[Ragavsr]

Originally Posted by landcruiser123

I'm not sure you should do that as support for phones stops after about 18 months.

Regarding your requirement, I think Moto G4 will do just fine. Has a nice 5.5" screen and most features you can ask for. Just buy the version with 32GB internal storage and 3GB of RAM. I have stopped asking people to buy the Nexus 5X as this phone offers good value.

The moto G4 doesn't have waterproofing though, the old G3 & G Turbo has it.

The OS updates stop after 2 years / 24 months for most flagship models. When I bought the S4 last May ( May 2015 ) , it was a two year old model ( S4 was released April 2013) .

At the time I bought it, it had the latest OS lollipop 5.0.2 . It was then updated to 5.1 and then it received a few security updates as well.

The software once stable would work for at least 2+ years as long as the apps support that version of android.

At the end of the day buying an older flagship is a compromise.But at 1/3 the flagship price I can update it yearly .It is quite the same as buying a new model and keeping it for 3 years.

A two year old flagship is still better than most midrange handsets. The cameras on mid end phones don't make the cut, they miss out on a lot of sensors.

While I am a heavy user, browsing, listening music, seeing videos, basic apps like uber , ola ,paytm and taking pictures , the older flagships tend to excel in that.

The main issue is I am careless and I drop phones often. Even if they don't break , they leave all sorts of dents scratches . A lower priced phone would let me update it every year thus looking newer ( at least visually) and if damaged the loss won't be high.

[tacho9000]

Originally Posted by petrolhead_neel

Hi all,

I got my G4 Plus. First impressions are really positive. The icing on the cake is that I got one from the older lot of devices, which means it shipped with the TurboPower 25 charger with the undetachable cable (not USB). I will be sharing a review very soon!

Neel

Neel many many congratulations on your new phone. As a user of Moto G3 I know the pleasures of using vanilla android and find the free RAM to be in the range of 1100-1200MB. Pleasures of life if you may say. Enjoy the phone. And get a hybrid tough case so that this time the phone if falls accidentally the case will be able to take the brunt of the fall without damaging the phone.

Originally Posted by Ragavsr

Thanks. I am a big fan of stock android as well. I have a Moto E 1st gen which frankly performs basic tasks better than my S4 .

Moto X Play / Moto G4 Plus do come out as top choices .

How is the Moto Turbo ( Not the Moto G Turbo) and Moto X Force? Especially the camera part?

Thought of upgrading to a Galaxy S5 which is being sold for 17000, but the horrendous software scares me . Also it doesn't have 4G - a prerequisite as I am getting used to seamless Reliance Jio 4G everywhere.

The sad thing is HTC and Sony don't have any worthy phones in this price range. The Samsung's mid end phones taunt you for buying a cheap phone every time u use it by the lack of any sensors.

Nexus 6P which was available for 30K is off the shelves as well

Dear Ragavsr why put in so much money into a new phone when you have midrangers phones which can do all you want from a high end flagship grade phone. This beats me. Except if you're talking about the shatterproof screen that's a reason to buy but then again is it really needed to splurge so much on a handset which I'm assuming you won't be using for more than 18months. If this change cycle is followed then I'd suggest you to get a phone with it's basics done right at reasonable price for which I'll recommend the Moto G4 Plus/Moto G4 eyes closed. Plus it will continue to recieve support till the end of the life cycle of your personal usage at 18months.

Originally Posted by Thad E Ginathom

New phone every 18 months? Not money that I am going to spend, even if I had it (as long as I keep out of floods, of course).

How define support? It will go on working, right? And although updates occasionally come with fixes we actually care about, or facilities we actually want, it is really not necessary to be up to the very day with the latest release of all and everything.

(and, hey, apparently the vast majority of Android users are still on 5.something)

Phones are getting cheaper --- but they are not so cheap that they have become throw-away consumables yet, even thought the makers want us to think that way.

Thad sir a brilliant point raised by you. I had a Micromax Canvas Nitro which till the screen damage fiasco was perfectly usable. Post the replacement it sort of started giving trouble due to which I had to sell it off and buy a Moto G3. Had the screen not got damaged I'm sure I'd have used it for another year or so. Using the Moto G3 I can say that it is going to see a minimum of 24months worth of use before any thoughts come up to look for replacement except if any kind of damage occurs. I'm happy with my budget Midranger phone that much.

