[jeeva]

Originally Posted by shivshanker

Hello Jeeva,

No, my problem is totally erratic, can happen anytime happens also on long runs, please can you provide more details as to where were these suspected connections inside the cabin or in the engine bay

In my case it was a loose fan connector. Moisture had seeped in and whenever the fan is supposed to kick in, the AC relay used to rattle away to hell. Had a hard time troubleshooting it. The ASC folks wanted to change the temperature sensor, expansion valve, thermostat and all!

[Dr_MNC_SK]

Originally Posted by crdi

Hi all, i am two months into the ownership of a thar. Can someone guide me about the autolocking hubs at the front and answer a few queries please. Being a newbie of 4wd, my knowledge is limited.

1) My understanding is that the locking of the front hubs occur as the front propeller shaft drives the axles to the wheels, in the 4wd mode, right?. If so, why the auto/manual hubs? Why can't they behave in same way as the rear wheels do when they are driven by the propeller or when coasting in neutral without any drive from the propeller?

2) Isn't there a differential for the front? Or is that too managed by the hub locking/unlocking?

3) Does the clicking sound always occur from the hubs while starting to move forwards/backwards, irrespective of drive modes?

4) Is the mechanical differential locker of the rear always in action at slow speeds, irrespective of drive modes? It is a real pain at slow u-turns and i think my clutch will wear out faster.

5) I have a terrible feeling that my vehicle is always in 4wd, no matter how much of reversing, 2wd/4wd shifting i do. I have noticed that the propeller to the front and the drive axles of front wheels rotating as the vehicle moves forwards or backwards in 2wd mode. The rotation of both happens even when the vehicle is pushed forwards or backwards in neutral. Is it normal? If not, what could be malfunctioning? Hubs? Gear box? 2wd/4wd shifter linkage?

Done about 2500 kms now and is due for the first service in a few weeks. Thanks in advance.

Hello, Understanding a part time 4*4 is essential for effective usage and proper maintenance of the same. Your Thar CRDe is a part time 4*4 which means it should be on 2 wheel rear wheel drive mode on most occasions when traction is good. Now coming to your queries

1. Normally your front wheel are free to rotate. In 2 WD mode. That is like normal cars the two wheels rotate independently at two end of the axle. But when you engage 4 wd high or low then engine power is transmitted to the front wheels. This has to happen in two places- from engine to front propeller which is done by the gear. And from propeller to the wheels. Because if the propellor is always fixed to wheel then then normally propellor will passively rotate in 2 WD mode and cause extra wear and tear and also steering issues. Hence the auto or the manual locking hubs.

2. Differntial is there in front also else you wont be able to steer in 4 wd mode. Differential is the linkage which allows the two wheels in the same axle to rotate different amount as in while taking a turn.

3. What clicking sound are you talking about? Sorry i havent read prior posts if you have mentioned about it. When 4wd is engaged and later when you disengage and reverse you will hear click of unlocking. If it doesn't unlock there will be a constant grrrr while reversing if you notice carefully.

4. Yes the MLD of rear is always in action. I fail to understand how it is spoiling your clutch or how you find it at your disadvantage. Yes one should be careful of it suddenly coming in play and causing the vehicle to literally jerk to one side especially in narrow places.

5. What are the tell tale symptims that makes you feel the vehicle is in 4 wd. Steering will be heacy and foretelling of windup is possible. I think your front hubs are unlocked. Check lever of 4wd and confirm it to 2 wd. Then jack one front wheel at a time and rotate it by hand and see if propellor shaft rotates. If yes hubs failed to unlock. You an take to ASS and ask them to open the hub once and realign it and put it back. A work at home if you have tools including a snug nose plier and required allen keys.

[crdi]

Originally Posted by Dr_MNC_SK

What are the tell tale symptims that makes you feel the vehicle is in 4 wd. Steering will be heacy and foretelling of windup is possible. I think your front hubs are unlocked. Check lever of 4wd and confirm it to 2 wd. Then jack one front wheel at a time and rotate it by hand and see if propellor shaft rotates. If yes hubs failed to unlock. You an take to ASS and ask them to open the hub once and realign it and put it back. A work at home if you have tools including a snug nose plier and required allen keys.

