Frankmehta’s eS(Q)teem®: Eclipse| Illusion Audio| DLS| Genesis| Monster|Hermit

Invinsible · 12th May 2009, 18:12

Quote:

Originally Posted by frankmehta

thanks abhishek. i kind of had this in mind, but now i am making a new larger enclosure altogether. so might not need it. unless it has a large influence on the quality
any 'side effects' of adding polyfill??

Don't think it would have any side effect. Generally I would suggest you to add 1- 1'1/2" poly fill all around on the inside wall of the enclosure even though your enclosure is large size. This may reduce the resonance inside the enclosure which may be smooth'en out the the sound waves, may result in little deeper sound, if not help in fooling the sub of larger enclosure.

frankmehta · 12th May 2009, 18:15

what about a DAMPED enclosure? how different is a damped enclosure from that of one with polyfill?

karankapoor · 12th May 2009, 18:28

use dynaxorb and apply it in side the enclosure on the wall behind the magnet and damping material on the other walls.

like this

Invinsible · 12th May 2009, 18:30

Quote:

Originally Posted by frankmehta

what about a DAMPED enclosure? how different is a damped enclosure from that of one with polyfill?

Damped Enclosure works the same as a polyfill would. But, over the years it's been the polyfill that is proven to give better result as a the sound waves travels through them, hit's the wall of the enclosure, travels back and pushes the waves to move your sub. damping inside the enclosure may be cut the resonance too but, don't think it would give the same result as a polyfill would.
Damping is best for doors, booth, and other areas where putting a polyfill is practically not possible.
Over the years I have always used polyfill in my sub enclosures whether going ported or sealed. Not many may notice the difference, but I feel somewhere at high output it does make a difference. The use of filler will help minimize midbass resonances. Even the sub acts in some what controlled manner.

You may try it if you like it keep it or you can always remove it and it's a cheaper option.

frankmehta · 12th May 2009, 19:10

aight. thank you so much KK and Abhishek. this was something I was thinking of since a long time. How much does dynaxorb cost??

Another question that is plaguing me since a long time: Tweeter position.
I have read somewhere that having tweeters off axis increases their 'shine' (which i have been experiencing since quite a long time, and the least tweeter attenuation the x-overs allow is a -1.8 setting which is blunts the tweets too much: a -.5 would be perfect!)
Mine are off axis, as you can see in the photo.
Using the same photo, can you'll please tell me what my OPTIMUM tweeter position should be?
On Axis, but where? On the door pads?
Or further away from me like the i10 shown below? Note how far away from the listener, they have been placed! and they are angled in opposite directions. IE the drivers side tweeter is facing the passenger, and vice versa. Suggestions

PS:in the 4th photo from the top, the adhesive marks point to where the earlier TS-20s(emosional atyaachaar) were installed. is that a good position for on axis?????

also, will changing the tweeter position to on axis, 'raise' the soundstage slightly higher up? I dont mind that actually. I sometimes feel the midbass sounds better when I duck my head a few inches. Am i an idiot or is there some logic in all this reasoning?

abhinav.gupta88 · 12th May 2009, 19:41

How about something like this?

http://www.team-bhp.com/forum/sound-off-show-off/30684-illusionised-swift-part-2-a.html

frankmehta · 12th May 2009, 19:44

inna vadda photo? abhinav this photo looks like 'actual size' photos that come in mobile phone ads! lol
edit it na!

abhinav.gupta88 · 12th May 2009, 19:47

Editing done
http://www.team-bhp.com/forum/iipcache/99434.jpg

Quote:

Originally Posted by frankmehta

I sometimes feel the midbass sounds better when I duck my head a few inches. Am i an idiot or is there some logic in all this reasoning?

Maybe some more adjusting on the TA function is needed.

Just maybe.

frankmehta · 12th May 2009, 19:59

wont getting the tweeters so close to me increase their shine? i mean, in your case, dont the tweeters sound too bright?

abhinav.gupta88 · 12th May 2009, 20:10

The tuning and cross over settings on the passive crossover have been done to make them sound normal ( According to me, normal) Maybe bright / laid back for others.

