[maven]

So, pardon my ignorance, the Compass isn’t a *true* 4x4 but it’s the electronics that are imitating the off-road “behaviour”?

[arun_josie]

Here is the brochure of Trailhawk,

[Arjun Reddy]

So the sunroof is now an option. Wonder how much FCA will charge for this ? Why not option out the other missing features like powered seats, auto headlamps and wipers?

Question for the experts, why have a hill start assist on a torque converter? In my experience have never rolled back in a torque converter, be it my I10 grand or the C250D.

[SS-Traveller]

Originally Posted by maven

So, pardon my ignorance, the Compass isn’t a *true* 4x4 but it’s the electronics that are imitating the off-road “behaviour”?

Not sure what you mean by a *true* 4x4, but yes, the Trailhawk does drive all four wheels using an on-demand four-wheel-drive system. Read more about the technology involved in this thread (Driving all four wheels: how is it done?).

[McLaren Rulez]

Originally Posted by SS-Traveller

Jeep insists that it has a low range, which is simply untrue from an engineering standpoint.

Pardon the naive question but why is a very short first gear available not equivalent to having a low range gearbox?

[SS-Traveller]

Originally Posted by McLaren Rulez

...why is a very short first gear available not equivalent to having a low range gearbox?

Because a separate low range gearbox can provide a far greater reduction ratio than a very short first gear can accommodate in the main gearbox, mainly due to space and size constraints.

Let us assume, the reduction ratio of the first gear in a conventional 'box is 3.8:1. Design in a very short first gear, and we can perhaps achieve 5:1.

OTOH, a separate low range gearbox can reduce at, say, 2.5:1. So, effectively, the conventional main gearbox (manual or automatic, doesn't matter) will have an effective reduction ratio of 3.8×2.5, i.e. 9.5:1 between the crankshaft and the driveshaft, when slotted into 1st gear with low range engaged.

[4x4addict]

Originally Posted by Blooming Flower

Hence, the Duster AWD wins in terms of more off road capable gearbox than Trailhawk.

Having owned a 4WD Duster, I can tell you that with the right tyres it is fairly capable. The Compass has a more powerful engine and 9-Speed ZF Automatic as opposed to the 1.5 and the manual transmission in the Duster AWD. However the 2nd row of the Duster is must more spacious and comfortable that the Compass. The Compass is about 10 lakhs more than the Duster. So, if you are okay with manual gearbox and want to save 10 lakhs, better to go with the Duster. But like me, if you want Automatic & Diesel with AWD, then Compass Trailhawk is the cheapest vehicle that I can buy new.

Originally Posted by Samurai

Well, I had a CJ340 whose crawl ratio was 3.986 * 2.460 * 5.380 = 52.754, does it make a better offroader than all other options? Not really. And not merely because of available torque.

Basically a 4WD Softroader only can offer locking of rear clutch pack, Traction Control and ESP. These are available in both the Duster and the Trailhawk. The so called modes are pure marketing gimmick that plays around with the TC and ESP systems.

[Samurai]

Originally Posted by 4x4addict

Having owned a 4WD Duster, I can tell you that with the right tyres it is fairly capable.

Exactly, if you look at our Duster review, you will see the following:

The Duster AWD can crawl grassy, wet mild slopes all day long without a hiccup. Though we didn't test the performance on long climbs, Tejas was sure that the Duster has enough grunt for these runs, especially with the Traction Control system lending a helping hand when needed. The 'Hill Start' feature can prove useful if you stop midway and need to resume the climb.

Moderator Tsk1979 recently spent several days with the Dacia Duster AWD in Iceland (related post (Renault Duster AWD launched at Rs. 11.89 lakh (pg. 15))). After crossing thousands of snowy kilometers, 3 rivers and 5 major water crossings, in his opinion, the Duster beats the Safari 4x4 (which he owns) and the Scorpio 4x4 on ice, snow and slush.

