[Steeroid]

Originally Posted by merve_extreme

why dont u accept the fact that the europeans are the most advanced continent when it comes to technology.europeans were born invertors.what the world is today is because what the european people invented.The car as a concept is very european in the first place.there is nothing wrong with improving a invention and making it more reliable.but one should not take the credit for that technology.
.........................................
there is no shame or hurt sentiments in accepting these facts.asians on their own would have never managed to make a car or for that matter even invent electricity.

1. Nobody doubted their R&D capabilities, so there is nothing much for me to accept.

2. The Japs still make better cars. Lately, so do the Koreans. The Europeans may have invented manufacturing, but the Japs and Koreans have beaten them at it.

3. As for inventing electricity and cars, let us not forget the Europe has plundered most of the world for at least two centuries, amassing enough wealth to last a few generations. Dont give me that bull**** about the British giving us electricity, railways and telephones - they built the infrastructure to facilitate the transfer of resources and wealth from this country to the island of Great Britain. I was born in a gold mining town (Kolar Gold Fields) where my grandfather and his father had settled during the mining boom - I've heard stories of how much gold was mined from this place, but today its a ghost town - the last 20-25 years have hardly yielded any gold as most of it was taken out before the brits left the country.

Similar stories can be found in other parts of the country and in other parts of the world, notably Africa which has been plundered and looted like no other continent has been. Similarly with the gold and mineral wealth of Latin America.

How else can you explain the wealth of a tiny island smaller than some of our smallest states - a place where they cant even grow their own tea? A place that couldnt bother to find a suitable throne or crown for their regent because they found it easier to steal these? The place called Great Britain has lost its last automotive ikon recently - the brands left over are owned by the Germans, the Americans, the Chinese, the Japs and even the Malaysians (Lotus). The bastion of steel manufacture now imports its steel. Even their favourite tea (Tetley) is owned by the Tatas. Similar stories abound in the rest of europe.

The point I was trying to make is not that the Europeans are bad at what they do - its that the Japs, Koreans, Chinese and others have moved the posts as far as manufacturing is concerned. Perhaps we will move the posts w.r.t services too - its early days yet. In an era when the europeans are looking at the rest of the world to try and understand where they're going wrong, its painful to see the likes of you that are still stuck in the past.

You're free to worship the europeans, but you have no right the belittle the efforts of others...try to be a little less extreme. Wake up and smell the coffee - its definitely not european!

[Samurai]

Originally Posted by Steeroid

3. As for inventing electricity and cars, let us not forget the Europe has plundered most of the world for at least two centuries, amassing enough wealth to last a few generations. Dont give me that bull**** about the British giving us electricity, railways and telephones - they built the infrastructure to facilitate the transfer of resources and wealth from this country to the island of Great Britain.

Heh, heh, your argument belongs in this recent thread where similar sentiments were expressed.

Originally Posted by Steeroid

Similar stories can be found in other parts of the country and in other parts of the world, notably Africa which has been plundered and looted like no other continent has been. Similarly with the gold and mineral wealth of Latin America.

I guess now some South Africans must be thanking the Brits for building the railways, roads, etc., Apartheid is nothing but a fading memory, railway and roads are here to stay...

Now, let's not turn this thread into british rule thread. If members want to discuss british rule, use the other thread shown above, and leave this thread for the original intent.

[merve_extreme]

Originally Posted by Steeroid

Dont give me that bull**** about the British giving us electricity, railways and telephones.

In an era when the europeans are looking at the rest of the world to try and understand where they're going wrong, its painful to see the likes of you that are still stuck in the past.

You're free to worship the europeans, but you have no right the belittle the efforts of others...try to be a little less extreme. Wake up and smell the coffee - its definitely not european!

are u sure u want to continue this thread in a dignified manner.i have neither questioned ur choice or ur mentallity,so i advice to stop attacking others personal likes and dislikes.if u dont like european technology,fine go and worship the Japanese.

there is no need to bring ur patriotic thoughts on a forum that relates to cars.no matter what u try to prove it will always remain a fact that Germans invented the car and that most of the new inovations still come from that part of the world.it dosent matter whose money they use.it is not that is asians had the money they would have made great inventions.

if that was so then Indian subcontinent should have reached technological milestones in 500BC.it is a pity to see that people are not ready to give the inventors the credit for what they did because their mentality has become so
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[Gurkha]

The Europeans only took what was already there, most of the advanced scientific concepts came from Asia, don't think you watch Discovery I guess, or else your perspective will change a lot. In case you need reminders, between the ancient Indians and Chinese, we have the invention market cornered when rest of the Europe was still in the Neanderthal stage. From numerals, atomic theory, medicine, chemistry, rockets and the list goes on.