Regards,
Subhra

[para_7k]

Originally Posted by tacho9000

Thad sir a brilliant point raised by you. I had a Micromax Canvas Nitro which till the screen damage fiasco was perfectly usable. Post the replacement it sort

I have exactly the same two devices as you do. I got a canvas Nitro for my mom. Though the phone was good on paper, the software was a big let down.

Too much of bloatware and trending apps keep coming in the notification. Some apps were even auto installing and eating a lot of background data.

I now installed Cyanogen Mod and got rid of those. Yet, the RAM usage seems to be more than 70% always even after a full reset.

. Any bright idea to improve it ?

[tacho9000]

Originally Posted by para_7k

I have exactly the same two devices as you do. I got a canvas Nitro for my mom. Though the phone was good on paper, the software was a big let down.

Too much of bloatware and trending apps keep coming in the notification. Some apps were even auto installing and eating a lot of background data.

I now installed Cyanogen Mod and got rid of those. Yet, the RAM usage seems to be more than 70% always even after a full reset.

. Any bright idea to improve it ?

I doubt it will improve para_7k. In my phone I had disable majority of the inbuilt apps so had some leeway in terms of ram consumption. However even if with CM it isn't decreasing i don't think it will ever decrease. The OEM software was a big joke indeed btw. Now I've sold it. I loved the phone till it was working but after getting onto the Moto G3 band I doubt I'll ever be able to go back to that joke of a stock ROM that Micromax had supplied. For your information my uncle who has a Juice 3 is facing major problem in his phone with unwanted app data consumption and regular slowdown of his handset. I wish Micromax learns something about stock android and applies them to its top end handsets. Would've been a wonderful experience and a joy to use with that good specifications.

Regards,
Subhra

[BaCkSeAtDrIVeR]

Why no USB mass storage mode on my MotoG4? MIDI, PTP, MTP, and charging. That's all it shows when USB is plugged in. why make poor me jump through all these hoops?

I had to use gphotofs an my PC. (I use Linux). Not an issue, but prevents direct transfer of files from the SD card on the old phone to the new one a pain, coz. PC gets confused about which phone to mount using gphotofs.

[Thad E Ginathom]

Originally Posted by landcruiser123

Valid point you have there sir.

Thanks! One could buy a new phone every week, just for gadget-loving shopoholic fun! But economic reality is very different. I really consider two years to be an absolute minimum.

But important security patches aren't really updated on older phones.

They didn't even exist, prior to Android 6, did they? That means >90% of current Android users do not have that reason to change.

You can easily use any decent phone for 30 months, after which it'll slow down based on the usage.

Haha, computers the way Microsoft taught us to expect them to behave!

Depending on usage, yes. My wife's tablet has slowed to a crawl, but mine, of the same type, has not. She knows that a factory reset and start over is needed, and will get around to it one day --- who knows when, but it is going to happen a lot sooner than buying a new one!

Of course, even if our device has not slowed down, when we see the better-performance new model, we are inclined towards desire. But then, if we bite, we really are getting something that we want for our money

Phone companies follow the US phone buying model. Buy, use for two years and change. In their case, they return the phones, we can't.

Subsidised phone-with-contract business has indeed helped to condition people to expect a new one every couple of years. I don't know about my UK mother country, but I heard that that business model is changing in US.

People who enjoy shopping a free and welcome to spend their own cash as and when they wish, and I wish them joy of it! We should be careful about calmly accepting the disposable-item view that the manufacturers would like us to have!

(I wonder... how long will my non-user-changeable battery last? And will a service centre be able to change it when it does die? This is probably the biggest planned-obsolescence dirty trick of all )

[landcruiser123]

Originally Posted by Thad E Ginathom

They didn't even exist, prior to Android 6, did they? That means >90% of current Android users do not have that reason to change.

No security patch levels can be seen even on my phone with 5.1.1.