If they are fired at each other, i think they would sound better.

Invinsible · 12th May 2009, 21:55

As far as my knowledge goes off axis response is when the speakers or tweeters are not directly facing towards the driver. On axis is when the speaker / tweeters are facing the driver directly. The best would be to mount them on Apiller facing eachother or on dashboard facing parellel with front screen. That way the sound from the tweeter would travel high up near rear view mirror or rather in center.
It also depends on the design of the speaker whether they are capable enough to give the off axis response. You can always try this position during the installation and see if it works to bring the right imaging if not than you would have to try the on axis way where it comes facing towards the front seats. In this case best i think would be to put in the deep corner of the front windscreen.
See what works the best for them.

Gill · 12th May 2009, 22:17

@Frank, which set of tweeters are you using?The tweeter in first pic looks bigger.
Correct me If I am not wrong, doesn't look like luccent tweeter.

frankmehta · 12th May 2009, 23:15

hi gill. in fact, i am using the tweeters in the 1 st pic.
i didnt have too many pics of the luccent tweeter, hence in the next few pics, to show the location i used old pics taken with my electra tweeter.

OF course, the 1st pic IS the Luccent tweeter! :-)

Gill · 12th May 2009, 23:51

Thanks for clarification, I just checked Amey's thread before seeing these pics,I got confused.
The size looked different! that's why I asked!

@How about placing tweeter closer to midbass? I am keeping an eye,on what members say here!

frankmehta · 13th May 2009, 10:44

tweeter close to the midbass would be technically lowering the soundstage right?
how much does time alignment help in RAISING the soundstage in an Passive setup? I know its way too easy in an Active setup, but we are not going active here.

Trying various positions with the tweeter is fine, but i have time alignment, and that makes a lot of things simpler. the MAIN problem is the base location. the slightly directional changes can be made later, but I want the tweeter to be on axis this time.
Suggestions suggestions suggestions!

Guys, the install is moving periliously close. I need my queries sorted out please.

12th May 2009, 18:15	#707
frankmehta Senior - BHPian Join Date: Mar 2006 Location: Mumbai Posts: 4,000 Thanked: 3,577 Times View My Garage	what about a DAMPED enclosure? how different is a damped enclosure from that of one with polyfill?
	() Thanks

12th May 2009, 18:28	#708
karankapoor Senior - BHPian Join Date: Apr 2008 Location: in the car!!! Posts: 1,675 Thanked: 6 Times	use dynaxorb and apply it in side the enclosure on the wall behind the magnet and damping material on the other walls. like this Attached Thumbnails
	() Thanks

12th May 2009, 19:10	#710
frankmehta Senior - BHPian Join Date: Mar 2006 Location: Mumbai Posts: 4,000 Thanked: 3,577 Times View My Garage	aight. thank you so much KK and Abhishek. this was something I was thinking of since a long time. How much does dynaxorb cost?? Another question that is plaguing me since a long time: Tweeter position. I have read somewhere that having tweeters off axis increases their 'shine' (which i have been experiencing since quite a long time, and the least tweeter attenuation the x-overs allow is a -1.8 setting which is blunts the tweets too much: a -.5 would be perfect!) Mine are off axis, as you can see in the photo. Using the same photo, can you'll please tell me what my OPTIMUM tweeter position should be? On Axis, but where? On the door pads? Or further away from me like the i10 shown below? Note how far away from the listener, they have been placed! and they are angled in opposite directions. IE the drivers side tweeter is facing the passenger, and vice versa. Suggestions PS:in the 4th photo from the top, the adhesive marks point to where the earlier TS-20s(emosional atyaachaar) were installed. is that a good position for on axis????? also, will changing the tweeter position to on axis, 'raise' the soundstage slightly higher up? I dont mind that actually. I sometimes feel the midbass sounds better when I duck my head a few inches. Am i an idiot or is there some logic in all this reasoning? Attached Thumbnails Attached Images Last edited by frankmehta : 12th May 2009 at 19:15.
	() Thanks