What I tried to tell you was my own as well as other's personal experiences with German, US and other Euro cars, instead of respecting that, you just made them all into liars. Then you right about European supremacy, do you know, this is the same kind of statement given by KKK( don't mean the turbo guys ) and also Neo Nazis, truly uneducated behavior. Maybe you should check them out sometimes with your ideas, Mr. Metzger and David Dukes would be proud to add another uncle Tom.

This would be my last post here, instead of technical rhetoric based on rationale, a brownie boy wanna be white tries to make it into a personal Mein Kamf.

SEIG HEILL

[Samurai]

Gurkha, Steeroid, you both fall in my age category and are talking from life experiences. However you should realize you are arguing with 20 years old youngster armed with google references, and it is possible to get references to back any kind of argument from the Internet.

I suggest you two not to take this to personal level and just let it go, you guys have the maturity to do so. Let's revert back to original topic.

[merve_extreme]

Originally Posted by Gurkha

This would be my last post here, instead of technical rhetoric based on rationale, a brownie boy wanna be white tries to make it into a personal Mein Kamf.

dont cross ur limits.u are the people who bought in the cultures and nations.i have enough knowlgedge about history to decide for myself what history has to offer.

Originally Posted by samurai

Gurkha, Steeroid, you both fall in my age category and are talking from life experiences. However you should realize you are arguing with 20 years old youngster armed with google references, and it is possible to get references to back any kind of argument from the Internet.

I suggest you two not to take this to personal level and just let it go, you guys have the maturity to do so. Let's revert back to original topic.

if u find ur knowledge using google that does not mean everyone on earth does the same.Martuity does come with age but that age is not same for everyone and another thing knowledge has no age factor in it.

What I tried to tell you was my own as well as other's personal experiences with German, US and other Euro cars, instead of respecting that, you just made them all into liars.

so why do u have to prove ur experiences to me.did i ever mention u are a liar.i just wrote that information posted an websites that has a truly anti company propganda may not be always geniune.and u along with others took it this far.did i attack u personally even once so why do u have to make attacks on me.cant u just keep it to cars instead of bringing cultures and nations inside.

[Samurai]

Originally Posted by merve_extreme

if u find ur knowledge using google that does not mean everyone on earth does the same.Martuity does come with age but that age is not same for everyone and another thing knowledge has no age factor in it.

That's exactly what I thought when I was 20, but then understanding does come with time. There is no way I can prove that you, you just have to wait and see... Long wait though...

Originally Posted by merve_extreme

i know how much knowledge u have considering u wrote that vasco da gama set sail first and then colombus followed.

I will reply to this in the other thread.

[Steeroid]

Originally Posted by Samurai

I suggest you two not to take this to personal level and just let it go, you guys have the maturity to do so. Let's revert back to original topic.

Just when we're beginning to have some fun???



Jokes apart, I dont just wear my patriotism on my sleeve - I've just put down more than 10 million hard earned bucks where my mouth is...

[RX135]

If admiring solid German engineering is a slave mentality, then bashing it up just because it's German (white?) is an indicator of insecure mentality dating back to Raj days.

[Conan]

Well steeroid/Gurkha/samurai, there is a story in panchatantra,
about a toad from a well, advising about the world, to a toad from the sea....
And I agree with you guys, even i had a change of view after travelling out of the country.
But we got to give the europeans their due. After all they gave us the 'science' as we know it. They have meticulously categorised/quantified and measured everything under the sun. We just provided them the tools,
'numerals'.

Returning to the topic, the cars i prefer to own depends on the financial status....
European if i have a huge bank balance...he he..

Conan

[Gurkha]

http://www.detnews.com/2005/autosins...tos-108097.htm

If this doesn't convince, then it is obstinacy defined.

