[ebonho]

Originally Posted by apachelongbow

mixer or a fridge.

Safari's resale is just slightly better than these items in terms of depreciation or exchange.

Frankly I always fantasized about having a Safari. A big diesel motor that I would overhaul every 200-250,000 kms and keep running like a typical bawaji. Ditto for my Std 500.

I still have our 1998 Zen, and I am loathe to part with my 2005 Baleno, so the genes run strong within.

Kids also get very attached to family vehicles (more than many adults). And hate seeing them go.

[Rahul Rao]

Originally Posted by rkg

Hexa is nothing but Aria with side and front cladding and some minor changes here and there. Only major change will be engine with higher power and gear box.

The sides seem to be the same which is actually fine, front and rear have a big difference with the thin vertical tail lamps replaced, and a the over grown Vista type head lamps which were in a diagonal line making way for better horizontally placed lamps.
The higher torque and power tune may come only with a AT, which is likely to be the AWTF-21 gearbox Longitudnal mount brother of the AWF-21 from the Landrover Freelander II.

I'm equally happy with both manuals and autos, but the tcu of the auto's should be designed for the engine, and should shift in time to keep it in the torque range like the JLR or VW ones. The wrong choice of transmission (shared with petrol engines) which is used in Captiva here shifts too late and lets engine go upto 4000 RPM way beyond peak torque if you floor it.

Today I took a (unofficial) test drive of the XUV500 W10 and found it very good, and having everything except luggage space.


Rahul

[pgsagar]

Originally Posted by apachelongbow

.... buying something like the Innova, for resale value, and compromising big time on driving pleasure IMO is not the hallmark of an enthusiast, but of a person who considers a car as an appliance like a mixer or a fridge.

You stole words from my mouth. I am surprised to see some teambhpians owning Innovas. I thought Teambhp is an enthusiasts' forum. Shouldn't we rather be discussing Fortuners, Scorpios, Safaris, Captivas rather than Innovas, Xylos, Taveras, Sumos etc.? Latter cars are plain taxis. What fun do people get driving these delivery van like people movers? Innova may be more reliable and may have a T badge. Other than that, I see no difference between Innova and Tavera or Xylo. They are all taxis. As you have rightly said only a person who thinks of a car like a utility product like a washing machine would buy these cars.

[Seek]

I currently drive a 2007 honda city zx and have been looking out for an upgrade. i caught the safari bug while looking out for a car for a colleague and am on the verge on settling on the new storme myself. Havent been able to lay my hands on a test drive vehicle of the new variant. I test drove the pre-face lift storme and was highly impressed with the ride. One niggling feeling that remained is the forward backward swaying incase of hard braking. The test drive vehicle was 20k kms old. Is this a normal phenomena in safari's? Didnt give a very comfortable feeling considering long drives and kids as passengers (nausea etc). Waiting to test drive the new version to see if this is addressed in any way.

For the benefit of folks looking out for the storme here in chennai, am attaching the price list i picked up today at concorde motors.

[TorqueyTechie]

Originally Posted by pgsagar

I am surprised to see some teambhpians owning Innovas. I thought Teambhp is an enthusiasts' forum. Shouldn't we rather be discussing Fortuners, Scorpios, Safaris, Captivas rather than Innovas, Xylos, Taveras, Sumos etc.? Latter cars are plain taxis. What fun do people get driving these delivery van like people movers? Innova may be more reliable and may have a T badge. Other than that, I see no difference between Innova and Tavera or Xylo. They are all taxis. As you have rightly said only a person who thinks of a car like a utility product like a washing machine would buy these cars.

My pgsagar, Teambhp is not only for enthusiasts nor it has ever been mentioned anywhere on the forum like that. Team BHP is and will always be a forum for all likeminded individuals who want to learn and share their experiences, knowledge and passion about their vehicles.

All people buy car (or a bike) depending on their families needs first and later think about performance and other aspects. Saying that people driving Innovas and the like are not enthusiasts or bought by people who treat a vehicle as a commodity is pure blasphemy!

[Storme_on_d_way]

Originally Posted by pgsagar

You stole words from my mouth. I am surprised to see some teambhpians owning Innovas. I thought Teambhp is an enthusiasts' forum. Shouldn't we rather be discussing Fortuners, Scorpios, Safaris, Captivas rather than Innovas, Xylos, Taveras, Sumos etc.? Latter cars are plain taxis. What fun do people get driving these delivery van like people movers? Innova may be more reliable and may have a T badge. Other than that, I see no difference between Innova and Tavera or Xylo. They are all taxis. As you have rightly said only a person who thinks of a car like a utility product like a washing machine would buy these cars.

