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Old 25th July 2018, 08:15   #4951
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After switching to synthetic oil in a 1.45L run vehicle, that too after using a flush, even I can hear slight tappet noise, especially because the engine is so silent now. My car manual says to monitor and adjust tappets every 15k kms but it has never been done. But I haven't faced any issues as loss of excessive oil or white smoke so I feel that this move has been successful. We'll see if that's true once the car has run 10k kms on synthetic oil and I have had the tappets adjusted.
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Old 25th July 2018, 09:57   #4952
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Default Re: ARTICLE: Synthetic oil vs Mineral oil

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Originally Posted by Vikram Arya View Post
Additionally, if you notice the specification for the Shell Helix Ultra is API SN/CF which is primarily designed for gasoline engines. I canít think of a single diesel engine that will make do with an API CF spec.
Which is why I always advise diesel car owners to use diesel oils not just pick the first synthetic they see and use it. Most light duty oils are designed for petrol engines.

India is an outlier in the sense we have this love for diesels, only because it's cheaper, while this fuel is fast fading in EU and really quite didn't take off in North America except for heavy haulage and earth moving vehicles. I'm a petrol head and will almost always choose a similarly specced petrol engine over a diesel.

Diesel car owners must use a diesel specific oil with more contemporary API specs. API CF, which most petrol engine oils are, is redundant. In fact CF is not recommended for diesel engines manufactured after 2009.API Diesel oil categories

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it is not advisable to use a synthetic formulation in an engine that has been using a conventional oil for almost first half of its useful life
+1

I don't recommend synthetics for any high mileage engine. For e.g. my Palio 1.6 has done a bit over 55K. That car, which requires xW-40 is never going to get a synthetic and runs exclusively on Shell Helix HX7 a semi-synthetic 10W-40 blend at best. Either that or mineral 15W-40. And yeah, I advise staying far away from engine flushes when shifting to synthetic from mineral or vice versa.

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Please stick to that as they know whatís best for their engine.
Absolutely!

If for a particular ambient temperature range the manual specifies xW-30 API SL or higher then use only those oils. If the manual says xW-40 API CH4 or higher then only use oils meeting that spec.

In a nutshell - I err on the side of caution when it comes to engine oils, coolants and brake fluid. I don't advise experimenting with these critical fluids.
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Old 25th July 2018, 12:39   #4953
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Default Re: ARTICLE: Synthetic oil vs Mineral oil

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Originally Posted by Turrrb0 View Post
I feel 4k is a little steep. I was planning on using the Motul 4100 Power 5w30.
https://www.amazon.in/dp/B01LYGFOIV/...v_ov_lig_dp_it
it's recommended on other forums as well. What do you say?
The rates are way too high for ALL these oils. Last time I filled 5W-30 STP Syn synthetic oil and it cost me around Rs 2800 for 3.78 lit and I felt the engine noise actually increased from the 0W-20 synthetic filled at Honda. Also there was some wasted oil which is just lying around at my home.

And Honda charges around Rs 1400+ tax for 0W-20 full synthetic so it just seems to be a waste of money when you can change oil more than twice in the same cost! (considering the so called 'premium' synthetic oils in ~3000 range)

Last edited by mxh : 25th July 2018 at 12:43.
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Old 25th July 2018, 14:21   #4954
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Originally Posted by R2D2 View Post
I don't recommend synthetics for any high mileage engine. For e.g. my Palio 1.6 has done a bit over 55K. That car, which requires xW-40 is never going to get a synthetic and runs exclusively on Shell Helix HX7 a semi-synthetic 10W-40 blend at best. Either that or mineral 15W-40. And yeah, I advise staying far away from engine flushes when shifting to synthetic from mineral or vice versa.
Do you say this because of any anecdotal evidence or experience. Like I have said above, I have, both, used a flush and switched to synthetic on a 1.45L run Palio and I am yet to see signs of any issues over the 3.5k kms I have run it after that.
Are the issues going to arise later, maybe after 10-15k on synthetic oil.
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Old 25th July 2018, 16:45   #4955
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Default Re: ARTICLE: Synthetic oil vs Mineral oil

