[Sam Kapasi]

Buffet I have emailed our Car Audio Operations manager, Ashok Venugopal, right now. Ashok is based in our Bangalore office.He will call you today and find a way today itself to make sure you get what you want. Thanks once again for that important feedback. Expect Mr. Venugopals call today.
Cheers

[navin]

Originally Posted by aseem

Sound is always a personal experience! You're building your personal car audio system, not someone else's. Sound not appreciated by a friend or car audio judge is not bad sound. You have to listen to your system, choose what you think sounds best!

having not heard the smaller brands like Boss (untill you mentioned them I had no idea they existed) I will reserve my judgement but...
beyond providing good sound I would be biased towards those brands that offer excellent customer service. Alpine, Marantz (home), Technics (Pro DJ), etc.. offer service that is proactive.

I will tell you that many years ago Alpine calibrated the azimuth of my car tape deck with my Denon home tape decks. I did not even have to carry my tape decks to them. Denon had given me 2 calibrated DRM 30HX modifed with a glass head. It was a machine that was not commercially available.

I suppled Alpine with their HU and 2 tapes made using Test CDs (from HFNRR and Stereophile) and they were nice enough to do this for me. NO CHARGE!

Marantz has modified my CD players and CD writer with new power supply and other mods again at no charge and in this case they contacted me and not the other way around.

Technics used to regularly call up radio stations and ask about the serivce of their SL1200 tables that just about everyone used. I know I helped run a Radio Station in NYC somewhere in the 80s.

Closer to home I had a small executive system from Sony (CMT-VP11) serviced at a Sony shop in Shastri Nagar, Santa Cruz W. After 45 days I get a call from them asking if the system was still functioning and informing me that if it was not I could bring it in for a free service.

Prashant at Autobahn Skoda is in regualr touch with me on my car. About once a week he calls me (I dont call him) to tell me when I can expect certain parts and service. He even sent someone to do a service at my office (Air bag controller change).

I am not sure if Pioneer or Boss are equipped to offer this level of service.

[Sam Kapasi]

Spot on Navin. I agree 100%. There are companies that setup divisions related to customer satisfaction and feedback. I will always recommend these brands to anyone.

[aseem]

This forum is about sharing information based on our experiences. Navin you have a good experience with Alpine and you have shared this with us. Based on this advise I have encouraged all my freinds to go for Alpine head units as opposed to any other brand in 13-20k price range. However I have been doing some research of my own on Alpine and JBL and I think we have overlooked certain shortcomings of these products.

Alpine no doubt makes on of the best sounding Head Units, however like all Head Units Alpine are prone to problems as well which we have not highlighted in this thread. I would like to point to these problems:

-Alpine head units have very bad radio reception. Alpine is recommended for users that listen to mostly CD's and MP3's
-The new series of Alpine 985X is having all sorts of problems
1) Users can not eject CD's and the CD gets stuck inside the HU
2) They have to turn the internal IC (internal amp) off else the CD keeps getting stuck
3) Alpine is aware of the problem but still denies openly about this
4) Though they are saying they have fixed the problem in new HU's they havent done a recall for the old HU's
5) People have to pay Alpine to get their CD's out, and still the problem is not fixed, it keeps persisting

Please read the thread below and you will know what I am talking about:

http://forum.ecoustics.com/bbs/messages/4/138435.html

As far as JBL is concerned, I agree completely with Sam that one should buy speakers from manufacturers that specialize in that product and dont manufacture anything else. However off late the trend in audio has been to focus more on the highs and the lows. This attracts the younger buyers, and allows the dealers to give a good demo of their system. However in a long drive, the highs and the lows become really irritating. Good music is one that once you close your eyes, you can not tell whether you are in a live concert or in a car. JBL as per my experience makes speakers that focus on highs, which get a little irritating in the longer run. I can post millions of threads where users have experienced the same. I am not doubting the quality and after sale support of JBL, I am sure with guy like Sam leading the pack, they must be world class. But I am talking about the basic, simple, audio.
Lastly coming to Boss. The only reason I liked Boss was that they sounded more neutral than JBL and thats my PERSONAL opinion. They do make some good amplifiers and I have read about user experiences of people who have bought BOSS in US, they are true VFM. I will not recommend them for high-budget folks, as they probably use cheaper components. Navin below is the link for Boss Audio and the products they offer:
http://www.bossaudio.com/home/catalo...Ns=1&deptNum=3

Please take the above mentioned information in good spirit.