(I wonder... how long will my non-user-changeable battery last? And will a service centre be able to change it when it does die? This is probably the biggest planned-obsolescence dirty trick of all )

Well, no one in my family has ever changed a battery in a phone. I know my dad who never changed the battery during the 4 years when he used the Nokia E72.

Batteries do last for about 3 years without too much degradation. One thing we do at home: Charge all phones on a UPS.

All non-removable batteries can be changed. It just needs a little effort on your part (to go to a service center) and the technician.

Originally Posted by tacho9000

Neel many many congratulations on your new phone. As a user of Moto G3 I know the pleasures of using vanilla android and find the free RAM to be in the range of 1100-1200MB. Pleasures of life if you may say.

That's surprising. I see only about 700-800 mb free on my mom's phone. She doesn't have FB, Twittter etc.

Anyway, RAM is a resource that is meant to be used.

[condor]

Originally Posted by Thad E Ginathom

(I wonder... how long will my non-user-changeable battery last? And will a service centre be able to change it when it does die?

Batteries would be batteries. Life of the battery should not depend on it being user-changeable or not.

Even batteries that "not user-changeable" are available for purchase.

My Xperia's battery is going fine at 3 yrs now.

And if it goes down, then a service center / technician should be able to help. IMO, the main thing about not being user-changeable would be - how to change it. Such phones seem to have a slightly complicated way of disassembly, hence making it "non user-changeable".

[phamilyman]

Originally Posted by para_7k

I now installed Cyanogen Mod and got rid of those. Yet, the RAM usage seems to be more than 70% always even after a full reset.

. Any bright idea to improve it ?

Its time for us to re calibrate our thoughts aka
"how i learned to stop worrying and love the low available RAM"


How does the free RAM matter to you unless its a low number like 10-20 MB? Android is now better at memory management and takes care of closing apps automatically.

As long as the phone is responsive esp for multitasking, you should be happy, instead of worrying about academic data that beyond a minimum threshold has little bearing on your user experience. Is your phone responsive in opening new apps or switching between them? If so, then chill!

My RN3 has 500-800 MB of 3GB free at any time (16%-23%). But it flies and multi-tasking is a joy. That's all that matters to me now.

[tacho9000]

Originally Posted by landcruiser123

That's surprising. I see only about 700-800 mb free on my mom's phone. She doesn't have FB, Twittter etc.

Anyway, RAM is a resource that is meant to be used.

Dear landcruiser123 it is indeed that free 60% times and no I'm not a light user. Have quite a decent number of apps in my phone. Only deleted the FB app and now sometimes I see the below shown RAM free in system and I've taken the screenshot to keep a proof of the brilliant RAM management of android.



But I'll agree most of the times it roams about in the 900-1100MB range and goes till this much say about 10% of the time I use the phone.

Present RAM consumption is as shown below



Regards,
Subhra

[Thad E Ginathom]

Originally Posted by phamilyman

Its time for us to re calibrate our thoughts aka
"how i learned to stop worrying and love the low available RAM"


How does the free RAM matter to you unless its a low number like 10-20 MB? Android is now better at memory management and takes care of closing apps automatically.

As long as the phone is responsive esp for multitasking, you should be happy, instead of worrying about academic data that beyond a minimum threshold has little bearing on your user experience. Is your phone responsive in opening new apps or switching between them? If so, then chill!

My RN3 has 500-800 MB of 3GB free at any time (16%-23%). But it flies and multi-tasking is a joy. That's all that matters to me now.

Yes, yes, and yes again! People are obsessed with paying for memory that remains unused --- just so they can sit and watch it being unused!

I am no deep computer scientist, but here is lesson 1 in *nix (it's a Linux kernel, right?) memory management. Going way back to the granddaddy operating system, Unix does not clear memory unless it needs it. First, it might need what's in that memory (eg a commonly used program) and second, explicitly emptying it is a waste of time and effort.

Thanks for the comments about batteries. I still have my doubts that service centres will hold stocks of replacements when the phone is over two years old, but perhaps I should have more faith in the market in general. I did user-replace my Defy+ battery when it ceased to hold charge for a practically long-enough time.

[landcruiser123]

Originally Posted by phamilyman

Its time for us to re calibrate our thoughts aka
"how i learned to stop worrying and love the low available RAM"


How does the free RAM matter to you unless its a low number like 10-20 MB? Android is now better at memory management and takes care of closing apps automatically.

