[ebonho]

Originally Posted by Sheel

This is what I think

Incidentally, I nearly bought a Scorpio 10+ years ago when I was deciding my next car after my Fiat Uno at that time. I eventually bought the Baleno - I was at that stage in my life. Never regretted it for an instant, still don't.

It is. Perhaps from differential, it measures as 205mm. And the car (to my naked eye) appears high as well, than the earlier iteration.

Was mentioning naked eye perception only. And only of the floor boards. I have seen TSK's post where he busts the myth of the Scorpio's GC due to that big round thing at the rear axle (don't know what its called) which is much lower and can thus hit something more easily.

The engine on the Scorpio is more refined & drivability is better as well. Only grouse is a short 5th gear.

I do recall the earlier Scorpio (the bigger 2.6 liter diesel engine) being quite sprightly as well. It seems to me more of a gear ratio thing (helped by lower body weight) than that of engine tune per se. Amitk26 has explained it well earlier.

Otherwise how does one explain the difference of 20 bhp between the two?

I know what I and a few others here have stretched their Storme's to on wide open stretches of highway. I have never heard of a Scorpio doing those speeds - nor of a Scorpio driver having the guts (or lack of brains) to try and push the Scorpio to those speeds. Because as the speeds rise, in these tall SUVs, weight starts becoming a boon, as do body manners - both of which I feel are on the Storme's side (though admittedly I cannot comment on how well the new Scorpio rides yet).

[condor]

ebonho : the new Mahindra Scorpio .. ground clearance as a mere 165 mm (vs 200 for the Storme/Aria and 205 for the Dicor)!

Surely this is a mistake? 165 mm is way too small for an SUV surely, especially one shod with 17 inch wheels?

No doc, no mistake. That's Mahindra's ingenious way of getting down into a lower excise bracket. Remember the ruling by the Govt last year when they defined a SUV has something that also has a high GC ? Well, Mahindra did some clever measurements to show the GC as 165 mm, though there is about 195 below the axles.

Also, do read the Scorp's review where they mentioned the GC..

[ebonho]

Most of you guys must be knowing of Sanjay Takle, the rally driver. He is from Pune and a protegy from his younger years racing bikes of my Bullet tuner, whom he respects greatly and still considers his guru (will bring each of his trophies to his workshop whenever he returns to Pune from one of his overseas races).

I have been fortunate to have spent some time with him, picking his brains, learning stuff about both riding as well as driving fast off road, about control, about the mental bit, visiting his farm, seeing his vehicles, and generally soaking in racecraft from an Indian great.

He has raced in the Raid both in the Scorpio as well as the Safari, and admits (privately) to preferring the Scorpio for its weight and its pickup.

[condor]

ebonho : He has raced in the Raid both in the Scorpio as well as the Safari, and admits (privately) to preferring the Scorpio for its weight and its pickup.

Doc, the ligher weight of the Scorp no secret, isnt it. This one factor will make the Scorp sprightier.

For everything else, there's the Safari. And now the Storme.


Note: Even we Safari & Storme guys have long wished for a lighter vehicle - without any trade-off's that could affect the plus points that we have.

[Sheel]

Originally Posted by ebonho

Was mentioning naked eye perception only. And only of the floor boards. I have seen TSK's post where he busts the myth of the Scorpio's GC due to that big round thing at the rear axle (don't know what its called) which is much lower and can thus hit something more easily.

That was added for 2014 models only. My 25th December 2013 purchased Scorpio does not have it (at my ancestral place)

I do recall the earlier Scorpio (the bigger 2.6 liter diesel engine) being quite sprightly as well. It seems to me more of a gear ratio thing (helped by lower body weight) than that of engine tune per se. Amitk26 has explained it well earlier.

I think the engine on the Scorpio is more refined (wrt) to the Storme's. Idle both & find out. In fact, try to potter around with both and you will notice. To me, it appears so

But then again, Scorpio suffers in cruising. It would have been perfect had 100kmph come up at 2,000 revs.

I know what I and a few others here have stretched their Storme's to on wide open stretches of highway. I have never heard of a Scorpio doing those speeds - nor of a Scorpio driver having the guts (or lack of brains) to try and push the Scorpio to those speeds. Because as the speeds rise, in these tall SUVs, weight starts becoming a boon, as do body manners - both of which I feel are on the Storme's side (though admittedly I cannot comment on how well the new Scorpio rides yet).

Precisely the reason I am investing in a 4X4.
Though must say, if you sit in the new Scorpio for even 10 seconds (as a passenger), you will instantly know that the bounciness is gone. But not in the league of the Aria. The ride in the Aria is amazing.

And as far as driving both flat out is concerned, try hard, but you can not lose either from your RVM's (with equal drivers)

Reason I am buying a Scorpio over & above the Storme are -
# Probability of a new Storme being launched.
# The SVC at Tata is horrible at my place. (Know about the JD Survey, but I have to visit this uncouth place only)
# The new Scorpio has just been launched, means there won't be any new iterations for some time and I plan to retain this, so...

Else, I too love the Storme, the interiors, the looks, but reason no.2 can't be pushed aside.

[ebonho]

Originally Posted by condor

Note: Even we Safari & Storme guys have long wished for a lighter vehicle - without any trade-off's that could affect the plus points that we have.

I agree bro. See the Scorpio is a VISUALLY smaller vehicle than the Safari and Storme.

A vehicle is made of metal and plastic and rubber and glass. Ergo that bit of extra vehicle is going to have weight. How much weight? Well from what I see of the specs, about 200 odd kilos.

Is the Safari/Storme 200 kilos BIGGER than the Scorpio? If yes, then sadly nothing much can be done short of very expensive space age materials and metallurgy.