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Originally Posted by rdst_1 View Post
Do you say this because of any anecdotal evidence or experience. Like I have said above, I have, both, used a flush and switched to synthetic on a 1.45L run Palio and I am yet to see signs of any issues over the 3.5k kms I have run it after that. Are the issues going to arise later, maybe after 10-15k on synthetic oil.
This is out of experience with the family's 5 year old 1995 Maruti Esteem in which I had used a STP flush and then refilled with Castrol GTX Magnatec 15W-40, one of the best oils available in those days. The engine wasn't too pleased and did sound rougher than normal. After that I have stayed away from these products and will prefer to change engine oil more frequently and/or use better quality lube.

As for my Palio 1.6, if there is gunk accumulated, I'd rather fill in inexpensive Shell HX5 15W-40 and change it every 500 km till the engine is clean instead of using a flush. The car @ 50K odd kms hasn't done as much running as your vehicle. Plus Fiat Palio engine (and body parts) are notoriously hard to source. Something goes wrong and I am stuck. As I said earlier I always err on the side of caution with engine oils and other fluids.

But now, let me ask you a question. Why did you use a flush and move to synthetic after running that engine (is it a 1.2 or 1.6?) for lakhs of kms I assume on mineral oil? That motor is probably past its prime. Did you find evidence of sludge accumulation? As for detrimental effects well, I guess time will tell.
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Old 25th July 2018, 16:45   #4956
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Default Re: ARTICLE: Synthetic oil vs Mineral oil

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Originally Posted by mxh View Post
The rates are way too high for ALL these oils. Last time I filled 5W-30 STP Syn synthetic oil and it cost me around Rs 2800 for 3.78 lit and I felt the engine noise actually increased from the 0W-20 synthetic filled at Honda. Also there was some wasted oil which is just lying around at my home.

And Honda charges around Rs 1400+ tax for 0W-20 full synthetic so it just seems to be a waste of money when you can change oil more than twice in the same cost! (considering the so called 'premium' synthetic oils in ~3000 range)
Yes, that's why I'm going to either go for the Motul 4100 or the Mobil 3000 that @hserus had suggested.

I had my oil changed only around ~3000 Km ago. So I will decide on which one when it is time to change the oil.

Saw an unheard of brand with the exact specs for my car so my curiosity was piqued. :P
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Old 25th July 2018, 18:14   #4957
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Originally Posted by R2D2 View Post
But now, let me ask you a question. Why did you use a flush and move to synthetic after running that engine (is it a 1.2 or 1.6?) for lakhs of kms I assume on mineral oil? That motor is probably past its prime. Did you find evidence of sludge accumulation? As for detrimental effects well, I guess time will tell.
It is a 1.2 from 2002.
So, I got the car handed to me after it had covered 90k odd kms. Till then it was my dad who drove and took care of it. After that, even I was only interested in driving it and not worried about anything else. My father used to get the car serviced and oil changed regularly at 5k intervals.
I actually started getting the car repaired and serviced after it had run around 1.05L kms. The 40k kms after that have been in the last 3 yrs that I have been driving and getting the car serviced. After 1.25L kms, I started feeling that the car had lost some power. It's not a substantial loss of power otherwise I wouldn't have been able to drive it in Himachal. It still can touch 3 digit figures with ease on AC in the plains. After a recent clutch change power loss seems even less of an issue.
So, my car, after every oil change becomes extremely silent. You switch it on and you can't even tell the engine is running apart from the, now loud, exhaust note. But after running it 2k kms, the engine started sounding rough. Not too much, but a little loud enough for me to notice. Till then, I hadn't ever read about what oil to use or even knew what grade oil was being put in my car. All was left in the hands of my trusted mechanic apart from ordering parts which I order from 99rpm.
So after I read a lot, especially BITOG forums, I realized that maybe I should switch to synthetic oil. Mentally, I have been prepared for the last 25k kms for the engine's gaskets and rings to be replaced, both of which are still available. Keeping all that in mind, I took the plunge and switched to synthetic oil after a flush 3.5k kms ago. The car is as silent today as it was when the oil was poured in and that was what I wanted. Maybe, I might regret it in the future, but that is still to come and till then I am much happier behind the wheels. It lost around 1/2 a litre of oil, which it used to do with mineral oil as well. I'd love to get away with just changing the gaskets, but let's see what happens.
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Old 25th July 2018, 19:40   #4958
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Default Re: ARTICLE: Synthetic oil vs Mineral oil

Picked up the Amsoil today and filled it after using an STP engine flush as the car has gone nearly 50k km without a flush so far.