Completely agree. If you have less than 50 mb of free RAM, you're a man with a lot of patience and it's time to buy a new phone.

RAM is meant to be used. With good memory management, the phones close apps which aren't used for a long time. The app (which you've not used in a long time) might be there in your recent apps list, but it won't takeoff from where you left it.

Example: I'm reading a particular tweet and press home. Press recent apps and load the twitter app:

Case 1: Open twitter after 5 or 10 (or even 20 minutes) minutes: The same screen should be visible. App was in memory.

Case 2: Open twitter after 5 hours (while using different apps during the 5 hour window duration): The app will load from the start and you'll see the recent feed. You won't see the tweet you were reading 5 hours ago. App was not in memory.

Android N wants to remove the apps which you haven't used for hours from the recent apps tray. After all, recent apps should only contain recently used ones.

[para_7k]

Thanks for the insights. I do not worry much about the RAM when I have lot of apps running.

My question was, even after a factory reset, with no additional apps, (on a cyanogen Mod which does not even have google apps), the free memory on first boot and there afterwards is only 600-700MB of 2GB.

I am ok if I have a multitude of apps and then the memory usage is high.

At this point, I don't have to worry as it is my secondary phone and I use it only for browsing and youtube videos over WiFi

My point was also on MMX's crappy bloatware where I got only ~400MB out of 2GB free on first boot when I purchased the phone. This, beyond any obsession, is ridiculous.

[breezydrive]

Originally Posted by breezydrive

Have been using Zuk1 for the past one week! Just one word for this phone "Awesome"!

Originally Posted by JMaruru

Are there any heating issues on regular use? Also, how is the camera?

Sorry for a late reply; Touch wood, the phone is working like charm- looks very good, does not feel very heavy in hands despite being 175 gm.

Lenovo claims to put in some coating on the back panel, which is stain resistant/ scratch resistant. I have not experienced any heating issues, absolutely no lags so far.

Infact, I bought this phone for just as stop gap arrangement to replace my Samsung Note 3 neo and would have finally chosen between Mi5 or One plus 3. It was meant for wifey, but looking at the overall performance, I have decided to keep it. What else can you get for 13.5k.

Camera is decent, Lenovo claims to have used Sony sensors. A few pics are here :
http://www.team-bhp.com/forum/offici...ml#post4010638

[Ragavsr]

Originally Posted by landcruiser123

Completely agree. If you have less than 50 mb of free RAM, you're a man with a lot of patience and it's time to buy a new phone.

RAM is meant to be used. With good memory management, the phones close apps which aren't used for a long time. The app (which you've not used in a long time) might be there in your recent apps list, but it won't takeoff from where you left it.

Example: I'm reading a particular tweet and press home. Press recent apps and load the twitter app:

Case 1: Open twitter after 5 or 10 (or even 20 minutes) minutes: The same screen should be visible. App was in memory.

Case 2: Open twitter after 5 hours (while using different apps during the 5 hour window duration): The app will load from the start and you'll see the recent feed. You won't see the tweet you were reading 5 hours ago. App was not in memory.

Android N wants to remove the apps which you haven't used for hours from the recent apps tray. After all, recent apps should only contain recently used ones.

Apps closing by itself is a great nuisance in itself. Probably Android should let us create a priority list on which apps can be shut and which should not.

I use my phone to trade stocks as my great workplace computers won't let you open trading websites. If I spot an opportunity, I would like to execute a trade as soon as possible.

If the app remains in memory , I can execute a trade way quicker than opening an app from start. This is because of a 3 stage security system of a trading app.

This is precisely the reason why I hate Samsung and love my humble bare bones Moto E first gen. The trading app shuts down every 10 minutes in my S4 while the Moto needs only 1-2 logins in the entire trading day of 6.5 hours.

I can't even count the amount of lost money or lost profits because of not being able to execute a trade in time despite spotting an opportunity.

Hey, I need suggestions on how the Nexus 5X 32 GB and the Blackberry Priv perform?

I have a friend who is ready to bring them down here to India. The Priv costs around $400 and the Nexus $290.