If the answer is NO, then Tata is missing something somewhere.

Maybe Dear Behram can answer this one (if he can) as he has worked closely at both at a very involved and senior level.

Personally, if someone tried to cut corners and give me thinner gauge sheet metal in the doors, bonnet, etc. to lose some weight, I'd simply say "why bother" and walk away. I would not want my Storme to lose any of its "tank" like character. I prefer that greatly over beating the Scorpios to the next traffic light .... though THAT's never really happened yet.

P.S. The Hydraulic Jack on the Scorpio is a nice touch!

[condor]

ebonho : I agree bro. See the Scorpio is a VISUALLY smaller vehicle than the Safari and Storme.

Is the Safari/Storme 200 kilos BIGGER than the Scorpio?

201 mm longer ANd 145 mm wider .. but still 180 kg heavier. Would have to be in the sheet metal. But, like you said:

, if someone tried to cut corners and give me thinner gauge sheet metal in the doors, bonnet, etc. to lose some weight, I'd simply say "why bother" and walk away. I would not want my Storme to lose any of its tank like character. I prefer that over beating the Scorpios to the next traffic light ....

P.S. The Hydraulic Jack on the Scorpio is a nice touch!

+1. Wonder if I could get one of that.

[Sheel]

Sheet metal is thinner in the Scorpio. No two ways about it. Close doors or lift up the bonnet and you will know.

[ebonho]

Originally Posted by condor

+1. Wonder if I could get one of that.

I am shamelessly eyeing it as well. Maybe a visit next door to Silver Jubilee Motors is in order. Probably drive up in my wife's best friend's dad's beat up Armada for camoflage.

P.S. Btw, on a totally different topic, last few days, my USB pen drive has been acting up man. Suddenly music stops (I expect a phone call) nothing happens and I look down at the display and its showing "1969" I forward to the next album or next song. Or wait it out and it comes back on. But the 1969 stays.

Now yesterday same thing but instead of 1969 it was 1970. What gives? Virus? But from where? The pendrive has never left the Storme or gone into any other machine.

[ajay_satpute]

The refreshed STORME is expected only in mid-2015. That's too far off IMO.

http://www.autocarindia.com/auto-new...15-391380.aspx

[ebonho]

Originally Posted by ajay_satpute

The refreshed STORME is expected only in mid-2015. That's too far off IMO.

http://www.autocarindia.com/auto-new...15-391380.aspx

Depends. Not if its getting a new heart. And one can wait. The way I look at it, a car is not something I buy and sell every couple of years. Unlike many of my bikes. So a few months here or there or even a year is worth it if there's something really worth it at the end of that wait. The Storme was really worth it over the Safari for me. So I waited. A 150 bhp 6 speed Storme would really be worth it over a 140 bhp 5 speed one. So I would wait.

Problem is, no one really knows whether the updated Storme is going to get the new engine and gearbox in the first place, so that's the gamble.

Frankly, I think the Storme has replaced the Aria as the company's flagship. So if the Aria got the new motor, I don't see any reason why the Storme will not. If anything, the company might have felt the sales of the Aria were not as big a risk as those of the Storme in terms of trying out (field testing) a new untried motor. The few months lead time and vital field experience would help the company tweak and iron it out before introducing it into the vehicle for whom the sales really matter.

[esteemedpunter]

Right rear shock absorber developed a leak within 3 months/5000 clicks of buying the vehicle!!! Tata and their Quality checks, when will they wake up? Apart from this the beast is a great touring vehicle. Did a 3000 kms round trip to Calcutta and the beast performed admirably!

[amitk26]

Originally Posted by hyper-VTEC

3. What are the options for after-market ICE without voiding warranty

TML sells all parts over the counter buy a wiring harness for HU and insist your installer to use the harness , Be on top of the installer , stand right there and don't accept offer to sit in shade while the installation is done.
Don't let him cut any wire.. This is not just for storme but any vehicle you buy and get ICE fitted aftermarket

BTW Tata Motors is one of the most generous company when it comes to warranty , I have been rating there service over Honda and Maruti ( other cars I own/owned) in many threads but people don't believe this time J.D. Powers rating also state the same.

[hyper-VTEC]

Originally Posted by ebonho

My honest suggestion having been in the same boat once (so I know the torture and the attraction to give in and take the plunge) is that you wait.

I would have eyes closed bought the current Storme and driven a really HARD year ending bargain.

Thanks for the suggestion. I waited...and waited long. The only thing that interested me was the engine upgrade (almost certain), 6 speed shifter (i doubt) and the Harman ICE.

Hormazd mentioned (in a recent Autocar episode) that the new Storme may get captain seats, upgraded engine, front facing seats and will come not before April - May 2015. Before that TATA will bring in the Bolt and the updated Nano. I doubt if TATA will be able to dish out these and have time for the Storme by Diwali.

We have already outgrown our existing ride (2007, Swift Petrol, 67000Kms run) and with the recent addition to the family the Little One's car seat, pram and bags demands more space and safety. Knowing that Tata cars are re-sale blunders we decided to go ahead and take the plunge. It was easy to convince my spouse as well since she also likes the Storme very much

We are geared to give the Tata dealers in Chennai a good HARD push for discounts - slow moving vehicle + year end + new model round the corner.

[4x4addict]

Originally Posted by ebonho

Personally, if someone tried to cut corners and give me thinner gauge sheet metal in the doors, bonnet, etc. to lose some weight, I'd simply say "why bother" and walk away. I would not want my Storme to lose any of its "tank" like character.

It is a misconception/myth that a heavier vehicle is a safer vehicle. The thinkness of sheetmetal is irrelavant to safety in a car. They key is to to have a proper frame and crumple zones. The heaviness of the bonnet doesn't matter.