Big thanks dr_mnc_sk, so the auto hubs are there for preventing the wheels from rotating the propeller shaft when the vehicle is moving in the 2wd mode. Didn't know that there would be steering issues if that happens.
There is single or sometimes two metallic 'klunk' like noise from the front of the vehicle, when it just begins to move forwards or backwards. The manual mentions about a 'click' noise from the hubs, on them locking/unlocking. So i am thinking it is that noise, just don't know whether it is unlocking or locking.
When making a tight 'u' turn, if the vehicle speed is slow ( around 10-15 kph ) and as the steering comes to full lock position, it feels as if someone has stepped on the brakes suddenly and more of a clutch/throttle modulation is required to prevent stalling the vehicle. Hence the clutch wear apprehension. The squeaking of rear tyres as i execute such turns, might be the m-locker acting, i guess.
The thing which worries me most is that, even though the power steering remains light and behaves constantly like that without any noticable tightness ever, at times when accelerating or even while cruising even on silky smooth roads, there is a single thud every few hundred meters or so. It feels as if the front tyre just went through a single 5-6 cm sized stone. I have stopped and searched the road many times. But not even a small pebble could be found. It never happens when coasting in neutral. I am worried that it might be the sudden release of some torque build up between the front and back wheels. Or something going wrong with the front hub-locks/axles/differential/propeller/2wd-4wd shifter.
Thanks again for the jacking up & wheel rotating suggestion. I shall do the same and get back to you.

[Dr_MNC_SK]

Originally Posted by crdi

When making a tight 'u' turn, if the vehicle speed is slow ( around 10-15 kph ) and as the steering comes to full lock position, it feels as if someone has stepped on the brakes suddenly and more of a clutch/throttle modulation is required to prevent stalling the vehicle. Hence the clutch wear apprehension. The squeaking of rear tyres as i execute such turns, might be the m-locker acting, i

Please check your lever position. I am afraid it looks like you are driving on 4 H and transmission windout is underway and buckling and releasing at times. Please note that the 2 WD position of the gear is extremely ahead and not vertical. It has a slight angle say 75-80 degrees. And like in my case the dashboard indication light can be totally misleading. Please get back with the lever position and the status o the propeller after jacking up. And with diff lock you shouldnt be getting squealing. Rather your vehicle can jerk to one side when it gets activated all of a sudden on losing traction.

[crdi]

Originally Posted by Dr_MNC_SK

Please check your lever position. I am afraid it looks like you are driving on 4 H and transmission windout is underway and buckling and releasing at times. Please note that the 2 WD position of the gear is extremely ahead and not vertical. It has a slight angle say 75-80 degrees.

Hi dr_mnc_sk, the drive mode shifter is kept at the 2H position always ( the extreme forward and with the 80/75 degree forward lean of the lever as you had described).
Tried to rotate the front wheel as the front was jacked up, gear lever in neutral and the other lever in 2H position and engine off. To my surprise, the tyres didn't move more than a couple of inches in any direction and the propeller was also moving with those few inches of backward/forward movement of the tyres. It was the same finding with both right and left front tyres. Double checked lever positions and gear lever was in neutral and drive mode shifter in 2H.
Just to check what might be wrong, started the engine in the same jacked up position and checked wheel rotation, again it was the same story with both front wheels. Then with the engine running and gear in neutral, changed the drive mode shifter to 4H, again checked the front wheels, then too the front tyres weren't moving more than a few inches as I tried rotating them jacked up.
Then, in the same state, i.e. engine running, gear lever in neutral, pulled back the drive mode shifter to neutral and there was an on and off metallic 'krrrr' sound, (similar to what one might hear while shifting gears without disengaging the clutch completely) I immediately moved the drive mode shifter a little bit and the sound disappeared. Checked the front jacked up wheel rotation and i was really happy to see them moving freely and without any propeller movement. Changed the drive drive mode shifter to 2H, checked the front jacked up tyre rotation with the engine running and gear in neutral & drive mode shifter in 2H and boy! I was happy to see the front wheels rotate freely and without any propeller movements.
Thought the problem was solved, but the joy was short lived. I removed the jack, and parked the vehicle without touching the drive mode shifter. But as i was parking, heard the 'klunk' noise from the front wheels again, forcing me to check the wheels and again it was found that the jacked up front wheel was not moving more than a few inches.
Repeated the whole exercise over and over and the final diagnosis was that, once the drive mode shifter is brought to neutral( which itself was not occurring smoothly always, with some grinding noises at times occurring if the engine is running, even with a fully depressed clutch pedal), the front wheels rotate freely on jacking up, but as the vehicle is driven a few meters, irrespective of 2H/4H/4L drive modes or front or reverse directions, the non rotation of jacked up front wheel recurs again.
I think the transfer case might be playing foul. I have stopped using the vehicle for now. Will take it to the ASS soon. Could you tell me how to frame my complaint so that they don't just lubricate something and send back the vehicle.

[Dr_MNC_SK]

Dear Crdi, this is your front auto hubs playing culprit. Just go to the ass and first ask if they have a personal trained for manual shifter 4*4 i.e thar and bolero pick ups etc. If they have then ask him to diagnose , he should be able to pin point the hub open it and check the teeth alignment and fix it back. Else if they dont have pleade ask them to source one like i did in Gangtok when they didn't hae and the regular chap could make no heads or tails of it. He even suggested me to drive in 4h saying this is correct and the sensor of the dashboard light is faulty. This is not a serious problem will easily be sorted if they know what they are doing.