[Gurkha]

http://theoildrop.server101.com/ubb/...;f=24;t=002633

Another fine example of German engineering or should I call it rip off.

[RX135]

Gurkha, I went through both the links you have posted out of curiosity. About the consumer report, there is hardly anything new. It was already discussed at length in other threads (GTO's Merc thread). In fact, the report is old and according to 2005 JD power, Merc has moved above Honda/Mitubishi/Nissan et.al. (Only Lexus brand of Toyota is above that). In second case, it appears to be a faulty bearing issue of Porsche, which even if taken at face value doesn't amount to so called rip off. If my memory serves right, you are one disgruntled Merc owner, who is happy owning a Japnese car now a days. You can continue to appreciate/use Japanese cars, but doesnt means Europeans are straight away rip offs.

[Gurkha]

Originally Posted by RX135

Gurkha, I went through both the links you have posted out of curiosity. About the consumer report, there is hardly anything new. It was already discussed at length in other threads (GTO's Merc thread). In fact, the report is old and according to 2005 JD power, Merc has moved above Honda/Mitubishi/Nissan et.al. (Only Lexus brand of Toyota is above that). In second case, it appears to be a faulty bearing issue of Porsche, which even if taken at face value doesn't amount to so called rip off. If my memory serves right, you are one disgruntled Merc owner, who is happy owning a Japnese car now a days. You can continue to appreciate/use Japanese cars, but doesnt means Europeans are straight away rip offs.

RX-135,

JD Power is not really as scientific as CR, thats a know fact all over the industry, so Japanese cars still rule as per the latest CR/CNN Money report. JD Powers bases their ratings on average customer feedback, I should know as I have been a regular participant in the past and if you were to base it entirely on that, Maruti has done better than all others. CR updates its ratings every year,does a thorough tests of the cars, also gets extended dealer feedback and service reports, and they are as latest as you can find. In case that doesn't convince you, C&D also did a mini test and rated the Japanese best.

A US$60,000+ car which needs its engine to be opened up for service in a short time of ownership due to a faulty bearing design is not a rip off, it is rewarding customers for their loyalty.

Lastly, your assumption on my ownership of vehicles is dead wrong, read my posts carefully, you will see I have owned MB diesels with OM 616/617 series engines in past and rate them indomitable when combined with W123 chassis. I still own and drive the Gurkha which features MB made OM 616 turbo so I have nothing personal against MB or any other Euro brand but their history speaks for themselves, in a Euro biased world in US, it isn't' Japanese charm that made them win over customers, it is the sheer value and reliability as exhibited by my 130,000 miles Mazda Protege' or my 530,000 miles and still going strong 94 Accord V6, thats what gets customer loyalty. Most in US still look quite negatively on Asians and Japanese in general till now so it is quite a feat considering that inherent bias.

Now I do feel that people deserve to know every point of view and opinion and suppressing them is doing disservice to this forum unless the mods feel otherwise and in that case, I shall gladly withdraw and stop participating in this forum.

I just fail to see the logic in this country of mine of people being so rabidly Europhille almost to the term of illogic and so much hatred, bias and misinformation is vented to wards Asians in general, specially Orientals. Don't think the westerners acutally hate Orientals or do so much disrespect to the Orientals as the people in India do. Really funny considering an average westerner's perceptions on Indians is way lower than the Orientals, I should know having lived there for 17 long years.

[v1p3r]

Gurkha, maybe the world-wide dislike of Japanese cars as enthusiast's machines stems from the fact that barrind the NSX, and to some extent the Skyline GT-R, no supercar ever came from east of the Suez. There are no in-your-face-low-snarling-ripsnorting-500bhp mid-engined monsters that wear an Asian badge. Not in stock form again.

Personally, my favourite cars are the Dodge Viper, the Lambo Murci and the GT-R 34. So you know where I stand on this topic.

Samurai, Gurkha, Steeroid: While I appreciate the fact that you are all older, by atleast 10 years (I'm guessing), than us "youngsters", I would appreciate it if you refrained from bringing the age card up again and again. You may think that you are more mature, but maturity is not about how long you have lived, but how much you have learnt. If you are willing to engage in argument, please treat the other as your equal, and stop the condescending we-know-better tone.

All this philosophising...this is what happens khaali pet...time to get a beer