[navin]

Sam, I am talking about PRO active customer service. Thanks to their serivce...
I got 3 Marantz CD players and a CD writer, an Alpine HU in all my cars incl. for my nephew and niece, Skoda Octavias for myself and my 2 brothers (one L&K and one Auto), and Technics still has a virtual monopoly on the DJ table market. In fact even today my nephew uses a 1200 with a 680EE. I used the same table-cartridge combo 25 years ago! now that is called longevity!

[Buffetfan]

[quote]

Originally Posted by aseem

1) Users can not eject CD's and the CD gets stuck inside the HU
2) They have to turn the internal IC (internal amp) off else the CD keeps getting stuck
3) QUOTE]

Dear friends..,
I have a DEHP7450 Pioneer HU in my car...Paid about 17k for it when I bought it. (one of those fancy displays..) came with a 2 year warranty and an year of insurance...

I am also facing this CD stuck problem..only diff is that CD comes out by only an inch and goes back in again....once in 5 tries it comes out completely but in general you need to be on your toes ...

Since my dealer has offered to replace it..I am thinking of going in for another HU...the only thing I want is

1. an EQualiser..
2. Steering mounted remote (Cannot tell how easy and SAFE it is to use the system with this while driving)..my pioneer has both these...

any suggestions are welcome

[aseem]

Consider Alpine 983X series systems. The best would be 9833, Mood got it for 16.6k with b & w. I personally have Sony 8800, and I love this system. It also has a wired remote, which is more like an indicator knob as opposed to going on the steering. As far as I last read, the Alpine's dont support the wired remote on the steering option. Navin might shed some more light on this.

[Buffetfan]

Sam..thanks..for the help...

[Sam Kapasi]

Aseem,

Thank you for all that information. Whenever Navin and I recommend something, it is purely because we believe it sounds best at the given price and because there is some effort going towards customer satisfaction. We've never insisted on the purchase of a certain brand and should people tell us (in India) that the quality of an Alpine sucks, i'm sure we'd stop recommending it.

I can show you forums where people think the quality of BMWs suck. Still stands as the worlds most recommended car. Their experiences and opinions are there for the worlds to see and possibly to blindly follow. You will find a thread in every forum where people disagree. Thats the simple joy of being human, you dont have to agree.

Did you read the post#826 where i explained why i thought Boss was bad? I wasnt doubting your take on the product, i was merely stating my take on the product.

I dont think we're doubting anything that you're saying. Your opinion carries as much value as anyone elses even though your experience in these matters is very, very little.
Please dont make this forum a "me against the world" too. We're all friends here, and we all love one thing, good sound.
So YOU please take everything in good spirit too. Thanks

[Sam Kapasi]

Originally Posted by Buffetfan

Sam..thanks..for the help...

Ashok just called me. Told me you two had a word and you recieving all the equipment you wanted tomorrow itself.
enjoy amigo.

Cheers,
Your friendly neighbourhood Sam

[navin]

Originally Posted by aseem

Consider Alpine 983X series systems. The best would be 9833, Mood got it for 16.6k with b & w. I personally have Sony 8800, and I love this system. It also has a wired remote, which is more like an indicator knob as opposed to going on the steering. As far as I last read, the Alpine's dont support the wired remote on the steering option. Navin might shed some more light on this.