Initial feedback after two or three km is that the engine sounds and feels happy but I need to take it on a long enough drive before I can tell.
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Old 26th July 2018, 13:48   #4959
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Default Re: ARTICLE: Synthetic oil vs Mineral oil

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Originally Posted by rdst_1 View Post
So, my car, after every oil change becomes extremely silent. You switch it on and you can't even tell the engine is running apart from the, now loud, exhaust note. But after running it 2k kms, the engine started sounding rough. Not too much, but a little loud enough for me to notice.
Deterioration in a few thousand kms is pretty normal with mid rung mineral oils. I have experienced this even with Toyota's OEM mineral oil made by Idemitsu. This type of oil is best changed every 5-6K kms or 6 months.

Quote:
It lost around 1/2 a litre of oil, which it used to do with mineral oil as well.
If your car engine is burning oil aren't you losing more ₹₹ by filling in synthetic? Do try Shell Helix HX7 10W-40. My 1.6 works beautifully with that product. I like it better than Castrol Magnatec 10W-40 which the car was regularly filled with earlier. It'll save you money on the purchase and reduce loss incurred by oil consumption. Also do not use xW-30 oils with the Palio. Thinner oil = more oil loss through burning.

Quote:
Originally Posted by hserus View Post
Picked up the Amsoil today. Initial feedback after two or three km is that the engine sounds and feels happy but I need to take it on a long enough drive before I can tell.
Did you buy Amsoil Signature for diesels? Waiting for your feedback.

Last edited by R2D2 : 26th July 2018 at 13:49.
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Old 26th July 2018, 14:43   #4960
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Default Re: ARTICLE: Synthetic oil vs Mineral oil

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Originally Posted by R2D2 View Post
Did you buy Amsoil Signature for diesels? Waiting for your feedback.
This was amsoil 5w40 ck4 synthetic for my scorpio. The signature 5w30 is a multistage petrol + diesel oil that seems OK for my Fiesta but I still have at least 7k km till my next oil change on that car.
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Old 26th July 2018, 18:39   #4961
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Default Re: ARTICLE: Synthetic oil vs Mineral oil

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Originally Posted by hserus View Post
Picked up the Amsoil today and filled it after using an STP engine flush as the car has gone nearly 50k km without a flush so far.
Did Mahindra ASS allow you to use the STP engine flush and a different brand of engine oil or did you get it done elsewhere?
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Old 26th July 2018, 18:48   #4962
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Default Re: ARTICLE: Synthetic oil vs Mineral oil

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Did Mahindra ASS allow you to use the STP engine flush and a different brand of engine oil or did you get it done elsewhere?
Got it done at my usual FNG and then had a short conversation about the oil with the ASS guy when I dropped in there for a scheduled 50k service they were bugging me about.
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Old 26th July 2018, 18:51   #4963
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Default Re: ARTICLE: Synthetic oil vs Mineral oil

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Originally Posted by hserus View Post
Got it done at my usual FNG and then had a short conversation about the oil with the ASS guy when I dropped in there for a scheduled 50k service they were bugging me about.
Oh okay! That makes sense.
MASS guys are not too happy about using outside stuff which is why I asked.
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Old 26th July 2018, 22:00   #4964
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Oh okay! That makes sense.
MASS guys are not too happy about using outside stuff which is why I asked.
Donít bother about them. Theyíre losing their margins thatís all. The MGDO is horrible in quality.
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Old 27th July 2018, 07:33   #4965
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Donít bother about them. Theyíre losing their margins thatís all. The MGDO is horrible in quality.
Blast. MASS keeps getting stuck in my mind as Maruti not Mahindra. Please read Maximile FEO instead of MGDO above.
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