[crdi]

Originally Posted by Dr_MNC_SK

Dear Crdi, this is your front auto hubs playing culprit. Just go to the ass and first ask if they have a personal trained for manual shifter 4*4 i.e thar and bolero pick ups etc. If they have then ask him to diagnose.

Thanks, will get back after the service centre visit. May be in 2-3 days.

[johy]

Originally Posted by Dr_MNC_SK

5. What are the tell tale symptims that makes you feel the vehicle is in 4 wd. Steering will be heacy and foretelling of windup is possible. I think your front hubs are unlocked. Check lever of 4wd and confirm it to 2 wd. Then jack one front wheel at a time and rotate it by hand and see if propellor shaft rotates. If yes hubs failed to unlock. You an take to ASS and ask them to open the hub once and realign it and put it back. A work at home if you have tools including a snug nose plier and required allen keys.

Hi there, I have been reading the posts with interest and being a newbie with 4WDs would like your input. My steering seems to be heavier than earlier (in my case compared to when I had the stock steel wheels). I attributed that to wider rims now (8J, but stock size tires). But still I find that when stopped, the steering is much too tight sometimes. I will try jacking up and see what is going on.

The other issue is squeaking rear tires on tight turns. I have experienced it on the Rohini road, and another member on the forums (blackpearl) mentioned in the 2015 Thar thread that he has found all Thars that he has driven squeak in the rear wheels on sharp turns.

Another issue in have felt sometimes is the gear not slotting, going from 3 to 4 (at higher speeds). I have to do it slowly and "search" the sloy. Has happened a couple of times in the 2500 odd kms.

Thanks in advance.

[DHABHAR.BEHRAM]

Originally Posted by shivshanker

Getting Mahindra A.S.S. guys to open up the dashboard is another uphill task!

Dear Shivshanker - did you do what I told you to do? .

Best regards,

Behram Dhabhar

[hsub]

Originally Posted by shivshanker

Guys, The AC Relay Chatter on my Thar is still unresolved for the past 4 months, getting to me a bit now.

First time it happened, I was told that the grounding wire was loose and they tightened it.

Problem reappears after a few hours and they took it back and kept it for 2 days, claimed they have replaced the Relay, but the persistent Chatter continues.

any suggestions

Cheers!

I have the same issue as well. However I found out that keeping the thermostat around 3/4th of the way helps in getting rid of it. I haven't found the time to go to service centre yet and have been using this jugaad for now.

[Dr_MNC_SK]

Regarding the thermostat of the new thar crde, the problem in my vehicle is that it free wheels all the way around and i dont know if it is working or not, but i notice that ac output is much less cold now. Can i do somrthing to bypass the thermostat thing. Staying in hills, i need AC only to cool the vehicle after it is parked for prolonged period in sun. Else no need of AC, so if it works to a max i would be glad.

[cpbopanna]

Originally Posted by Dr_MNC_SK

Regarding the thermostat of the new thar crde, the problem in my vehicle is that it free wheels all the way around and i dont know if it is working or not, but i notice that ac output is much less cold now. Can i do somrthing to bypass the thermostat thing. Staying in hills, i need AC only to cool the vehicle after it is parked for prolonged period in sun. Else no need of AC, so if it works to a max i would be glad.

Please do not bye-pass the thermostat, I did it once and regretted!
I had to refix the thermostat soon after!

[Dr_MNC_SK]

Hi Cbpopanna,
Can you kindly elaborate the problem you had when you by passed the thermostat.? i guess the AC Condensor will be constantly on with that. The thermostat is creating a ruksus otherwise and ASS is not happy to fix it.

[cpbopanna]

Originally Posted by Dr_MNC_SK

Hi Cbpopanna,
Can you kindly elaborate the problem you had when you by passed the thermostat.? i guess the AC Condensor will be constantly on with that. The thermostat is creating a ruksus otherwise and ASS is not happy to fix it.

Yes, you are right. The condenser will remain continuously on until the air freezes After this, the blower will run dry, since there is no more (gaseous) air to blow!

The problem of chattering occurs if the thermistor is placed too close to the cooling coil. It has to be correctly positioned!

Instead of repeating the whole story; please peruse my thread - link given for your ready reference: http://www.team-bhp.com/forum/test-d...r-crde-10.html

[shivshanker]

Originally Posted by DHABHAR.BEHRAM

Dear Shivshanker - did you do what I told you to do? .

Best regards,

Behram Dhabhar

Nahi Sir, kid down with chicken pox no time for my other kid (the thar) will do it in a day or two after the scabs fall off.