I think he actually meant that only a person who thinks of a car like utility product would buy these car FOR ITS RESALE VALUE. The comment was not for people who generally buy these cars. MUV's or people carrier whatever you refer them as do suffice many people needs. We dont buy a car out of our enthusiasm everytime. Sometimes, we need to look beyond the sporty image, higher bhps and go-anywhere abilities and buy it keeping the family needs in mind. I just found your over-enthusiasm a bit offensive for people who invest in those so called 'taxis'. Did you actually read it in the t-bhps terms and conditions that this forum is only for enthusiasts. I am sorry I must have missed out on that line. I thought its about a team of people connected by a common love known as Bhp and even tata nano has it. Just my two cents. No hard feelings

[Buffetfan]

Originally Posted by apachelongbow

I agree!! However buying something like the Innova, for resale value, and compromising big time on driving pleasure IMO is not the hallmark of an enthusiast, but of a person who considers a car as an appliance like a mixer or a fridge.

Do you really believe people buy the Innova for resale value - I mean buy one for 15 lakhs, sell it off for 10 lakhs 4 years later and be happy with the "investment" they made.

And what is resale value - is it high because these buyers buy it for "second resale" value. Looks too simplitic an explanation - like a Ponzi scheme where each person invests assuming someone below him in the chain will invest.

Is it just that people have bought a car based on resale value and reliability for the last 10 years and kept it no 1 on charts. What about comfort, space, seating capacity, the "eg gaadi mein saath saath chalne ka maza" .

I am not even mentioning comfort (I am 6 feet and can comfortably do 400+ kms on the last row), Reliability . My 102000 kms old Innova has seen only tyre / brake pad replacements. Only part replaced is a light bulb. The much maligned / noisy 2KD FTV can do half a million kms before getting its heart replaced.

The reason a car sells well is because it tops the charts in a few areas but is respectable in all. Before we happily bash the Innova as difficult to drive, noisy, underpowered etc lets spare a thought - if it was so bad, it would not sell in the numbers it does.

Finally, to each his own, but I can bet my last dollar that innova will make the top 3 (if not the top) in terms of fatigue free cars to drive long distances by most cabbies. And these are the guys who do long distance for a living.

[apachelongbow]

@buffetfan: it may help if you read my post in conjunction with the reply it was made to an earlier post. Simply picking it and then shooting a reply defending your choice doesn't make sense. If you and all the cabbies and other users get pleasure in spending hard earned money on bare basic rides, more power to you...

[tsk1979]

Storme refresh has been reviewed. Review should be out within next 2 weeks. Even earlier if possible.

[dhanushs]

Originally Posted by apachelongbow

I agree!! However buying something like the Innova, for resale value, and compromising big time on driving pleasure IMO is not the hallmark of an enthusiast, but of a person who considers a car as an appliance like a mixer or a fridge.

Originally Posted by pgsagar

You stole words from my mouth. I am surprised to see some teambhpians owning Innovas.. Latter cars are plain taxis. What fun do people get driving these delivery van like people movers?

Whoa.. hold your horses guys.

People buy cars suiting their needs. If you need a tractor at your farm, but, the enthusiast in you demands a Fortuner, can you do this?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gnC12_4YJIA

Obviously some one does, but, then, think of it. If you need an innova, nothing can replace it. Being an enthusiast doesn't mean, you cant buy a practical people mover if you need one.

[AutoIndian]

Originally Posted by apachelongbow

I agree!! However buying something like the Innova, for resale value, and compromising big time on driving pleasure IMO is not the hallmark of an enthusiast, but of a person who considers a car as an appliance like a mixer or a fridge.

"hallmark of an enthusiast". Besides owning a car that gives driving pleasure what are the other criteria that would certify a person to be an enthusiast or is this the only one?
with you to a certain extent that people who buy utility vehicles (especially MUVs) see more value in their utility than anything else. Now if you want to compare this to the utility of appliances like a mixer or a fridge, so be it.

Originally Posted by pgsagar

You stole words from my mouth. I am surprised to see some teambhpians owning Innovas. I thought Teambhp is an enthusiasts' forum. Shouldn't we rather be discussing Fortuners, Scorpios, Safaris, Captivas rather than Innovas, Xylos, Taveras, Sumos etc.? Latter cars are plain taxis. What fun do people get driving these delivery van like people movers? Innova may be more reliable and may have a T badge. Other than that, I see no difference between Innova and Tavera or Xylo. They are all taxis. As you have rightly said only a person who thinks of a car like a utility product like a washing machine would buy these cars.

My dear friend, psagar, I am sorry to say, but I am feeling quite offended with this statement. Do you mean that, TBHPians should never buy an Innova or if a person has an Innova, he cannot be a TBHP member and Innova owner's cannot be enthusiasts?

Do people drive a car only for fun and nothing else? I would be greatly appreciate if you can show at least some respect for other people's choices. Each person has his own reason to buy a car and without understanding that just making fun of other people's choices, ain't mature enough.

Originally Posted by TorqueyTechie

Team BHP is and will always be a forum for all likeminded individuals who want to learn and share their experiences, knowledge and passion about their vehicles.