And Duster has 245 Nm max torque, and Trailhawk has 350 Nm. They both have similar crawl ratio. So you do the math. I don't mind marketing gimmicks when they actually work.

[Sutripta]

A TC Auto by design multiplies torque at high slippage.

Biggest problem with crawler firsts is no corresponding crawler reverse. IMHO if that could be accommodated a nine speed GB can do without a separate low range gearbox.

And I feel at some stage electrical drive (surge power) to two wheels, mechanical drive to two wheels and we'll have a whole new debate on 4x4s. And low end torque. And turbo lag. And starting on a grade.

The Duster AWD is extremely capable. With some glaring shortcomings not related to it's drivetrain. Depends on what is important to one.

Regards
Sutripta

[nazeer_ahamed]

I was talking to a Jeep sales executive on phone and later on he sent me few videos of the off road capabilities of Trail Hawk by Whatsapp. During the conversation, he was saying that the Trail Hawk is better than Mahindra Thar in off roading.

I had doubts on this and asked him, "If Jeep Compass Trail Hawk has a separate low range gear box?

His reply was "YES, but it comes in Button not with gear levers"!

I have enclosed the screenshot of the chat in Whatsapp.

To the best of my best of my knowledge, the trail hawk has a nine speed gear box and engaging 4WD Low locks the gear box in first gear and does not have a separate low range gear box.

Can the seniors shed some light on this.

Are the Jeep executives told to market Trail Hawk like this or is it the executive's lack of knowledge?

[Samurai]

Originally Posted by nazeer_ahamed

To the best of my best of my knowledge, the trail hawk has a nine speed gear box and engaging 4WD Low locks the gear box in first gear and does not have a separate low range gear box.

This is correct. Many sales guys don't have enough technical knowledge.

[sridhar-v]

A gear reduction ratio is a gear reduction ratio.
But, speaking for a design engineer's viewpoint, having a separate transfer case with a 2 speed ratio has one major advantage :- rigidity of construction. As a consequence life over highly stressed duty cycles will be better.

I have had the Grand Vitara, with its separate low speed system, for four years and 20k Kms. As I got the hang of off-roading, and got myself proper tyres, I have stopped even using the central diff lock.

In these 4 years I must have used 4Low-Lock possibly 5 to 6 times. For a total distance of about 4 kms and about 3 hours of driving.

[yd_gli]

I just don't see the point in launching a Compass Trailhawk version.

The West might have better use of such vehicles given the snow/slush and offroad access to camp sites etc but what use would this vehicle be of in India at more than 30lakhs OTR? The few who need it would be better off getting a Thar/Gurkha given the ease of maintenance in remote areas and low cost. Couldn't they have simply imported 2500 of these under the new government exemption and be done with it?

Someone paying 35lakhs for one of these wouldn't mind shelling out a few extra to account for additional CBU taxes. On the other hand, a conventional 6- 7 speed TC unit on their diesel lineup would've satisfied the market just fine.

Maybe Jeep should focus their efforts on expanding and localizing their portfolio (Renegade, Wrangler) instead of adding models to the Compass line.

[streetfighter]

Originally Posted by yd_gli

Maybe Jeep should focus their efforts on expanding and localizing their portfolio (Renegade, Wrangler) instead of adding models to the Compass line.

I feel the Jeep Compass is going the Renault Duster way. The initial success has got into their head and they are not able to see anything beyond Compass (same with Renault, they are still holding on to the antique Duster).

Maybe Jeep has export ideas on Trailhawk, hence the production and launch. But it is high time Jeep should bring in other products to stay afloat in the Indian market. With Harrier hitting them hard, and Hector/Seltos waiting for their pound of flesh, the going for Jeep is very very tough from now on.

[Moto$apien]

Looking good, but for the price. Sharing some Marketing Details.









Ideally, FCA should also share a travel itenerary booklet

"Where Only Jeep Can Go" for novices who would like to venture out to off-beat, off-road locations in India where they can truly test Trailhawk's potential!