12th May 2009, 19:41	#711
abhinav.gupta88 Senior - BHPian Join Date: Sep 2007 Location: Delhi , India Posts: 4,092 Thanked: 325 Times View My Garage	How about something like this? http://www.team-bhp.com/forum/sound-off-show-off/30684-illusionised-swift-part-2-a.html Last edited by abhinav.gupta88 : 12th May 2009 at 19:48.
	() Thanks

12th May 2009, 19:44	#712
frankmehta Senior - BHPian Join Date: Mar 2006 Location: Mumbai Posts: 4,000 Thanked: 3,577 Times View My Garage	inna vadda photo? abhinav this photo looks like 'actual size' photos that come in mobile phone ads! lol edit it na!
	() Thanks

12th May 2009, 19:59	#714
frankmehta Senior - BHPian Join Date: Mar 2006 Location: Mumbai Posts: 4,000 Thanked: 3,577 Times View My Garage	wont getting the tweeters so close to me increase their shine? i mean, in your case, dont the tweeters sound too bright?
	() Thanks

12th May 2009, 20:10	#715
abhinav.gupta88 Senior - BHPian Join Date: Sep 2007 Location: Delhi , India Posts: 4,092 Thanked: 325 Times View My Garage	The tuning and cross over settings on the passive crossover have been done to make them sound normal ( According to me, normal) Maybe bright / laid back for others. If they are fired at each other, i think they would sound better.
	() Thanks

12th May 2009, 21:55	#716
Invinsible Senior - BHPian Join Date: Nov 2006 Location: Bombay Posts: 1,257 Thanked: 62 Times	As far as my knowledge goes off axis response is when the speakers or tweeters are not directly facing towards the driver. On axis is when the speaker / tweeters are facing the driver directly. The best would be to mount them on Apiller facing eachother or on dashboard facing parellel with front screen. That way the sound from the tweeter would travel high up near rear view mirror or rather in center. It also depends on the design of the speaker whether they are capable enough to give the off axis response. You can always try this position during the installation and see if it works to bring the right imaging if not than you would have to try the on axis way where it comes facing towards the front seats. In this case best i think would be to put in the deep corner of the front windscreen. See what works the best for them.
	() Thanks

12th May 2009, 22:17	#717
Gill BHPian Join Date: Aug 2007 Location: Mohali Posts: 701 Thanked: 16 Times	@Frank, which set of tweeters are you using?The tweeter in first pic looks bigger. Correct me If I am not wrong, doesn't look like luccent tweeter. Last edited by Gill : 12th May 2009 at 22:20.
	() Thanks

12th May 2009, 23:15	#718
frankmehta Senior - BHPian Join Date: Mar 2006 Location: Mumbai Posts: 4,000 Thanked: 3,577 Times View My Garage	hi gill. in fact, i am using the tweeters in the 1 st pic. i didnt have too many pics of the luccent tweeter, hence in the next few pics, to show the location i used old pics taken with my electra tweeter. OF course, the 1st pic IS the Luccent tweeter! :-) Last edited by frankmehta : 12th May 2009 at 23:16.
	() Thanks

12th May 2009, 23:51	#719
Gill BHPian Join Date: Aug 2007 Location: Mohali Posts: 701 Thanked: 16 Times	Thanks for clarification, I just checked Amey's thread before seeing these pics,I got confused. The size looked different! that's why I asked! @How about placing tweeter closer to midbass? I am keeping an eye,on what members say here! Last edited by Gill : 12th May 2009 at 23:53.
	() Thanks

13th May 2009, 10:44	#720
frankmehta Senior - BHPian Join Date: Mar 2006 Location: Mumbai Posts: 4,000 Thanked: 3,577 Times View My Garage	tweeter close to the midbass would be technically lowering the soundstage right? how much does time alignment help in RAISING the soundstage in an Passive setup? I know its way too easy in an Active setup, but we are not going active here. Trying various positions with the tweeter is fine, but i have time alignment, and that makes a lot of things simpler. the MAIN problem is the base location. the slightly directional changes can be made later, but I want the tweeter to be on axis this time. Suggestions suggestions suggestions! Guys, the install is moving periliously close. I need my queries sorted out please.
	() Thanks