing you my no. Please do have a look.

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Originally Posted by sandeep108 View Post
There is something wrong with your shift points. My upshift points are:
1st - 2nd - 16 kmph
2nd - 3rd - 30 kmph (maybe 28 kmph)
3rd to 4th - 40 kmph
4th to 5th - 55 kmph

Rest is fine. In city you are getting 7.5+ which is fine. Highway should be higher, about 13-14 at least. If I hypermile, my RPM shows about 1,700 at around 85-90 kmph, which is very good. Check your tires - changing from the OEM bridgestones (they were slipping like crazy and ABS kept kicking in on the slightest of hard braking) gave me instant +10% better FE.

AT fluid must be changed every 2 years in our conditions.
I need to reconfirm the shift points now(at feather light foot on throttle I suppose). But I am 95% sure that 66 is where it shifts to 5th. If indeed the shift points are wrong, can something be done to rectify it?

Actually the FE used to be higher prior to the service (8.7ish), hence the irritation. What tyres do you use? Though the tires have enough tread as of now so they won't be going out very soon.

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antz.bin your car has an AT? Missed that.
Yeah, in that case the upshift point from 4th to 5th is way too high.
I think so too. It takes an awful lot of time before it shifts to 5th and in case I am doing 60-65 due to ambient traffic (on old highway), I end up driving in 4th all the time. I guess that is definitely hurting the FE.
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Old 27th January 2012, 15:52   #2781
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Default re: Honda Civic : Maintenance, Service Costs and Must dos

Do not forget the very tall gearing on fifth. Adds up to 50 kph/1000rpm! So you will have a high upshift point into fifth.

Last edited by sgiitk : 27th January 2012 at 15:53.
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Old 28th January 2012, 11:01   #2782
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Post re: Honda Civic : Maintenance, Service Costs and Must dos

Here are the gear-ratios on the AT (courtesy Overdrive mag in 2006)

Gear - kmph/1,000rpm
1 - 9.89
2 - 17.19
3 - 25.82
4 - 36.63
5 - 50.34

So it is approx. 2,000 rpm at a steady 100 kmph in 5th gear on the AT (as sgiitk has said).

(I have these on a spreadsheet and can work out different combinations quickly).

Last edited by manim : 28th January 2012 at 11:04.
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Old 28th January 2012, 14:49   #2783
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Default re: Honda Civic : Maintenance, Service Costs and Must dos

So I checked it up today morning. It definitely doesn't stay in 5th @ 55kmph. Whatever I did, It refused to upshift before 65. Then I eased off the throttle momentarily just to see at what speed it downshifts. The downshifts were happening at 59. Not even sport mode helped me get to 5th @55kmph. I am not trying to hypermile all the time but when cruising on a city road, The transmission should ideally shift to top gear if there is no acceleration involved.

Last edited by antz.bin : 28th January 2012 at 14:55. Reason: typo
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Old 28th January 2012, 18:18   #2784
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Default re: Honda Civic : Maintenance, Service Costs and Must dos

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Originally Posted by antz.bin View Post
So I checked it up today morning. It definitely doesn't stay in 5th @ 55kmph. Whatever I did, It refused to upshift before 65.
In that case it is possible that the TCU needs to be reset. This might also explain the less than optimum FE. Best option would to be visit Deccan Honda and let them handle it.
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Old 28th January 2012, 19:02   #2785
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In that case it is possible that the TCU needs to be reset. This might also explain the less than optimum FE. Best option would to be visit Deccan Honda and let them handle it.
I tried searching for it on the international forums. What I got was there is no TCU on the 8th gen Honda Civic.

Can Resetting the ECU help me with that? Since I was under the impression that it is the ECU that controls the shifts.(I assumed it ) I am asking this since I can very well do it at home tonight itself and post a report ASAP if it helps in the correct shift points coming back.
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Old 28th January 2012, 19:16   #2786
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Default re: Honda Civic : Maintenance, Service Costs and Must dos

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Originally Posted by antz.bin View Post
I tried searching for it on the international forums. What I got was there is no TCU on the 8th gen Honda Civic.

Can Resetting the ECU help me with that? Since I was under the impression that it is the ECU that controls the shifts.(I assumed it ) I am asking this since I can very well do it at home tonight itself and post a report ASAP if it helps in the correct shift points coming back.
Try this -

Get into your car, shut the door etc, and turn the key full on to the point just before it cranks.

Press the accelerator fully to the floor and hold it there for 30 seconds.

After that don't touch the key, or door or anything but sit and wait for 2 minutes.

Then start the car and drive off. You should notice a difference in the way the throttle and transmission behave.
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Old 28th January 2012, 19:22   #2787
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Default re: Honda Civic : Maintenance, Service Costs and Must dos

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Originally Posted by akshay1234 View Post
Try this -

Get into your car, shut the door etc, and turn the key full on to the point just before it cranks.

Press the accelerator fully to the floor and hold it there for 30 seconds.

After that don't touch the key, or door or anything but sit and wait for 2 minutes.

Then start the car and drive off. You should notice a difference in the way the throttle and transmission behave.
Is that a cheat code to reset the learnt behaviour?
I am amazed at the ways these engineers design their products
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Old 28th January 2012, 20:09   #2788
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Is that a cheat code to reset the learnt behaviour?
I am amazed at the ways these engineers design their products
It apparently resets the full drive by wire system, and also the adaptive transmission memory. I did it on my cars and did find the car to be more responsive and the shifts a bit smoother. Its completely safe so any A/T owner can try this.

Basically the transmission adapts itself to a user, and his way of driving and also the driving conditions. This is a way to reset that back to the default setting and let the transmission start learning again.
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Old 28th January 2012, 21:05   #2789
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Default re: Honda Civic : Maintenance, Service Costs and Must dos

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I tried searching for it on the international forums. What I got was there is no TCU on the 8th gen Honda Civic.

Can Resetting the ECU help me with that?
Apparently the TCU is embedded in the ECU. So do try what Akshay1234 just suggested ( I will try it too!) and if that does not work, one can reset the ECU by taking off both the terminals of the battery for 5-10 mins. Then restart and let the car idle for 5-10 mins. Hope it will solve the issue.

Last edited by dot : 28th January 2012 at 21:28.
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Old 28th January 2012, 22:35   #2790
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Default re: Honda Civic : Maintenance, Service Costs and Must dos

Thanks Akshay! you are a sweetheart!! It worked

I did exactly as told immediately after I read the post. First the RPM was raised to 13xx RPM. I could see the RPM fluctuating, so it wasn't like the steady 1200 RPM like it happens in the morning when the car warms up. So I let it idle for a minute and a half till it settled down to somewhere around 850 RPM. I felt I should have idled it more but I left fast since I was in a hurry.

Anyways, long story short, the car now requires me to feed less throttle for it to jump forward. Couldn't check the shift points due to traffic but I did see some improvement. Will check and report. Thanks a lot guys .
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