I have seen the pioneer 8800 not the sony. confusing when two of them have the same model numbers!

the 9835 is considered the best of the 983x alpines. it was not available when i wanted my 983x so i got the 9833. I have used alpines for 25 years and probably been fortunate in always getting the right ones.

the more you pack into a HU the more problems you have. I suspect Alpine Glide Touch must make the internals of the 985x HUs hot. It is the way that they implented it. The tried to copy the ipod nav button and made a hash of it. The fix though simple would have to a design fix and cannot be carried on to models with the older glide touch. Also the fix I feel will not be as aesthetic as the present glide touch. Maybe Alpine can offer some sort of fan cooling for the HU. :-)

my 7385 bought in 1987 still works and untill recently was in pristine shape. what a drop from a window could not do a garage mechanic did. I might forgive him but i wont forget it. the garage probably in their zeal to clean my car used the cleaner (what ever it was) on my HU. A lot of the button names got rubbed off and some of the panel even faded a bit. OUCH! I am still mad and this happened 6 months ago.

alpine HUs can be configured to work with some car's steerwheel remotes.
see...
http://www.alpine-europe.com/content...d-Vehicles.htm
http://www.alpine-europe.com/content...nguage=english

but they dot not offer other steering wheel remote controls. I find this add of interferes with my 10-2 postion on the steering wheel.

to really be honest i am happy with all alpine HUs but only satisfied with a few HUs from the others hence i recommend Alpine as it is easy for me to do so. Recomending the Sony 8800 but not the 5500 for example (just an example) can get tiresome as model numbers and prices change so fast.

I am not protecting Alpine at all. I just want them to make a better HU. Like the title of Jimmy Carter's autobigraphy "Why not the best?". In fact I would like all manufactuers to improve their HUs. There is always room even for Nakamichi and Becker.

If I do find that my friends are having troble with their 985x series HUs (so far no one i know has one) I will be the first to stop recomending Alpine. I might even flame them. And I believe that they will listen.

I am not part of the audio business. Never was and probably never will be. I have made some friends (and maybe some who hate me) in this business partly as I used to contonusly nag them for parts and upgrades etc. I was the proverbial pain the B*TT. Some of them must secrectly thank my son for diverting my attention so I dont bother then anymore. :-)

I do NOT have any commercial, social, or any interest in the success or faliure of ANY brand. I do nag all I know to produce better products and offer more VFM. I used to go to CESs and AV shows untill a recent episode at one has convinced me to do otherwise.

The Audio business worldwide is very small. It is also quite old. everyone knows everyone and there is a certain degree of politics in it. I used to think not being part of the business allowed me some degree of immunity from all this infighting and politics but when having a cuppa joe with one manufacturer upsets another i decided to stay away.

[navin]

[quote=aseem]
Alpine no doubt makes on of the best sounding Head Units

-Alpine head units have very bad radio reception. [quote]

1. Alpine makes one of the best sounding HU - Touche'
2. Yes Pioneer's Super Tuner has always been better but since when did FM provide better sound that CD?

[Sam Kapasi]

Originally Posted by navin

I am not part of the audio business. Never was and probably never will be. I have made some friends (and maybe some who hate me) in this business.

I can vouch for that. The man loves his audio, often putting people like me to complete shame. You oughta listen to what he says. I know I do. Honestly Navin, I learn from you everyday. I said it to you on the phone and I'll say it here too. Your not being part of the audio business fraternity (if there is such a thing) is OUR loss.

Originally Posted by navin

I do NOT have any commercial, social, or any interest in the success or faliure of ANY brand.

YEAH! YEAH! Neither do I!

Nonono wait... thats not entirely true...

[navin]

and before i am called an alpine stooge check this out...
http://forums.ilounge.com/showthread...hreadid=114560

[navin]

Thanks Sam. I know the business. I know the kind of investments one has to make. Fortunately I have other things i am as excited about as audio (RFid, Hovercrafts, Magnets, photography, child psychology, etc. etc..) that keep me fully occupied. BTW we will soon be sending one of our prodcuts (air jack) to the South Pole. After that is done we can proudly claim to be one of the few companies that has a product on every continent. Most probably the only comapny with annual sales less than $4 million.