All people buy car (or a bike) depending on their families needs first and later think about performance and other aspects. Saying that people driving Innovas and the like are not enthusiasts or bought by people who treat a vehicle as a commodity is pure blasphemy!

Well said, TorqueyTechie. +100 to that. People buy cars that serve most of their needs if not all. If I was a lone person or at max family of two, I would opt for a two seater, sports car and not a people mover. If I am a family of 6 or 7, I won't even look at hatches or sedans. Given a choice everyone would like to have a hot, sporty car for self indulgence and a people mover/ SUV to take the family out, but how may of us have the luxury of owning two or more cars?

Originally Posted by Storme_on_d_way

We dont buy a car out of our enthusiasm everytime. Sometimes, we need to look beyond the sporty image, higher bhps and go-anywhere abilities and buy it keeping the family needs in mind. I just found your over-enthusiasm a bit offensive for people who invest in those so called 'taxis'. I thought its about a team of people connected by a common love known as Bhp and even tata nano has it. Just my two cents. No hard feelings

You have hit the nail on its head Storme_on_d_way. Making fun of other people's choices and getting sadistic pleasure from that can't be a TBHPians virtue. I was very happy with my hatch, the Tata Indica for 10.5 long years as it was serving my purpose, but when my family grew to 6, I needed a bigger car. I always had a soft corner for the Tata's as someone has rightly said above that no other car manufacturer provides as much real estate as the Tata's do. So the Aria and the Storme were natural choices, but then they were too big for my apartments reserved parking. Hence I could not consider them. The Innova fitted in just perfectly and became my obvious choice.

Originally Posted by Buffetfan

The reason a car sells well is because it tops the charts in a few areas but is respectable in all. Before we happily bash the Innova as difficult to drive, noisy, underpowered etc lets spare a thought - if it was so bad, it would not sell in the numbers it does.

Now if I add something to what you have already said Buffetfan, this thread may well drag into a Storme Vs Innova fight, which obviously I don't want to do. I respect the Storme for what it offers. The other day on my way to office, when I was following a Storme in my Innova, I realized that the Storme driver had such an imposing stance and I was sitting pretty low compared to the Storme driver.

Originally Posted by apachelongbow

If you and all the cabbies and other users get pleasure in spending hard earned money on bare basic rides, more power to you...

Again my dear friend apachelongbow why so much hatred for other car owners? You can call me a cabbie driver all throughout my life, because for 10.5 long years I owned and drove an Indica, which is the darling of all cabbies and now an Innova, which incidentally happens to fall in the same category.

To tell you the truth, couple of months back I was supposed to attend one company get together over a lunch in the Hyatt hotel. Just as I entered the hotel porch and was about to get down from my car to give it for wallet parking a suited-booted sardarji tried to enter in my car assuming that this was his hired Innova. When I stared at him with a strange look, he realized his folly and expressed his apologies for barging into my personal car. For the rest of the day me and my friends couldn't stop laughing at this incident.

Originally Posted by dhanushs

Whoa.. hold your horses guys.

People buy cars suiting their needs. If you need a tractor at your farm, but, the enthusiast in you demands a Fortuner, can you do this?
Being an enthusiast doesn't mean, you cant buy a practical people mover if you need one.

+100 to that dhanushs, I don't have any further comments on that, you said it all.

[sourabhzen]

Gentlemen, this is the only thread subscribed by me for email updates. Trust me, getting emails on Innova vs Storms is very irritating. Request you to keep the discussion limited to Storme only and take this illogical fight to some other relevant thread.

[ebonho]

Originally Posted by sourabhzen

Gentlemen, this is the only thread subscribed by me for email updates. Trust me, getting emails on Innova vs Storms is very irritating. Request you to keep the discussion limited to Storme only and take this illogical fight to some other relevant thread.

I agree. Let's not chew the life out of an issue to prove a point please. Or please start a new dedicated "vs" thread for the same.

[narayan]

Guys - once again the Storme thread is hijacked by people who want to discuss other cars ( whether its Tata fan boys who always have to make out all Tata vehicles as the best in all categories or others who want to defend their choices ). Lets keep these "arguments " out of this threads.
Lets be clear - the Storme is not some niche vehicle with high brand equity which does things the way no other vehicle does it. Neither is it a good for nothing vehicle that deserves where it should be in the sales chart. But the reasons for both have been discussed to death.
Lets keep this thread for sharing RELEVANT ownership related info from owners and queries from prospective buyers.

[rajismine]

So lets bring it back to Safari Storme. First things first - Who wants the new Flip Key of the Storme? :-) Somehow I have been able to track the key with Minda Dealers outside of Tata and is quoting Rs 2500. The lead is authentic since I called Minda to buy it from them and they seems to deal with only their Wholesale Stockists and routed the call to this Hyderabad Dealer. Looks like I am going to order one :-)
Attaching pic of the key I had clicker earlier